merc 560 sel - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Dhanda · #1 03-12-2003, 01:39 PM

how far can I lower my car by just changing the rubber cups above the coil springs? Someone has suggested i do this before buying lowering springs.

#2 03-13-2003, 06:08 AM

I changed to #1 pads in the front before fitting springs, didn't even notice the difference. The pad's are designed for different equipment levels, I believe the total difference in height between a 4 and a 1 is 17mm or about 2/3 of an inch. Not noticable at all.

H&R's are noticable :-)

Matt.

mbtjc · #3 03-19-2003, 02:47 PM

I think I have asked about this in a few posts before, but never really got an answer. I guess I'll try another shot at it! I was also thinking about changing pads, but was skeptical, and Matt's reply confirmed my skepticism. I really don't want a rough riding car (ie springs). Yet, I also want the front to sit even with the rear. My rear sits about right for my taste...it looks about "newer stock". It doesn't look lowered, but the fender nicely follows the profile of the tire. However...my front looks like a high rider!! I hate this! So I was thinking that my only two choices are a high-riding car with a comfortable ride....or an even car with a rough ride. Always a win-lose situation. So I was trying to figure about a way to get both. So then I thought of having only my front springs cut, perhaps like one coil off the top. I know...sounds unsophisicated and maybe a little barbaric...but in theory at least all my goals would be accomplished. Car would sit even, ride would be the same or just about the same, and it would be a lot cheaper than buy 4 new springs plus installation. Are there any huge "no-no's" concerning this?? Any opinions are welcome.

Dhanda · #4 03-19-2003, 04:23 PM

Don't cut your springs as the spring rate and travel will be altered, this could lead to untold handling characteristics and could even be dangerous.

mbtjc · #5 03-19-2003, 06:09 PM

Yeah...that is exactly what I was afraid of. I will probably just have to get springs. I have heard that Eibachs are a lot less harsh than the H&Rs, yet still even out and lower the car. So I might just have to go with those. Thanks for the warning!

#6 03-19-2003, 08:19 PM

You will probably find that the rear of your car is actually sitting too low according to the factory specs, it might look good but there should be about 2in of gap between the tire and the guard front and rear.

If the rear is too low then it will exaggerate the gap at the front.

Most of the harsh riding associated with lowered cars comes from the 17 or 18in wheels rather than the springs. Not too many people have lowered springs and standard wheels. I did my wheels first and then the springs, the ride didn't deteriate much after putting the springs in but it was noticable. The difference between stock is great though.

Cutting a single coil will not alter the height that much at all, a single coil is about 12mm so you would need to cut about 2 coils. The reason lowered springs are stiffer is to ensure that the vehicle does not hit the bump stops due to the reduced travel, it's difficult to get a compromise between shorter ride height and increased spring rates, the best bet is to go for a progressive spring that increases the rate as the spring is compressed more.

Perhaps you could look at a custom made spring, you might be suprised how cheap this option is although it might require some experimentation.

My suggestion is to find someone with H&R's and put your rims on that car and take it for a drive.

Matt.

mbtjc · #7 03-19-2003, 08:55 PM

Thanks Matt for the detailed reply. You say that my rear might be too low. How could I restore it to original height? I just replaced all 4 shocks so I know that is not the culprit. The only other thing I can think of are the subframe mounts. I already have them, just haven't installed them yet. Do you think that when I get them installed this will restore my rear ride height? I cannot think of any other influencing factors.

Just one small point of clarification...the fender is not even with the tire...there is a space...maybe 2 fingers worth. I can be sure of one thing though...from the side, the gap in the front is waaay more pronounced than the rear. You can see the shock dust boot and top of the spring clearly.

I'd love to "sample" H&Rs on a car like mine, but I don't know of any other MB nuts around here, people that actually care for their older Benzes. I see some older Benzes, but they are all pretty much heaps.

#8 03-19-2003, 09:12 PM

I take it you don't have self levelling then - if you do the ride height can be adjusted.

Replacing the subframe mounts and the differential mount should restore a part of the lost height, the rear springs will have sagged some though so you will never get it back to factory unless you replace the springs.

From the factory the car should sit level front and rear, when the rear sags this actually transfers some weight rearwards which then allows the front to ride up a bit as well. Get the rear restored as much as possible and then reassess the situation.

Good luck with your quest.

Matt.

mbtjc · #9 03-19-2003, 09:21 PM

Thank you....looks like I'll need it! You're right, mine does not have self-leveling. As far as I know, only 560s had that, and mine is a 420. Yeah, I'll see where I stand after getting that installation done.

I have read, though, that springs hardly ever actually wear out and only sag if the shock was severely shot and most of the car's weight was resting on it, and not split up with the shock. I hope the mounts do the trick.

RickM · #10 03-20-2003, 06:06 PM

MBTJC: Please keep us posted as I have the same exact issue with my newly purchased 85 380sl.

I was planning on springs and shocks.

Does your car sag like this......?

mbtjc · #11 03-20-2003, 06:33 PM

Rick: Mine sags a little, but it is not as pronounced as yours. Another thing, on mine it looks like one rear side is at a slightly different level than the other side, making it appear that has in fact sagged. Your rear actually looks slammed, where the top of the tire tucks up under the fender. My fender is still above the tire, it's just that my front sits a lot higher. As bad as yours appears to be, you may be looking at pretty much "overhauling" your rear. Since it is sagged so much, your springs may have sagged bad. So you may be looking at springs, shocks, subframe mounts, diff mounts, all bushings, etc.

Again, I'll see what installing the subframe and diff mounts do. I'm guessing it might bring the rear up a little, but not significantly. I'm pretty sure that the front will still look like a highrider. I am leaning towards Eibachs...since they are supposedly not as harsh as H&Rs, yet still lower it w/o it looking "slammed".

RickM · #12 03-21-2003, 09:33 AM

The PO spent quite a bit of money on this car. As he passed on a few years ago I can't verify what's been done until I closely inspect this weekend. For all I know he lowered the car with shorter springs.

Has anyone gone for one of the bushing kits on Ebay?

Here's the rear for $44. After that is the Front kit for $48.