Axle won't go in - Page 5 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

bsharp8256 · #61 09-10-2014, 05:23 PM

I skimmed through the thread so I may have missed where this has already been done, but when I put new axles on my '72 220d around 6 months ago I did it with the diff completely unbolted from the subframe (4 19mm nuts accessible from holes in the trunk towards the front of the car). This will allow you to balance the diff on a jack and move it to the side to get them in the hubs. If I remember correctly, lowering the jack while the diff is on it helped as well. Once they're in, lift it back up and secure it to the subframe.

Stretch · #62 09-11-2014, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bsharp8256

I skimmed through the thread so I may have missed where this has already been done, but when I put new axles on my '72 220d around 6 months ago I did it with the diff completely unbolted from the subframe (4 19mm nuts accessible from holes in the trunk towards the front of the car). This will allow you to balance the diff on a jack and move it to the side to get them in the hubs. If I remember correctly, lowering the jack while the diff is on it helped as well. Once they're in, lift it back up and secure it to the subframe.

Is there a bit of space between the floor of the W114 and the top of the subframe then?

There is hardly any on the same subframe system fitted to a W123.

bsharp8256 · #63 09-11-2014, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stretch

Is there a bit of space between the floor of the W114 and the top of the subframe then?

There is hardly any on the same subframe system fitted to a W123.

I haven't ever had or worked on a W123, but there isn't much room there at all. The only way I could get to the diff nuts was through the holes in the trunk floor with a socket extention and universal joint. With the car perched up high on jack stands, anti-sway bar disconnected, and rear shocks removed I didn't have to raise or lower the sub frame at all. Also I should mention that the drive shaft needs to be disconnected from the differential before separating it from the subframe.

I happened to be replacing the rear springs at the time and was able to lower the trailing arms enough to get the springs with some careful maneuvering and light hammer strikes without a spring compressor. I can't say that it's supposed to travel that much, but spring compressors make me nervous and that's how I did it...everything seems to be fine. If I remember correctly there's a stop for maximum travel that the trailing arm was resting on when I pulled the spring out. I hope this helps.

Edit: Here's a picture of the access holes in the trunk floor. There should be plugs in there, but I destroyed mine when removing them.

http://puu.sh/buOxd/d2dfcb7030.jpg

ggenovez · #64 09-11-2014, 01:28 PM

Any tips on disconnecting the drive shaft?

Haven't done this so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

bsharp8256 · #65 09-11-2014, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggenovez

Any tips on disconnecting the drive shaft?

Haven't done this so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

You have a 2 piece drive shaft-it's held together by a slip joint. You need a 41mm and a 46mm wrench to undo it...I tried and tried to use channel locks to get it undone but eventually I just had to bite the bullet and order the wrenches (some people have gotten away with other ways of getting it loose. Mine may have been extra tight, I might be extra weak, etc.). Be careful not to let the shaft come apart or you will have to have it rebalanced (I marked it with paint on the splines). Once the joint is loose you can undo the bolts that hold the rubber donut to the diff yoke and slide the rear section of the driveshaft towards the front of the car. You'll probably need a way to pry the flex disk loose from the diff. I just allowed the shaft to hang down. I wish I had pictures of this area to post, but I'm at work now and it's rainy outside at the moment...so maybe later

You might hate me for suggesting this, but this is a good time to check your flex disks and driveshaft support bearing. My rear donut partially failed and destroyed the yoke on my original differential and I had to pull one from a junkyard. The support bearing on mine was fine, but the 40 year old rubber boot it rides in tore completely through when I collapsed the driveshaft. It's better to replace this stuff now than when you have a problem.

Stretch · #66 09-11-2014, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bsharp8256

I haven't ever had or worked on a W123, but there isn't much room there at all. The only way I could get to the diff nuts was through the holes in the trunk floor with a socket extention and universal joint. With the car perched up high on jack stands, anti-sway bar disconnected, and rear shocks removed I didn't have to raise or lower the sub frame at all. Also I should mention that the drive shaft needs to be disconnected from the differential before separating it from the subframe.

I happened to be replacing the rear springs at the time and was able to lower the trailing arms enough to get the springs with some careful maneuvering and light hammer strikes without a spring compressor. I can't say that it's supposed to travel that much, but spring compressors make me nervous and that's how I did it...everything seems to be fine. If I remember correctly there's a stop for maximum travel that the trailing arm was resting on when I pulled the spring out. I hope this helps.

Edit: Here's a picture of the access holes in the trunk floor. There should be plugs in there, but I destroyed mine when removing them.

http://puu.sh/buOxd/d2dfcb7030.jpg

That's really useful - with those holes I'd most certainly drop the differential.

ggenovez · #67 09-11-2014, 05:41 PM

So I would not disconnect here. Correct?

