ditto

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ditto

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Here is a pic of the fuel pump. I think it is electric, however I'm not at all familiar with a beside the gas tank fuel pump.

Is this stock, or was this added on?

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This isn't as clear as the last photo. In the rear is what looks like another fuel filter, is that what it is? It's inline, so I'm assuming that it is.

This is what I know about what you're looking at in the *from above* photo.

If you look to the left there are three wires, this controls the choke. The wires are Gray, Blue, Black. The cill sometimes idle better when I remove this. In fact when I drove during the summer if I didn't remove it it would die everytime I came to a stop. I HAD to be giving it gas for it to run.

I believe the Brown wire is to a thermostat.

The red ground wire has fallen off. That provides a ground for the thermostat, I think.

I don't know what the thing is with the yellow wire running to it.

To the left and rear, almost in line with the choke mechanism is another vacumm intake. It runs to into the intake manifold, and keeps getting *blown* off.

Litton, could you tell me where the 02 sensor would be on this? Also where would they *brain* be?

Psfred, the only adjusment that I've been able to find is an idle adjustment screw. It is just below the thing that hs the yellow wire running to it. I sent the *from above* photo so you could see it for yourself. I think that it's a mounting nut-n-bolt.

Another angle of the fuel pump, with another in-line filter in the background?

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If a O2 sensor was fitted, it would have to be in the exhaust manifold somwhere.....probably befrore the connection to the exhaust pipe. I am only guessing here but it someone went to this much trouble one would think they transpanted everything. The brain box could be anywhere but I would bet it's not in the engine compartmant. If must be wires going from the injector(s) and they would have to go to the box. If it has a mass air flow thing, I would expect it to be connected to the air intake.

Like I say.....I am really guessing.

__________________
Litton
'90 420 SEL (sold)
'72 280 SEL 4.5
'98 ML320 (for sale)
'86 560SL
'05 Jeep Grand Cherokee Ltd (offroad in style)
'87 Chevy Blazer (AZ Pin Strips)

Yup, you got a Holley 1-barrel throttle body unit there --

http://www.holley.com/HiOctn/ProdLine/Products/FMS/FMSFI/501-12.html]http://www.holley.com/HiOctn/ProdLine/Products/FMS/FMSFI/501-12.html

There is an ECU in there, inputs are rpm (from iignition I presume), engine temp, and throttle position. On it are some adjustments. Dig around on the Holley site, they may have some manuals you can download and get this thing running correctly. I'd guess you are way rich because it's not the proper size (the application page I reference is for a 258 CC (3.1L I think) six, much larger than what you have). You should be able to get it to work, but it must be wired correctly and the ECU will need tweaking.

You need to re-connect the ground wire -- no ground = open input and who knows what fuel rate.

Did a bit more digging, they sell a manual for the throttle body systems for $17.95, no downloadable one.

Peter

__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

Obviously not going to be able to take advantage of the timing adjustment. This looks a lot like the Weber kits that they sell.

http://www.holley.com/HiOctn/ProdLine/Products/C950/C950TB/950-19S.html

__________________
Chuck Taylor
Falls Church VA
'66 200, '66 230SL, '96 SL500. Sold: '81 380SL, '86 300E, '72 250C, '95 C220, 3 '84 280SL's '90 420SEL, '72 280SE, '73 280C, '78 280SE, '70 280SL, '77 450SL, '85 380SL, '87 560SL, '85 380SL, '72 350SL, '96 S500 Coupe

That is really great! Thanks for your time.

I'll be doing some legwork in the following days(as much as can be done during the holiday brreak) and keep you all posted with the results. I'm going to figure out the part number for this and cross reference the exact model of TBI that it is. Then maybe I can get a manual and if I can't figure it out, find someone who knows Holley TBI's and try to get into top shape.

I hope that this truly is the solution to the Solex/Stromberg problem. I'd hedge my bets on this however. The car isn't running well, and apparently this isn't very common. The guy I bought it from raced Dodge darts, so this may have been HIS solution to any Carb problems. This may be the reason that he sold it so cheap also. In fact I'll look back at my past contact with him and see if I can''t trace the origin of the work.

I'll keep you all updated via this thread, unless you have any other suggestions.

