Diesel Vehicles Are Homicidal - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

jay123 · #1 02-23-2005, 06:19 PM

Just saw this article in my local paper: Tampa Tribune MoneySense 2/23/05:

Group Blames Diesel

Emissions from old diesel engines cause more than 20,000 Americans a year to die sooner than they would have otherwise, an environmental group estimated.

An industry group criticized the findings as outdated and misleading.

The environmental group said it based its figures on the most recent government emissions data - from 1999 - and from public health studies of the effects of various types of air pollutants. Conrad Schneider, co-author of the report, said regulations designed to make new diesel engines cleaner don't affect millions of older vehicles.

Also found similar stories on Google:

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ned=us&q=diesel+emissions&ie=UTF-8

So, does this mean that anyone who drives a diesel powered vehicle is an accomplice to murder? I wonder if an attorney out there will be receiving tag numbers of diesel owners to be sued by some Dumb-Ass who won a case with Mickey Dees for spilling coffee.

aklim · #2 02-23-2005, 06:29 PM

Repost 1

Repost 2

#3 02-23-2005, 07:35 PM

I read the same thing in the local newspaper here in NJ.

It's strange that they never mention what the annual death
rate is for gasoline exhaust gasses.
Or do a side by side comparison of the two.

Louis.

Direct link or just look below.

http://www.bergenrecord.com/page.php?qstr=eXJpcnk3ZjczN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXkzJmZnYmVsN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXk2NjU3Mzk2JnlyaXJ5N2Y3MTdmN3ZxZWVFRX l5Mg==

N.J. ranks second in diesel risk, report says

Wednesday, February 23, 2005

By COLLEEN DISKIN
STAFF WRITER

Diesel exhaust from buses, trucks and trains causes more than 21,000 premature deaths a year nationwide, an environmental group estimated, and New Jersey residents are breathing some of the worst of the pollution.

New Jersey ranks second, behind New York, in long-term cancer risk from being exposed to diesel emissions, said the report released by the Washington-based Clean Air Task Force, which compares the number of linked deaths and illnesses in the 48 continental states and the District of Columbia.

Bus- and truck-clogged Hudson County has one of the worst exposure risks - fifth among 3,109 counties nationwide. Bergen, Passaic and Morris rank 24th, 38th and 85th, respectively.

"It's clear from these numbers that there is a greater cancer risk for New Jersey residents, and it's clearly worse for those living in urban counties like Hudson," said Kim Gaddy, organizer for the New Jersey Environmental Federation.

Using Environmental Protection Agency data from 1999, the most complete year available, the report said diesel fumes caused 880 premature deaths in New Jersey, 1,382 non-fatal heart attacks and 17,926 asthma attacks among adults.

State advocates say the report points to the need for New Jersey to pass pending legislation that would establish a fund to retrofit large privately owned fleets of diesel vehicles with pollution-trapping filters and other equipment. The filters can cost a few thousand dollars per vehicle.

Raising the $24 million needed in the first year would be tricky in the current budget climate. Eventually, as much as $120 million might be needed to retrofit the large fleets. One possible source of money could be natural resource damage claims the state Department of Environmental Protection collects from polluters, said Assemblyman John McKeon, D-Essex, the chief sponsor.

A proposal to raise the tax on diesel to pay for the retrofits has been abandoned, he said.

McKeon said the task force's report will help validate the legislation's goal of reducing diesel emissions in New Jersey by 20 percent.

School buses, which can fill with polluted air when idling with the doors open, won't be targeted under the bill because they have to be replaced with newer models every 10 years, McKeon said. "We are aiming to fix the vehicles that will be on the road 20 years or more," he said.

Starting in 2007, federal rules will require cleaner-burning diesel engines as well as cleaner fuel. But the requirements being phased in over 25 years will apply to new vehicles only, which critics say won't clean the air quickly enough because the average diesel vehicle remains on the road for as long as 30 years.

The diesel industry, however, criticized the group's report for using data from 1999 that doesn't take into account the many improvements already made in newer diesel engines.

Since 1994, engines have been manufactured to operate smoke-free, and tailpipe emissions from trucks and buses sold today have been reduced by more than 80 percent compared with engines built in the late 1980s, said Allen Schaeffer, executive director of the Diesel Technology Forum, a group that represents diesel engine manufacturers and diesel refiners.

Schaeffer pointed out the logistical difficulty in retrofitting all of the 13 million diesel vehicles on the road.

"This equipment does not work uniformly on all vehicles," Schaeffer said. "The last thing we need is to put out some technology that doesn't work as it's supposed to."

But clean-air proponents say the federal government needs to take the initiative by helping to fund improvements to publicly-owned fleets of trucks and buses, especially on school buses.

"There is technology available today to reduce this risk by 90 percent," said Conrad Schneider, advocacy director for the Clean Air Task Force. "We do not need to wait."

* * *
Exhaust takes

toll on health

N.J. adults:

880 premature deaths

1,382 non-fatal heart attacks

17,926 asthma attacks

N.J. children:

541 asthma ER visits

26,958 respiratory ailments

1,290 cases of acute bronchitis

Source: Clean Air Task Force, estimates based on 1999 health statistics

whunter · #4 02-23-2005, 09:04 PM

If they keep going, it will shut down the USA.
Last report I read, the idiots wanted to ban all vehicles over two tons.
Any fool can write drivel, but a smart person knows how to research and make their own decision.

phidauex · #5 02-23-2005, 09:36 PM

Boy, it sure would be great if we had something around right now that would lower the harmful emissions of those vehicles by more than half.