Stretch · #68 09-12-2014, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggenovez

So I would not disconnect here. Correct?

I assume you mean the flex disc between the propshaft and the differential?

I think you are best off removing it as you are going to have to lower the differential quite a way lower than the wheel hub position to get the distance required for the axle fit.

Stretch · #69 09-12-2014, 02:15 AM

Oh and before you start mark the position of the two propshaft halves just in case there's a bit of an accident and those parts come apart. You need to put them back together in the same place to avoid drive line vibration.

ggenovez · #70 09-12-2014, 09:30 AM

Ok,

Just so that I get this right,

Remove the 4 bolts that hold the diff in place. (attempt to install the axles)
Remove the flexplate bolts and attempt to install the axles
Mark and remove the propeller shaft and attempt to install the axles

Did I miss anything? First time doing this so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Stretch · #71 09-12-2014, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggenovez

Ok,

Just so that I get this right,

Remove the 4 bolts that hold the diff in place. (attempt to install the axles)
Remove the flexplate bolts and attempt to install the axles
Mark and remove the propeller shaft and attempt to install the axles

Did I miss anything? First time doing this so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Not quite.

Before you do anything else mark the two halves of the propshaft!

In an attempt to disturb as little as possible I would consider the following

1) Disconnect the flex disc from the differential
2) See if the ends of the flex disc will come out of the yoke - they are often stuck in there (rust)
3) If the flex disc can be removed with relative ease support the end of the propshaft (before you try to remove the flex disc) with something like blocks of wood
4) Support the weight of the differential on a trolley jack
5) Undo the differential from the subframe using those handy holes in the W114 (that don't exist on the W123)
6) Pull differential away from propshaft and flex disc
7) Consider replacing flex disc at this stage (reason given above)
8) Pull differential away from the rear end of the car so that the axles can be fitted - this will probably involve a lot of bad language sweat and tears - the sodding thing will probably wobble off the trolley jack - consider ratchet straps / tape / string to try and regain some control!
9) Don't let the differential fall off and damage an axle!
10) Once you have the axles fitted try and shove the differential back into position and button everything back up.

Easier said than done I guess.

ggenovez · #72 09-12-2014, 10:39 AM

Thanks Stretch. Hopefully it's not too bad of a job.

Can the flexplate take any hammer blows or penetrating oil?

junqueyardjim · #73 09-12-2014, 01:38 PM

Well our good friend Stretch certainly can come up with a lot of good ideas. But it seems to me there has a to a reason for this problem which remains unseen. I have removed and replaced the axles two times on the W123. It wasn't fun, but not to difficult. I also am mystified by the difficulty the PO had in getting the axle out. Have you tried for a nice easy fit in just taking the hub end of the new axle and see if that installs (straight on) that is without the sharp bends which are necessary for the final install. Have you tried to re=install the old axle? Not that you want to, but sometimes it is necessary, just to figure it out. It came out, now get it back in there. You had difficulty in pulling them out of the hub. With just one of both? I did not have that problem. A little tap with my bronze drift and they fell out. Make sure that before you pull the sub-frame that you can, with a little lube on the splines do that, get them in. Only proceed if you are positive that in a "relaxed" position the axle will go in the hub. If it won't go, it is useless to go further. Second I offer that if you had your approximate location listed on your page that by this time someone in your area would have said, "hey, give me your address and tell me when you will be there and I will be over to give you a hand." Stretch would love to do that, but he can't because he is in Holland, but then maybe you are in Holland (Netherlands) also. Anyway, put out a call for help. You can't believe how this group responds to a call for help. But if no one knows where you are, you won't get many volunteers. Anyway, until you figure out where the problem is, don't pull that subframe.

junqueyardjim · #74 09-12-2014, 01:48 PM

Also ggenovez, if you are going to call for help. make the call also in the Diesel and Technical sections of the Forum. They are probably read by more people then in the column where it is now. Diesel Section of the Forum will allow that I am sure, and of course the problem is just ripe for the Tech section.

Stretch · #75 09-12-2014, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by junqueyardjim

...But it seems to me there has a to a reason for this problem which remains unseen. ... Have you tried to re=install the old axle?...

I completely agree Jim - I've kind of given up trying to figure out why this problem exists - I just hope that something really irritating like the sealing between the axle and the differential is still going to work and that the oil doesn't pour straight out...

...something is definitely "up".

As for the old axle - he had such a hard time crow barring the bugger out I can really understand why that one is not going back in for learning purposes!