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  #1  
Old 07-16-2002, 01:53 PM
rmasteller's Avatar
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Location: Lithopolis, Ohio
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A sin or just stupid?

Hello wise ones of the 'shop,

I'm thinking about getting a 1970 - 1973 model year 280SEL (with or without the 4.5) for year round driving in central Ohio and occasional 1,000 mile round-trip road trips that could be any time of the year. This means about 3 to 6 snow "storms" of 3-6 inches per winter in a place where they use salt on the winter roads. It would also have to be used in the rain and so forth the rest of the year. Is it a sin to treat a "classic" like this? Is it stupid to think a 30 year old Benz would perform well and not get ruined if kept up well and cleaned often? I know my SL has been very reliable from a mechanical standpoint, but it only gets about 3,000 miles per year and always in good weather.

Thoughts? Better cars to use in the $4,000 to $6,000 range?

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NOW: 2017 C43 AMG, 2006 Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon, 1966 230SL, 1980 450SL (for sale!)
PAST: 2006 C230, 1997 E300D, 1994 E420, 1994 Neon Spt Cpe, 1984 300ZX, 1983 Celica GT, 1976 Electra Limited, 1984 Honda Nighthawk 650, 1979 Suzuki PE175, 1978 Suzuki DS100
www.mbca.org - www.sl113.org - www.ohio4x4.com
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  #2  
Old 07-16-2002, 02:29 PM
BlackE55
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It'll rust like there's no tomorrow, no matter how much you clean it. I drove a '63 Ford that was virtually spotless for three winters. What started out as a dime size amount of rust, turned into about 6 sq inches behind the rear wheel.

They didn't use galvanized steel back then (at least on American iron), which is a zinc coating to protect against weathering.

I washed it 2X a week, but even little scratches became oxidized within days.

If you don't care about the rust issue, go for it! Our midwest roads are simply not old car friendly in the winter anymore. ):

Issues such as a heat/defrost and traction I can't address on this car, but beware of the rust problem.

Last edited by BlackE55; 07-16-2002 at 02:35 PM.
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  #3  
Old 07-16-2002, 04:37 PM
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I read somewhere that rust prevention improved on models produced after 1974.

The words stuck in my mind as I had just purchased a 1973 model.

I was reading up about the 114/ 115 models and the cost effectiveness of using them as a daily driver.
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306D 1975 (camper) - rusting away
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  #4  
Old 07-17-2002, 04:26 PM
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Really, 1974? Well, I did write down an ad for a 1974 280 (w114). Brown/Tan, one owner, all records, 143,000 miles, new tires, $4,100. I assume it's carberated. How's that spelled? F.I. is so much easier! Anyway, this sounds like a lot for a w114 chassis, but it could be a really exceptional one. What do you think? A good winter car? Easy to maintain for an improving DIY mechanic?
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NOW: 2017 C43 AMG, 2006 Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon, 1966 230SL, 1980 450SL (for sale!)
PAST: 2006 C230, 1997 E300D, 1994 E420, 1994 Neon Spt Cpe, 1984 300ZX, 1983 Celica GT, 1976 Electra Limited, 1984 Honda Nighthawk 650, 1979 Suzuki PE175, 1978 Suzuki DS100
www.mbca.org - www.sl113.org - www.ohio4x4.com
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  #5  
Old 07-17-2002, 04:43 PM
BlackE55
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I hate to say it, but it'll still rust like mad. I see W123s around my area from time to time and they are often times very rusty. There are a few around that look clean, but I'd bet the owner tucks them away for the winter or they migrate to Florida.

If you don't mind the rust then go for it. 4 yrs down the road, bodywork will be in order and that isn't cheap unless you can do it yourself. Mechanically speaking, I don't think you have much to worry about in the winter. If traction is a problem, a set of snows will cure your ills.

I was playing with the idea of buying a late series SLC, but the rust issue crept up and the very few the were FS in WI had some body rust and worse yet, a good amount of frame rot. Yikes! I had to head south to find a clean one.
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  #6  
Old 07-17-2002, 04:55 PM
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Ted,
So, do you run your 560SEL in the snow? If I went up in price to the point of getting a loan for the car, then I would strongly consider a W126.

Rodd
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NOW: 2017 C43 AMG, 2006 Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon, 1966 230SL, 1980 450SL (for sale!)
PAST: 2006 C230, 1997 E300D, 1994 E420, 1994 Neon Spt Cpe, 1984 300ZX, 1983 Celica GT, 1976 Electra Limited, 1984 Honda Nighthawk 650, 1979 Suzuki PE175, 1978 Suzuki DS100
www.mbca.org - www.sl113.org - www.ohio4x4.com
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  #7  
Old 07-17-2002, 05:16 PM
BlackE55
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Rodd,

Yep, we drive it all year 'round. The exterior is nearly perfect, but has been partially repainted due to some minor vandalism. We also had the front and rear bumpers painted, due to some scuffs. The wife drives it 95% of the time and she's a stickler for details.

