I have owned for two weeks already a W111 220S sedan, which I I am in love with.
I am trying to get the basic maintenance done, sinde I have no idea of the previous service history (of course not!! its a 64'!!!)

I already changed spark plugs filters, etc, and now I wanted to change all fluids.

I have no idea what goes inside the manual 4speed gearbox. I`ve found conflicting information on the web, stating ATF as well as some other stuff.

Can anyone help me with this? Is ATF correct for the manual gearbox?

TIA

Greetings, there are millions of enthusiastic and knowledgable Heckflosse 220Sb owners, former owners and fans on this board.

Needle bearings between gears, splines and shafts are reason given for ATF going into all MB standard 4-spd. trannies of the last 40 yrs, as stipulated in car owner's manuals which are still available from Daimler/Mercedes Benz.

Another caution on fluids is DOT 4 brake fluid, not dot 3, for the hydraulics. A question of accomodating natural rubber gaskets and seals throughout the hydraulic system. Valvoline has new "super-synth" product that meets DOT 4 standards; am dyin to try this soon on my next project - a complete brake fluid flush.

Its a very good plan refreshing fluids on your brand new Benz; maybe take a look at the rubbers next - engine, tranny, sub-frame mounts and flex-disc between the tranny and drive shaft. These rubber mounts can easily be identified as worn out by visual inspection.

And even with my old Merc which is only 25 yrs old, have got an oil squirter can filled with tranny fluid tucked away under the hood that I use for regularly soaking old nuts 'n bolts throughout the engine bay and all around the car, keeping em wet and resistant to seizure. Working with rusted, frozen nuts 'n bolts is number one problem even on the perfect vintage car for doing your own work. God forbid you ever have to pull petrified rear brake drums that have become fossilized in place.

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'80 300SD/ w116
'79 240D 4-spd
'71 750cc Guzzi

previously owned:

'83 240D 4-spd
'77 280SEL 4-spd
'74 280/8
'72 250/8
'65 220Sb 4-spd
'63 220Sb 4-spd
'63 190c 4-spd
'61 220Sb 4-spd
'60 190b 4-spd

Just in case you are still worried about conflicting evidence, I back 240DieselDog's post.

ATF is the required fluid.

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63 220S W111
76 300D W115
2013 VW JSW TDI M6

previously-
73 280 SEL 4.5
86 300E 5 speed
2010 VW Jetta TDI M6

Thank you very much !!!

The guy from the shop wanted to fill it up with 90wt
He said he was sure that was what she needed!!

I will get ATF for it.

Any recomendation on the ATF?

If it was me, I'd go with "old Ford style ATF Type 2" - or whatever its called - from the pre-dexron era of early 1970's..... thinkin new additives and fancy ingredients might not jive with old seals possibly made of materials incompatiable with modern tranny fluids.

And find another shop too...... When the guy who replaced my clutch more than a year ago proudly told me he also changed tranny fluid with fresh 80wgt gear oil, I nearly threw the guy through the window of his shop!!!

Finally, itsa cynch that anybody eager to put gear oil into MB trannies has no clue in the world about 220Sb grease-gun suspension lube points underneath, easily the most often neglected critical maintenance items on the car which should be hit with grease at least twice each year.

108 front lube points?

MB manual trannies behave very badly on 90wt oil -- sometime become impossible to shift!

Don't forget to grease the suspension!

Peter

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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

Yep, ATF is what's required. In the hey day of Mercedes sticks, my shop made many cars shift smoother by draining the 90w that was installed by the local Goofy Lube and putting in ATF. By the way I believe you have a W110 chassis. I think the W111s were all coupes. Also your car is not a 220S: it is a 220Sb. The 220S ended in 1959. Hey, don't worry. You are new here, and I'd like to welcome you to the group. Your knowledge will grow. Hopefully you will get answers to questions and will also be able to contribute. One of the best MBs I ever owned out of the hundreds was a 64 220Sb. You have a very well designed and well built car. Enjoy it. If you have any questions, just ask the group. Everyone here is always willing to help.

Peter

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Auto Zentral Ltd.

The W111's were the 220b, 220Sb, 230S and 220SEb. The Coupes were all W111's. The W110's were the shorter front versions of the W111's, for instance the 190c, 190Dc, 200 and 200D and lets not forget the mighty 230!

Watch the rust. The typical areas are behind the headlights, the trunk spare tire wells to name only 2.

Atf for the gearbox.

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Regards

Warren

Currently 1965 220Sb, 2002 FORD Crown Vic Police Interceptor

Had 1965 220SEb, 1967 230S, 280SE 4.5, 300SE (W126), 420SEL

ENTER > = (HP RPN)

Not part of the in-crowd since 1952.

Warren,

I'm going to have to challenge you on that and look it up tomorrow in my TDMs, but hey, it"s a friendly pissin contest. Talk to you tomorow.

Peter

__________________
Auto Zentral Ltd.

Bring it on!

__________________
Regards

Warren

Currently 1965 220Sb, 2002 FORD Crown Vic Police Interceptor

Had 1965 220SEb, 1967 230S, 280SE 4.5, 300SE (W126), 420SEL

ENTER > = (HP RPN)

Not part of the in-crowd since 1952.

According to my references (including the VIN on my '60 220S), the long-nose Fintails, except for the W112 300SE, were designated W111. The a, b, c letter suffix was used by the factory to identify the car's generation but the letter wasn't actually on the cars.
My '60 Fintail 220Sb still says only 220S on the trunk and dash badges.

Happy Motoring, Mark

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DrDKW

Then Heckflossen/Fintails 1960 - 1967 are classified under 3 simple serial# designations:

110..... economy model, short nose 4cyl or 6cyl sedans

111..... deluxe model, 6 cyl sedans and coupes

112..... super deluxe, 6 cyl sedans and coupes

Why am I not surprised this series of Vintage MB's, aguably the most refined vehicles of the past 40 yrs, have the most logical serial number designations of all.

warren,

I stand corrected. I concede. I just checked my 1966 TDM, one of the first printed in English, and everyone on this thread is correct. Damn, I hate it when I'm wrong. I hate it. I hate it. I hate it.:p

Peter

__________________
Auto Zentral Ltd.

Hey don't sweat it. It's trivia and knowing trivia won't get you much today.

I would love to find a nice W112.

__________________
Regards

Warren

Currently 1965 220Sb, 2002 FORD Crown Vic Police Interceptor

Had 1965 220SEb, 1967 230S, 280SE 4.5, 300SE (W126), 420SEL

ENTER > = (HP RPN)

Not part of the in-crowd since 1952.

w-111, where are you located? I am considering a '64 220S. Does yours have any rust? May I ask what you paid for yours and a brief description of the condition? If not, that's not a problem. I just want to get a feel. You can PM me if you want.
Thanks
David

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2000 Honda Accord V6 137k miles

1972 300SEL 4.5 98k miles

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