Oh wait, we do.

Biodiesel!

peace,
sam

oilslick · #6 02-23-2005, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay123

Emissions from old diesel engines cause more than 20,000 Americans a year to die sooner than they would have otherwise, an environmental group estimated.

What a way to go

Kevin

boneheaddoctor · #7 02-23-2005, 10:39 PM

Hard to answer this in an acceptible manner except the people who dreamed that up obviously have way too much time on their hands and need to get a real job.

Tirebiter · #8 02-24-2005, 11:43 AM

That sounds like an acceptable number to me....... as long as we get to choose who dies, eh?

Jim Anderson · #9 02-24-2005, 11:58 AM

Homicidal but not suicidal. I've never heard of anybody committing suicide by sucking diesel fumes.

They're using 5 year old data

Think of what the fastest PC was 5 years ago.

Californian · #10 02-24-2005, 12:02 PM

Yesterday, I was driving in the city, with the windows down, and all of a sudden, I notice a lot of white smoke, I thought "uh oh". It turned out, the car next to me was fuming a bit out of the exhaust in the back, with liquid dripping down the street . Looks like a 20 year old Nissan Wagon of some sort.

That's when I realized my diesel burns a lot cleaner.

Nautilus · #11 03-21-2005, 02:13 AM

The reports suck for two reasons:

1. the most toxic gas produced by internal-combustion engines is carbon monoxide(CO), which Diesels don't produce;

2. a large part(9-17%) of Diesel exhaust is oxygen.

Diesels are far cleaner burning than carburettor gasoline engines, yet the population is easily duped to believe the opposite due to the black smoke most older Diesels make. Which smoke, incidentally, is mostly harmless, being carbon (all living organisms, including humans, are made up of carbon).

~Nautilus

willrev · #12 03-21-2005, 06:52 AM

I have asthma and often get asthmatic bronchitis. I drive my old diesel and it never bothers me. Cutting grass - now that kills my allergies. I like the occastional whiff of diesel exhaust except when out at sea offshore fishing and hanging over the back of a sportfishing boat half seasick and breathing the fumes. That's the only time the diesel fumes have made me puke. But they don't have ANY emissions controls on those engines. And when they don't exhaust totally under water, you get full fumes. Oh well, I just fed the fish and went back to fishing.

I think these environmental wackos have it wrong. Clean burning diesel combined with hybrid technology could save the planet. I want a car that will get 100mpg. I think a diesel hybrid could do it!

TwitchKitty · #13 03-21-2005, 11:23 AM

Read about old coal-fired power plants if you want to see who the real polluters are. They have convoluted legislation for years to avoid having to clean-up their emissions. One of their ploys was to junk old cars and buy the car's rights to pollute. They would love to junk your diesel and buy its rights to pollute also.

boneheaddoctor · #14 03-21-2005, 11:29 AM

Deseil drivers are homicidal if gasser drivers and tree huggers don't mind their own business.................

aklim · #15 03-21-2005, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willrev

I have asthma and often get asthmatic bronchitis. I drive my old diesel and it never bothers me. Cutting grass - now that kills my allergies. I like the occastional whiff of diesel exhaust except when out at sea offshore fishing and hanging over the back of a sportfishing boat half seasick and breathing the fumes. That's the only time the diesel fumes have made me puke. But they don't have ANY emissions controls on those engines. And when they don't exhaust totally under water, you get full fumes. Oh well, I just fed the fish and went back to fishing.

I think these environmental wackos have it wrong. Clean burning diesel combined with hybrid technology could save the planet. I want a car that will get 100mpg. I think a diesel hybrid could do it!

I have the same thing. I sued to get it when I was a kid about once a month. Now in colder climates I get it only in the summer. Somehow I think your allergies are designed to get you out of cutting grass.

If you want, I do know that my friend drives a Kubota tractor to cut grass. It has a diesel in it.

My allergy is with the crabgrass preventer. It makes me itch like a SOB. Then the fun begins. If I catch it soon enough or if I take a Claritin prophylatically, I'll be fine. Don't forget, the gas engine is just venting to the atmosphere like the boat engine. In a car, it goes thru a catalytic converter so the exhaust is cleaner unlike your lawnmower. Actually, I never cared for either diesel or gas exhaust fumes. Both make me dizzy when I am in the garage running the engine in the winter with the door cracked open. Personally, I prefer the gas fumes if I had to choose between diesel and gas.

I wouldn't. I'd have to give up a lot of mass and probably have a transvestite engine in a FWD car to achieve that. No thanx. I won't pay more than $10 for a running FWD car. I am more used to the way a RWD slides around especially in the snow. Since all my cars are RWD, I don't want to get used to the way some wierdo car handles. I wouldn't own a car under 3000# either. Too light for my tastes. Slides too easily. Further to that, I saw what the Honda Civic looked like after it rammed me in the driver side door of my C280. Thanx but no thanx.

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