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  #1  
Old 09-25-2004, 11:35 AM
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Would a TB Prevent Runaway Diesel?

Hi all-
I have a recently acquired '76 300D (W115 Chassis), and have taken note of how utterly simple the air intake system is- nothing more than a large filter cannister behind the passenger side headlight connected to the "log" manifold via a long air hose. I am having difficulty sourcing an air filter locally for this, however, and if NAPA can ever finally get one in for me it's going to cost almost $40. The price and difficulty of getting the paper filter has me almost convinced I should put on a custom K&N setup- if ever there was a simple K&N conversion, this would be it. However, I've read the varying opinions on this forum's K&N Threads, so the jury's still out. Might be better with custom oiled foam instead, according to what some of you are saying.

But the main question I have is concerning the chance of Diesel runaway, which is also well covered in this Forum. There seems no "safe" way to make a Diesel roaring away at 6000 RPM on it's own motor oil shut down- it seems to me while you're trying to undo the air intake pipe so as to block it with something other than your hand under such scary circumstances would be too late, and the danger of having engine parts flying at your face too great. So I was wonderin -as I contemplate modifying my intake anyway, would there be anything wrong with putting a simple Throttle Body into the intake pipe, leaving it wide open for running, but with a lever on top to close it if ever necessary? One could even put on a "choke knob" on the dash to enable a safe shutdown whilst still in the car.

Any thoughts?

Dave

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  #2  
Old 09-25-2004, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coldwar
So I was wonderin -as I contemplate modifying my intake anyway, would there be anything wrong with putting a simple Throttle Body into the intake pipe, leaving it wide open for running, but with a lever on top to close it if ever necessary? One could even put on a "choke knob" on the dash to enable a safe shutdown whilst still in the car.
The Old style OM616 does have a butterfly valve (TB) that is used for shut-down. A more easy method is to place a CO2 fire extinguisher in the engine bay. IF a runaway were to occur (VERY rare), all you would have to do is point it at the filter opening. You could even make an emergency "rip cord" in the cab if you are that worried. This would displace the air in the intake and we all know how well CO2 burns.

Nobody says you MUST use K&N. Shop around and look at some of the Fram paper filters. They have so many choices that you cant help but find one to match whatever custom intake you can imagine (I use a Fram 8009 filter on my setup).
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Old 09-25-2004, 12:26 PM
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By the filter here at FastLane, NAPA is gonna have fits finding it.

A K&N is gonna be a problem too, for the same reasons. You could use an oil bath from the 220/240 if you wanted too, but I don't think you will have any improvements from doing so.

The butterfly in the intake is the vacuum governor, and the weighted flap is the anti-backrunning valve (diesels, in fact any direct injection engine, will run backwards if started that way -- and compression "bounce" can do it -- on manny trannies a panic stop without getting the clutch in fast enough or stalling it by "popping" the clutch can start the engine up backwars). Engine won't run that way long as the oil pump will work backwards too!. Later IPs I think won't let the engine run backwards, this feature isn't present past the vac governor type engines.

Peter
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Old 09-25-2004, 12:52 PM
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WIX filter #46290 , list for $31.51

If you can't find it locally, just about any parts house should be able to cross a WIX number to something else.
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Old 09-25-2004, 01:51 PM
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These are gonna be hard to find and expensive, only used in the 68-76 W114/W115 chassis as far as I know. Possibly older models (I don't know when MB changed to paper from oil bath on the gassers). Needless to say, the market isn't exactly huge anymore!

Peter
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Old 09-25-2004, 03:41 PM
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Our old shrimp boat's Detroit 4-53 had an air flap cut off...I guess it would have worked if it had fully sealed and if the intake hadn't had a lot of leaks.

Basically, all it did was drop the rpms aboot 20% and make even more blue smoke come out the stack.
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Old 09-25-2004, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Leo
Our old shrimp boat's Detroit 4-53 had an air flap cut off...I guess it would have worked if it had fully sealed and if the intake hadn't had a lot of leaks.

Basically, all it did was drop the rpms aboot 20% and make even more blue smoke come out the stack.
Hmmm- just had another idea- maybe a Jacobs Engine Brake would do the trick! Also, here's a quote from a grizzled old Diesel mechanic I discovered in my town- he says "All a Detroit engine is good for is converting Diesel fuel into noise!"
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  #8  
Old 09-25-2004, 07:52 PM
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Exclamation Yes..

A throttle plate that seals will kill a runaway diesel.
The qualifier is "SEALS".....
If it fails to seal, it will only slow the engine, until it sucks all the engine oil out and seizes.

A CO2 with remote or a prepared driver with a CO2 extinguisher will work as well or better.

Last edited by whunter; 09-25-2004 at 08:49 PM.
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  #9  
Old 09-25-2004, 08:20 PM
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I'm not a diesel owner & never worked on them but I've heard of the runaway diesel running on its own lubricating oil. How often does this happen? Is it a valid concern for a typical diesel owner, or mostly imagination running away?

Has it happened to anyone on the list?
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Old 09-25-2004, 08:49 PM
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Yes, mplafleur, Larry Bible and me at least..

Quote:
Originally Posted by nglitz
I'm not a diesel owner & never worked on them but I've heard of the runaway diesel running on its own lubricating oil. How often does this happen? Is it a valid concern for a typical diesel owner, or mostly imagination running away?
Has it happened to anyone on the list?
It is real life not paranoid delusions.
It happens just often enough to keep the horror stories of junked engines alive.

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