My understanding is that the 127.980 engine was for 58-59 220SE sedan. The 127.984 is for the 59-60 ponton 220SE coupes/converts, and also the 60-65 W111 coupes/converts. My question is what is the difference between these engines? Will one swap perfectly for the other with no mounting or auxillary system modifications? Specifically, can a .980 (sedan) engine be put into a 60 220SE convertible straightaway? Thank you very much for any help and details you can give me on this. Jim

Sign up on the Ponton Group, plenty of help there.
<http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ponton>
Ed

There is a difference in intake manifolds between the Pontons and the fintails.

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Regards

Warren

Currently 1965 220Sb, 2002 FORD Crown Vic Police Interceptor

Had 1965 220SEb, 1967 230S, 280SE 4.5, 300SE (W126), 420SEL

ENTER > = (HP RPN)

Not part of the in-crowd since 1952.

Ed, thank you. I will start to spend time on the ponton site also. Warren, thank you too. Although you point out a difference in the intake manifold (part of the injection system) does this mean that the .980 and .984 engines are not otherwise substitutable? Let's assume this: I have a 1960 220SE cab with a worn out engine (.984), but I have a virtually new .980 long block. Thus, I have the injection system and all auxillaries from the 127.984 original system. Can these be put on the 127.980 long block? Then install and bolt up the assembly to run? Thanks, again for your help. I'm fairly familiar with 190SL's (I have one for sale now), but the 126 pontons are new to me.

Also here's the ultimate ponton info site..... http://www.mbzponton.org/

Jim: Manifolds are probably the biggest difference...
MB engines of the same series are usually highly interchangeable, for example, my 4.5 uses the same rocker arms as a 3.5, 380, 420, and 560 (and others, but you get the idea). It'd probably work!

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k

Tomguy has it correct, manifold and linkage. A lot of it depends on which '60 220SE you are speaking of. Ihave a '60 ponton coupe with a.983 engine. The lat e '60 SE was the new body style. They are refered to as a 220SEb, meaning a later version.
The ponton 220SE, (W128), has a tall skinny engine compartment, while the new body is a wide and low design, therefore the different manifold and connections. I alsodo not know if the engine mounts or bell housing was modified. You can get more help on the Ponton site. Ed

Ed,
A .983 engine? Now I'm thoroughly confused! Based on my research I was convinced that the last of the 220SE ponton (w128) coupes/converts (i.e., 59 & 60) used the .984 engine. I have not seen a .983 referred to in any of the dealer's parts books, but no doubt I'm missing something. In any case, what's the difference between .983 and .984? I'm getting the (maybe wrong?) impression that the finished height of the intake manifold is lower on the later cars (w111 220SEb c/c), than on the 128 ponton. This leads to the question: would the 128 (ponton) intake manifold mount to the .984 head and then achieve the necessary clearance from the hood of the 128 ponton. Thanks to everyone who has responded with help so far. I hope this isn't inane. Jim

It is stamped on the engine tag and the original data sheet, 127.983. My guess is the difference between the 983 and 984 are the modifications for the engine compartmet. The gurus on the ponton site have a lot more back ground on this then I do, give it a try. Ed

Jim: I think I can use intake manifolds from a 560SEL on my 280SE 4.5 (they'd fit, may not have the same T/B or linkage hookups, but they'd fit)...

So yeah, it should bolt right on!

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k

Now here's an idea........ Pool on the recent "Motor Serial Number ID/108" thread is talkin about having an extra pair of highly desirable 6 cyl SOHC 280 long blocks intact at California....... And even though Jim Morris wont say where he's at - am thinkin hell yes - 1960 280SE Cabriolet anyone?

You might even disguise the upgrade, using primitive components such as oil bath air cleaner etc, and fake out a bunch of snooty concourse judges if you ever showed the car - meanwhile it would be one helluva ride.

There are no "inane" questions on model specific components at this Vintage Forum where cobblers dwell - meanwhile you should probably check out the yahoo.ponton forum, as Ed Richardson has repeatedly recommended.

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'80 300SD/ w116
'79 240D 4-spd
'71 750cc Guzzi

previously owned:

'83 240D 4-spd
'77 280SEL 4-spd
'74 280/8
'72 250/8
'65 220Sb 4-spd
'63 220Sb 4-spd
'63 190c 4-spd
'61 220Sb 4-spd
'60 190b 4-spd

Can't say as to specific ID numbers but a major difference between Ponton and W111 engines is that the Ponton engine blocks lack the center mounting pads for the engine mounts used in the W111 cars. However, engines for the W111 cars do have the threaded motor mount holes in the front of the block so they could be used in the Ponton cars.

Happy Motoring, Mark

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DrDKW