It is showing some very minor rust bubbles in the area near the trunk weatherstipping (channels) and below the rear lights in the seams. Extremely minimal-- We wash it weekly in the winter and summer. You just can't win! I've seen some '86-88 W126s on e-Bay from the midwest and some of them do have noticeable rust spots on the doors, trunk lid, even around the sunroof (??)

Anyhow, go for the 126 -- you won't regret it!! Any questions? Shoot!
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  #8  
Old 07-19-2002, 09:17 PM
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A sin or just stupid? Sounds like the perfect woman!..... Sorry, I could'nt resist.
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  #9  
Old 07-23-2002, 07:54 PM
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Rust protection improved...

...in Europe at around the beginning of the 80ies.

The seventies, beginning at about 1972 up to 1979 were just the worst years you can imagine. Definitly 1976 and 1977 were the peak. The steelmills were on strike and steel was bought from all over the place, namely Italy and Russia. Of course they did no rust protection whatsoever.

A 1976 W 123 is probably the worst rust bucket. Wait. The W 116 was even faster in rusting out. They had to fix the wheel arches after four years.

VW quitly bought their cars back after only two to three years because of dangerouse corrosion.

Generally stay away from european cars from the seventies.

Things improved in the eighties, I would say by 1984 things got sorted out.

The quality of the steel of the Mercedes from the sixties was far superior. The steel came from the Maxhütte in Bavaria. It was a special quality which was rather corrosion resistant.

If they would just have done some treatment with Dinol or another wax on all the cars....

Kind regards
Eberhard
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  #10  
Old 08-02-2002, 10:55 AM
PaulC
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As a kid in NE Pennsylvania, I recall a lot of early-Seventies W108 and W109 models developing visible rust around the rear wheel openings after about five years. In ten years, the infamous bubbles above the headlight bezels were prevalent.

Bear in mind that these cars were purchased new by the well-heeled and were usually housed in relatively warm garages during the winter months. Scenario: 1. Unwitting owner parks snow and road salt-encrusted MB in garage; 2. heat from garage and engine turns snow back into water; 3. water mixes with salt and launches electrolytic attack on sheetmetal of dubious quality. Result: Unpleasant surprises for future owners.

One of the most frustrating aspects of classic Mercedes ownership in the rustbelt is that in contrast with the (usually) brilliant engineering and craftsmanship evidenced in these cars, rust resistance is on par with a Chevy Vega.

Leave your classic MB in the garage unless the roads are dry and salt-free. As an aside, snow driving places a great strain on the mechanical components of any car, accelerating their maintenance and replacement schedule. Imagine the entertainment value intrinsic in going to your friendly-but-overburdened local transmission shop in February and asking them to find the parts necessary to rehab a thirty year-old German automatic. Brace yourself for the resultant horselaugh.

A winter driver? Early-Nineties big GM front-drive sedan with a 3.8 liter V6. 27 MPG on the highway, good snow traction, plenty of room, good power, decent rust resistance, and great parts availability. V8 W108's are not at their best in snowstorms.

Last edited by PaulC; 08-02-2002 at 11:16 AM.
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  #11  
Old 08-02-2002, 04:26 PM
j shepardson
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i agree with eberhard, the 60s are strong only rust on my 62 is right above the headlights which is very common on those models. my 83's wheel wells are starting to rust up nicely goes to show "they just dont make em' like they used to"

jeff
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  #12  
Old 08-02-2002, 04:58 PM
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I agree with Paul.

A late 80's - early 90's mid to large sized, front wheel drive GM car with the 3.8 liter V6 is a good way to go.

The company I used to work for used these cars as company vehicles for the sales reps. They purchased Olds Cutlasses, Olds Delta 88 Royales, etc. They all had the same 3.8 liter V6.

In 92 or 93, the company sold the vehicles, about 75 cars, to the employees for next to nothing as they decided to go with a car allowance instead of buying cars for them. Almost all the employees bought the car and drove them into the ground. They put on approx. 50,000 miles / year and couldn't afford to replace the cars every 2 - 3 years.

I kept my eye on these cars to see how long they would last, and on average the cars got between 225,000 - 250,000 miles until they were worn out. There is an old-timer there who won't retire. He's in his late 60's and still has the car he purchased. It is a 1988 Olds Delta 88 Royale, and he went past 300,000 miles last year. The only things that he's done to it are: trans rebuild at about 200,000 miles, and water pump and alternator changes every 60,000 miles. He changes the oil every 3,000 miles, and claims the car still doesn't need oil between oil changes.

And the best thing is the cars are worth almost nothing. Heck, a 92 Buick Le Sabre can be purchased for under $2,000.

If you read Road and Track, you'll know that Peter Egan, author of Side Glances, still uses as a snow vehicle an 87 Buick Le Sabre, and loves it.

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2001 E430, Bourdeaux Red, Oyster interior.
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1973 280SE 4.5, 170,000 miles. 568 Signal Red, Black MB Tex. "The Red Baron".
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