Filtered, used motor oil & WVO - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

#16 09-18-2009, 10:00 AM

In the early nineties I burned all my drained engine oil in my 240D at a strength of about 10%. This was after pouring it through a home made filter made of three layers of heavy drape fabric.

No issues, and I still don't have cancer. Of course, I didn't follow the car around sucking my breath from the tailpipe. The car survived to the half million mile mark as well.

diesel don · #17 09-19-2009, 09:57 AM

I appreciate the range of replies. And in truth, half my question is only conceptual as I'm still trying to get my 'mental' arms around what happens when fuel is injected (is it burned, compressed, ignited, explosive, etc). WMO always seems to take longer to burn (like in a campfire) as compared to WVO.

Over the years one hears rumors like Ryder trucks burning it, Dole, etc.

I have enough engines and injectors to go through several rounds of replacement, yet I don't want to be stupid either (either from an environmental perspective or sheer 'minimal' cost savings)

I like the comment of the 'fetish' of diesel operators (always trying to burn alternative stuff). For me, it's all my grandfather's fault. I'm an 'old sinner' from way back (sinner by birth, choice and practice). He worked in a stainless steel factory for 30 years and they cleaned all their parts with gasoline. Every night he brought it home and poured it in the first of several, gravity-filtered 55 gallon drums.

It's not my fault.....

Diesel Don

ah-kay · #18 09-19-2009, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diesel don

I He worked in a stainless steel factory for 30 years and they cleaned all their parts with gasoline. Every night he brought it home and poured it in the first of several, gravity-filtered 55 gallon drums.

It's not my fault.....

Diesel Don

There is nothing wrong with recycling used gasoline. Actually I would have done the same. Gas prices may be a LOT cheaper then. WMO is a little different as it is best left to the recycler to blend it again.

samboyellowsub · #19 02-08-2010, 12:56 AM

I've been looking through some of the WMO threads out of interest and curiosity in the subject. I ran probably about 30 gallons of the stuff through a 616 motor (mixed) on a cross country road trip (literally, from SC coast to CA coast) and it was about 29.99 gallons too many. It was warmed first and run only after the engine was hot. I've since recovered a lot of the fouling that happened and the decreased MPGs. I know some of you have had success with it and admittedly, the oil i was using was 15w40 and I think too thick for the cold temperatures in January.
One thing that worries me from what I have read on this site (and anyone correct me if I'm wrong) is that no one has acknowledged or realized that when collecting WMO from shops, how do you know there is not synthetic oil in there? Synthetic oil is not petro based like dino lube oil and it is designed to be a lube only (Does it even have hydrocarbons in it? Is anyone here in the know on that?) If you're burning your own oil and you know what it is, then that is a little different I suppose. But motor oil to begin with is designed not to burn! and the molecules that make up synthetic oil were designed to lube and have a high film strength, etc. ... not to burn.
The best thing I have heard of so far is distilling diesel out of used motor oil. Its been done. People have built anything from backyard refineries to large scale operations to heat up the oil and condense hydrocarbons ranging from C15 through C22 or there abouts. Thats the approx range of D2 IIRC. D1 (Kerosene) is lighter and overlaps D2 on the heavier end (I think its C8 through C17 or so). Anyway, people have distilled their own diesel from it and used the heavier oils that come off to fuel the furnace. That seems like the only 'safe' way to do it (provided that your still is actually safe

). That way you get all the crap that doesn't evaporate (and therefore should never have been in your engine in the first place) left in the heating tank for disposal.

Has anyone else ever heard of this? Input?

samboyellowsub · #20 02-08-2010, 01:12 AM

P.S:
And diesel motor oils have additives that help soot control by suspending the particles in the oil so that they don't clump up and get bigger. Couldn't this also work for metal particles? The next logical progression from that in my mind is that filtering waste diesel motor oil would be less effective in getting out the small metal particles because of the additives in it to control particle clumping. Does anyone else come to that conclusion?

C Sean Watts · #21 02-08-2010, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

Motor Oil has additives and such that are supposed to inhibit burning and are not in of themselve fuel; they can not be filtered out.

No more calls, we have a winner...So sayeth those in Ashland KY, anyway.

Yes, old motor oil is used produce more oil and fuel. HOWEVER in doing so, the refineries DISTILL and CATALYZE it. The short answer is, "you can't do it at home."

samboyellowsub · #22 02-08-2010, 01:53 PM

Sean, thanks for replying. I've read some people are actually doing it at home. I imagine that they live out in the country because it seems like the process of distilling would make a HUGE stink. I'm not sure what you mean by catalyze... from what I understand. Distilling it at home is no different (except in terms of scale) than the way a huge oil refinery will distill all the different paraffins that are in crude oil. The WMO is heated up, and condensed at different temperatures to get the different grades of fuel. The heavier ones come out of vapor first at higher temperatures and as the gas moves through the condenser and cools down, the lighter ones drop out of the vapor.

I'm glad you pointed out another users comment on the fact that its designed not to burn. But still, I haven't seen anyone on these threads who still collects WMO for fuel from shops acknowledge that they have no idea how much synthetic oil they are gathering. I guess its a moot point ...

