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  #1  
Old 08-14-2007, 12:13 AM
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Lets have a WVO argument

Ive seen alot of people saying different things
Some say it doesnt hurt the engine, other say its horrible for an engine
And then others say further research is needed

Well, what do we know for sure?
Include any facts, descriptions of what happens and pictures
As well as any ways to make it the least damaging and still using it straight

Prove to me one way or the other

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  #2  
Old 08-14-2007, 12:40 AM
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Nobody's bothered to bench test a WVO engine because there are no standards to adhere to like ASTM 9751 for biodiesel etc. The food grade oils have so many different things dumped into it that the quality varies widely. Additionally no engine condition is the same so there are huge performance variables there.

You have a ton of issues:

Wvo has higher viscosity than #2 diesel at the same temperature so it doesn't spray well and causes poor combustion due to improper fuel atomization causing eventual coking of the internal combustion area parts translating into excessive wear and premature engine failure (cough Lovecrap). You can heat it up to 175F which is about the same viscosity as #2 which is better but then again you have food particulates and glycerin residues in the oil which then wear all of the oil lubricated engine surfaces.
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  #3  
Old 08-14-2007, 01:08 AM
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It's simple. If you want biofuel, buy it from a fuel station that sells B2-B100.

WVO was made to cook food. SVO is made to cook food. Biodiesel is made to burn in an engine. Pretty simple huh?
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  #4  
Old 08-14-2007, 01:14 AM
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I dont see the point in paying for biodiesel when its not very readily available and it sometimes costs more than diesel

Whats a good mixture ratio, diesel/wvo, to not ruin a diesel engine while still saving a considerable amount of money
half and half?
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  #5  
Old 08-14-2007, 01:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBadJohn View Post
I don't see the point in paying for biodiesel when its not very readily available and it sometimes costs more than diesel.
Where is your whole "it's better for the environment" argument? If it's better for the environment then it wouldn't it be worth paying a little extra?

And I suppose going out on your free time, collecting, transporting, filtering, treating, storing, and filling your vehicle by hand with nasty used grease is considered "readily available"?
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  #6  
Old 08-14-2007, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBadJohn View Post
I dont see the point in paying for biodiesel when its not very readily available and it sometimes costs more than diesel
To some reducing the environmental impact and dependency on foreign oil is worth more than $3/gal.

If they collected road tax for using WVO, I'd pay it or stop using WVO. I don't think there's enough usage to warrant the costs of collection so they don't bother. Is it legal? I don't see cars getting pulled over for flaunting WVO and home brewed biodiesel through numerous decals. What's illegal or at least regulated is transporting and storing WVO. But it's regulated for commercial or institutional quantities. No government agency will sell me a license to transport 5 gallons of WVO a week.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBadJohn View Post
Whats a good mixture ratio, diesel/wvo, to not ruin a diesel engine while still saving a considerable amount of money
half and half?
50/50 works for me but I don't have visions of nursing the engine to 500K miles. I start with a 200K car and know I'll tire of it or destroy something other than the engine before 300K.

Consider the other costs:

- more frequent oil changes
- more frequent fuel filter changes
- collection, filtering and de-watering

Probably adds up to $3/gal :/

Sixto
87 300D
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  #7  
Old 08-14-2007, 01:34 AM
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Not to mention the glycerin in SVO/WVO slowly whittling away at your injection system's internal parts.
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  #8  
Old 08-14-2007, 02:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixto View Post
To some reducing the environmental impact and dependency on foreign oil is worth more than $3/gal.
I make min wage and spend more than 3/5 of my income on gas. Im looking to lower that, not increase it
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  #9  
Old 08-14-2007, 02:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBadJohn View Post
I make min wage and spend more than 3/5 of my income on gas. Im looking to lower that, not increase it
That explains a lot. Everyone's goals are the same and therefore the thread was meant to justify your vantage point.

Run 50/50, change the oil regularly, and thin the mixture when it gets colder.
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  #10  
Old 08-14-2007, 02:27 AM
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Im just looking for ways to lower my gas cost each month without ruining the engine of whatever Im driving
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  #11  
Old 08-14-2007, 02:30 AM
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It is more than the cost of fuel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBadJohn View Post
I make min wage and spend more than 3/5 of my income on gas. Im looking to lower that, not increase it
While your interest and enthusiasm in Mercedes is laudable, they are NOT the cheapest car to run, dollar for mile, whether diesel, biodiesel, WVO, SVO or gasoline, taking into account reliability, durability, costs of parts, repairs and insurance and acquisition cost.

Other used cars like Toyota Corolla, Ford Crown Victoria, Honda Civic,Chevy Caprice, Mercury Grand Marquis, old pre '77 Dodge Dart/Plymouth Valiant, Subaru Outback and others like those might be worth a look, if total overall running costs are a concern, to you.

Mercedes cars offer a LOT more than those in terms of prestige, safety, durability and quality, it is true, but not necessarily in terms of dollar per mile running economy. Mercedes is after all, a luxury car, even if new ones these days are marketed on how "affordable" they are.

If you can honestly afford to buy and fuel a used Mercedes, and are looking for a one that is easy on fuel, probably a 1971-1973 220D or a 1977-1985 240 D in good shape is a good bet, but they won't be very fast.
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  #12  
Old 08-14-2007, 02:39 AM
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Old 220 Gas Mercedes

This one that just showed up today is another kind of alternative that could work, and old gasser MB that would sip fuel, with a modest cost to acquire (hopefully) so long as the rust isn't terminal

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=197021
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1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ...

1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold)

2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp

1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k

2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive (sold)
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  #13  
Old 08-14-2007, 02:54 AM
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The California Department of Food and Agriculture, Meat and Poultry Inspection Branch, WILL sell you a license to transport "inedible kitchen grease". They sold me one, and did not specify any minimum or maximum quantity. Liability insurance is required, as are record keeping and evidence that the containers can be secured in the vehicle. As for the destination of the oil, I wrote "private residence for personal use".
There is more information at Biodiesel.infopop. Steve
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  #14  
Old 08-14-2007, 02:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sbean View Post
The California Department of Food and Agriculture, Meat and Poultry Inspection Branch, WILL sell you a license to transport "inedible kitchen grease". They sold me one, and did not specify any minimum or maximum quantity. Liability insurance is required, as are record keeping and evidence that the containers can be secured in the vehicle. As for the destination of the oil, I wrote "private residence for personal use".
There is more information at Biodiesel.infopop. Steve
Don't forget to pay your California 18 cents per gallon taxes along with your license.
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  #15  
Old 08-14-2007, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by BigBadJohn View Post
I make min wage and spend more than 3/5 of my income on gas. Im looking to lower that, not increase it
Sounds like a 1.6L VW Diesel is more like the car you need.

Honestly though, why are you settling for minimum wage? Take the initiative to go out and find a good job. It's very easy to find a job that pays $14+ an hour, you just have to go get it. Minimum wage is an insult for anyone to work for, it's not worth the time.

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