Thanks again for the edumacation..........Merry Christmas

To answer your previous question, your electric fuel pump is not original. There should be a place for an engine-driven mechanical fuel pump on the left side of the engine block, foward of the motormount bracket.
I explored several pages of the Holley FI website and found two aftermarket, 300 CFM TBI injection units that looked like yours. One was listed for a 258 CID 6 cyl Jeep engine and the other for a 2.5 L. 4 cyl GM engine.
Also your unit might not have an O2 sensor as Holley listed a "Closed Loop Kit" for "Improved Driveability" as optional.
As for adjusting your injection unit, Holley mentioned an early analog injection control unit and a later style digital control unit with several "user adjustable" settings for mixture, idle, etc.... If you can trace your wiring back to some sort of electronic control unit, you may find some adustments there. Good Luck.

Happy Motoring, Mark

__________________
DrDKW

Holley finally sent me a manual for the unit.

I was able to make some adjustments to it and the car ran very well......it even idled!

I finally found the ECU......stuffed underneath the dash, just sitting on some wires. It wasn't mounted to anything, just sitting as far back as possible. With all the shaking and such it probably brushed up against something and twisted one of the adjustable knobs.

Since I just got it going today the jury will be out on fuel consumption. I also probably need someone with the proper tools to tune the thing to perfection.

I was also thinking that if I installed one of the Pertronix Electronic ignitions that I might be able to improve the car even more. What do you think?

It doesn't have a mechanical fuel pump, only the Holley pump(gravity fed).

I'm still trying to figure out which model it is. Once I find out I'll post it to this link.

It seems like this may be a viable solution to these dreaded carb problems that I'm thankfully unfamiliar with. I was wondering if this would be be a viable solution for the 6 cylinders also. Any ideas here?

Thanks again

Nathan

Actually, it's a fairly elegant solution the the Stromberg problem, and may even work pretty well for the Solex problem as well.

To properly set the fuel mixture you are going to need a CO meter, but I believe you can get close by the following:

Adjust idle mix rich so that idle speed stops increaseing, the graduall lean out til rpm drops 50 or so, then a bit more. This will get you close to the proper post-emissions idle mixture of about 1% CO.

For load mixture (if they are separate, I don't know), you will probably have to pull plugs and set the mixture so that you get tan or gray rather than black (too rich) or white (too lean). Not very precise, but hey. Or you can lean it out until you get performance problems and then rich it back up some for a starting point.

CO meter is the best way -- 1 to 1.5% at idle, 1% or so (maybe a bit richer) at load and you are set. Make sure all the sensor are properly connected!

Glad it runs better!

Peter

__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

Nathan,
Congratulations on learning the "secret" of your Holley injection. I'd wait on the Pertronix until you're sure that the bugs are worked out of your FI. I presume the previous owner removed the original mechanical pump and made/installed a blank-off plate to bolt over the hole in the engine block, in it's place. As for the rest of us running to Holley for fuel inection kits to replace our cranky carburetors, I heard that the Holley FI throttle body unit is about $1200! All my currently running Benzes have twin carbs so my conversion would be even more expensive.
I like my carbs.

Happy Motoring, Mark

__________________
DrDKW

Mark,

You're right, there is a blankout over where the fuel pump should be.

I priced the unit at Thrifty auto parts, here in Portland. They quoted me a price of $359.00 for the following unit.

300 CFM One Barrel TBI
Direct Replacement Performance TBI
EMISSION DESIGN/STREET PERFORMANCE
1982-86 GM 2.5L 4-Cyl. Engine

Part #: 500-1

I completely agree regarding installing the EI in the car right now, however I was thinking about for later. I really need to make sure that everything in within normal operating parameters before I start tweeking things.

Peter,

Thanks for the input. I'm going to find someone with a CO meter to make sure I get this right. For now though my tweeking of the ECU seems to be working.

In the manual I read that the fuel pump is supposed to turn off after about 15 seconds, this isn't the case though. It never stops running and makes me wonder if I should also test the psi on the fuel line. the manual says that it needs to maintain 15 PSI to function correctly.

Here's one more question for you. Why does my oil smell a bit like fuel? Compression is 130 in all cyclinders.

For safety, most factory fuel injection systems include an automatic fuel pump cut-off. If the ignition is left on but the engine has stopped, a relay connected to an oil pressure switch or the charging circuit or the FI computer, will cut power to the fuel pump, after a few seconds. Maybe the P O miswired the pump circuit or hooked the pump direct to the ignition.

Strong gas odor in the oil usually means the fuel system is or has been running rich and the oil has been diluted with gas. Change oil and filter ASAP and keep an eye on it. You may need to change it more often if your oil dilution persists.

I'll try ask my local autoparts stores if they have any information on aftermarket fuel injection kits. Sometimes, if I ask the kids behind the autoparts counter about anything outside of tires, filters and car air fresheners, they give me this blank look, like I just asked them about parts for the space shuttle!

Happy Motoring, Mark

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DrDKW