Codifex Maximus · #23 02-08-2010, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samboyellowsub

The best thing I have heard of so far is distilling diesel out of used motor oil. Its been done. People have built anything from backyard refineries to large scale operations to heat up the oil and condense hydrocarbons ranging from C15 through C22 or there abouts. Thats the approx range of D2 IIRC. D1 (Kerosene) is lighter and overlaps D2 on the heavier end (I think its C8 through C17 or so). Anyway, people have distilled their own diesel from it and used the heavier oils that come off to fuel the furnace. That seems like the only 'safe' way to do it (provided that your still is actually safe

). That way you get all the crap that doesn't evaporate (and therefore should never have been in your engine in the first place) left in the heating tank for disposal.

Yep. This would be the way to do it. However, I don't think it's economically feasible for the home brewer.

For me, the risk vs reward is not good.

Now, if I was using a Listeroid genset, I might give burning wmo a try.

Diesel911 · #24 02-08-2010, 02:23 PM

Getting WMO from a Mechanics Shop or from an Autoparts place it could also contain Antifreeze and Sulfurice acid/water mixed.

The re-refining idea sounds better than just filtration.

C Sean Watts · #25 02-10-2010, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samboyellowsub

Sean, thanks for replying. I've read some people are actually doing it at home. I imagine that they live out in the country because it seems like the process of distilling would make a HUGE stink. I'm not sure what you mean by catalyze... from what I understand. Distilling it at home is no different (except in terms of scale) than the way a huge oil refinery will distill all the different paraffins that are in crude oil. The WMO is heated up, and condensed at different temperatures to get the different grades of fuel. The heavier ones come out of vapor first at higher temperatures and as the gas moves through the condenser and cools down, the lighter ones drop out of the vapor.

I'm glad you pointed out another users comment on the fact that its designed not to burn. But still, I haven't seen anyone on these threads who still collects WMO for fuel from shops acknowledge that they have no idea how much synthetic oil they are gathering. I guess its a moot point ...

You are describing fractioning but it's only the first of many steps in the refining.
The commercial fuel we all buy is passed through different catalysts during the distilling and refining process to alter the hydrocarbon molecules (depending on what the refinery wants to make.) There is a lot more chemistry than simply collecting the distillates, not to mention the additive blending afterward.

If you want to read some more - look up 'catalytic cracking' (this is NOT my site, nor am I affiliated with it.)
BUT, I'm certain there are some people who will swear to you (and at you) that your car will ONLY run properly if you burn organically raised whale blubber boiled in linseed oil - some of them might even be on the forum! But at what point is your own time and effort worth MORE than the work and effort you've committed to avoid buying fuel?

C Sean Watts · #26 02-10-2010, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Codifex Maximus

Yep. This would be the way to do it. However, I don't think it's economically feasible for the home brewer.

BINGO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Codifex Maximus

For me, the risk vs reward is not good.

Looks like you and I have decided what our respective time(s) are worth.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Codifex Maximus

Now, if I was using a Listeroid genset, I might give burning wmo a try.

EXACTLY, And old Army 'duce' (2 1/2 ton truck) or any engine designated as 'multi-fuel.'

el sea · #27 02-10-2010, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diesel don

We've gone round and round on this before, but wondering (for the sake of recycling used motor oil) if the oil was filtered extremely well, if anyone burns 10% through their WVO as it's heated before being injected?

Thanks

Diesel Don

My brother worked for one of the large trucking firms and I asked about their fuel blends. He said they had an attachment to the oil system that pulled oil from the crankcase and injected the oil in to the fuel supply to the engine. This was timed at just a few drops per minute.
They kept the crankcase up to it proper level by an automatic system and with this they could truck 100,000 between changing all the fluids in the big rigs. At that time they would use the oil fluids to burn in the oil heaters.

I have seen write up of not to exceed 5% used oil to your fuel.

When I am called to clean a fuel tank on an old sailboat (the old salt would sometimes dump their used oil in the fuel tank while at sea) I sometimes find a large deposit of CRUD at the bottom.

Good Luck

deejaaa · #28 07-06-2010, 10:06 PM

i burned it in my truck for 6 months, saved a lot on fuel cost, but...... i ended up going through 3 sets of glow plugs, a set of injectors and heads that had a buildup of carbon that had to be knocked off w/ a punch. i would run it through a 20, 10 and a 2 micron filter w/ a powerful magnet. it ran good other than that.
now i am much more informed. i will run it through a centrifuge, 15 gph and be done. i will get it for free now where i was paying a dollar a gallon before. i spend 6000.00 a year on fuel right now and think i can get a kit centrifuge going for under 500.00 so it won't take long to step up to a 6000 rpm monster.
as far as oil getting past the rings/seals and smoking like a train, any time extra fuel is put into an engine, it will come out as smoke: that's unburned fuel. cut back on the fuel screw and watch the smoke disappear.

oldsinner111 · #29 07-07-2010, 07:35 AM

I ran wmo up to 25%,my best mileage was 37 mpg on this mix.
However it stinks like you need rings,so I quit.I've run watf at 25%,now thats pure fun with power.Now my wvo I stay under 70% mix.Why do you ask?With studies done at Universities,70% caused no ill affect with Cold Vo. I heat mine so I figure carbon will be minimal.