New w111 1965 220SE Blue smoke at startup - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Scutch · #1 06-03-2015, 08:21 PM

New w111 1965 220SE Blue smoke at startup-img_3549-001.jpg

Hello fellow vintage Mercedes nuts. I could use some of your expertise if possible. A couple weeks ago I bought a 1965 220SE manual in Arizona and drove it back to Colorado about 15 hours. The body is in amazing shape and overall the Benz has been pretty well maintained. It is very hard to find any rust on the underbody or anywhere on the car.

The seller said that blue smoke never came out of the tail pipe and as I was driving it home I checked on startup in the mornings and I saw none. I was inclined to believe the buyer because it is such an obvious thing to see. It definitely was not coming out stationary by revving the engine and so I kept my eye out for a couple morning startups and then forgot about it.

The car drove strong 15hrs from Arizona with not a single hiccup. After getting it back and starting to drive it around town I am now seeing blue smoke regularly, not on morning startups, but after the car has been driven and the sitting for as little as 10 minutes. It is usually one medium size puff of blue smoke lasting about 2 seconds of startup gassing. It is definitely blue smoke.

I crossed my fingers and changed the oil, put BG MOA in the oil, drove it more, to no effect. From the service receipts the car had the top end rebuilt in 2006, including new rings and pistons. Since then the car has only had 10k miles put on it.

I checked the compression warm today and here are the results.

compression test 1/130psi -- 2/120/140 --- 3/132/152 -- 4/135 -- 5/130 -- 6/140
On the sets of three numbers I added a bit of oil to cylinder before 3rd reading.

Finally my question! Is there anything that could be causing this other than the valves or valve seals needing work? Since 2010 the car was driven regularly only in the winter in Arizona and then driven one day a week during summer to keep it moving.

Not quite sure I understand why it doesn’t smoke in the morning but does after driving it. Even after driving it, sometimes it smokes, sometimes not.

Why would the top end be having problems after only 10k? It also passed emissions, which is only an idle test in Colorado.

Thank you!
Eddie

Scutch · #2 06-03-2015, 08:25 PM

New w111 1965 220SE Blue smoke at startup-sparkplug1-2.jpg

All 6 spark plugs looked exactly like this one on the left. The carbon was sooty, not wet.

meltedpanda · #3 06-04-2015, 10:43 AM

wonderful car, great find! I would suspect valve seals one or several or rings.( although your compression is acceptible)
Usually with valve seals you will see smoke when you accelerate from a start, sometimes at startup , but not always.
Does the oil smell of gas?

what weight oil are you running and what is the outside temps?

Scutch · #4 06-04-2015, 11:27 AM

I just put in 10w-40. Outside temps have been in the 70's. Will get back to you on the smell of the oil. It does not seem to smoke when accelerating from start.

Shouldn't the compression be higher for having all the compression related parts overhauled 10k ago?

Thanks

Scutch · #5 06-04-2015, 01:03 PM

I just opened the filler cap and took a sniff of the oil after driving it. It smells like gas. And that is only a few days after the oil change.

joshhol · #6 06-04-2015, 08:14 PM

These old cars have funny, sometimes grumpy characters. Perhaps it is reacting to the change in use it is experiencing. Maybe the long drive burned some gunk out.
Perhaps you aren't seeing blue smoke in the morning because the oil seeps past the rings overnight.
These are my unscientific, ignorant guesses. Maybe it will get used to its new routine and things will be fine. Keep driving it.
I'm sure someone else will actually have something intelligent to add.

meltedpanda · #7 06-04-2015, 09:07 PM

valve seal or sleeve issues drip oil into the combustion area, there it burns off as blue smoke. When she sits overnight , the oil finds its way into the oil pan past the rings, so not a lot of smoke at start up. when sitting at a light or after a short time running , the oil cannot seep back and you get the "blue smoke screen "from the red light experience.
your gas smell in the oil could be many factors, I would start with the basics, tune up , valve lash , timing ect . Then see how she does.

I read your compression post , but am confused by the numbers , is that each cylinder ?
in any respect if the values did not change dramatically between wet and dry tests I doubt your rings are of issue, unless one or more reading between cylinders are greatly different.

Scutch · #8 06-05-2015, 01:24 PM

Yes, it was each cylinder and if there was a 3rd number that was because I retested wet.

Thank you all much for the input. I am gonna take a look at the valves next week and go from there.

I will also switch to 20w-50.

Eddie

Tomguy · #9 06-08-2015, 06:17 PM

If your oil smells of gas, check the viscosity. Use the dipstick. If it runs off too quickly (should be easy to tell) your drive may have been too rich for too long, diluting the oil; this would cause the thinner oil to blow by valve seals and rings that otherwise would have no issues with retaining the oil at proper levels.