I am looking for info to help me set Inj Pump timing - I hope to avoid pulling the IP again. Background - 83 300SD w/ 112K, from Ebay back in Nov, my third 617. It ran extremely well - I've driven it about 2K miles, and it looks great, but it was a bloody mess under the hood. Neurotic that I am, I have had it down for about 3 months while I've worked my way through the engine compartment, undoing God-awful corrosion, oil leaks and every typical problem known to a 617, compounded by sheer neglect. I did adjust the valves, tending to err on the loose side if at all, as they all seemed very tight to me.

R&R'ed the IP to renew the mounting gasket - didn't disturb the engine and tried to carefully line the IP back up just the way it was, but I must have gooned it up. Now it will just start, but I have to apply full throttle to keep her lit - only attains about 1500 rpm, and dies if I back off even a little. Lots of white smoke and the rich smell of unburned fuel. I've loosened and moved the IP once, toward the block enough to make it necessary to rebend the injection hard lines a bit, but no change at all in how she runs. Tried to check IP timing via el drippo method, but I really can't say I'm confident of results. I will try the "well up" method next, but before I do, just want to ask if anyone can correlate exhaust smoke color or the low max rpm condition to IP timing. In other words, I would like to know if I'm likely off in the "push toward" or "push away" from the block direction before I try to set IP timing again. I'm surprised that it can be this far off - I would have expected no more than a one or two spline misalignment due to clumsy R&R. The intermediate drive collar came off with the pump and I didn't pay much attention to how it went back in, but I don't think it could impact IP timing, regardless of how it goes in. I really don't want to pull the IP again... appreciate any thoughts on how to proceed or anything I may have missed. Thanks, BigMac

You need to do the drip timing once more. Look for the last degree at which you get full flow out of your drip tube by priming the hand pump. That's your timing point. Make sure the IP is at full throttle, your vacuum shutoff is disconnected, and the first 2 cam lobes are pointing up while doing the test.

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2004 VW Jetta TDI (manual)

Past MB's: '96 E300D, '83 240D, '82 300D, '87 300D, '87 420SEL

I switched pumps on a motor for the transmission to shift with vaccum but now runs rough and smokes horribly when started, but after it warms up awhile idles ok with a miss once in awhile, I do not know if the pump I installed was any good or not however. I've pushed the pump towards the motor and ran little better. I aligned marks on the pump and set motor at 24 btdc with lobes up. The motor I put in is a year older german import that ran fantastic with the original pump, but have a later model transmission in my 80 td.

Not much progress to report, but thanks for the inputs. I believe I am getting close on the IP timing, ran it about 10 minutes - mucho clatter and white smoke, so I know I have the valves too loose. Now I'm now distracted by a gusher from the turbo oil return pipe - lower section. I installed a new one in this idiotic quest to stop all leaks, and it thanked me by immediately producing a 10" puddle. Fastest leak I think I've ever seen. I'm pretty sure I had the new grommet and O rings in correctly, so I guess it is another bad OE pipe - I bent it getting it out so I can't tell for sure. BigMac

Diesel Addict (and anybody else) - Clarification please - regarding your note -"Look for the last degree at which you get full flow out of your drip tube by priming the hand pump. That's your timing point." Do I bring the engine to 24 deg BTDC (+/- 1 deg) and then swing the IP away from the block, while pumping the hand pump, until I find the spot where full flow (steady stream -no drips & drops?) stops? Step by step instructions would really help.

Right now, the IP timing is clearly wrong - engine will start only with almost full throttle applied, and once warm, it lopes badly and only barely idles, smells like raw fuel in the gray cloud behind the car, and it clatters like hell. I now have the IP set at the point where fuel first "wells up" into the bottom of IP bore where the #1 fuel element/delivery valve go - with the engine at 24 deg BTDC. That sounds like too advanced a setting, in view of your comments. I gave up on using a drip tube because it seemed like the flow was more dependent on how fast I pumped than the IP's position, but I can try it again if I better understand the procedures. Thanks, BigMac

I have no idea what this " wells up" deal is.... did you get that from some publication or just some post ?

The manual has a high pressure method and a low pressure method... the low pressure method calls for a one second per drip at 24 degrees btdc.
You don't have the equipment for the high pressure method... why don't you use this low pressure procedure and see if that works ?
You should find the proper procudure written out.. I am just hitting the highlight as it compares to what you are describing..
For instance, are you wiring the throttle full open when you do this ?

You got the procedure wrong. You don't touch the IP while checking the timing. Be sure to remove the delivery valve and spring from the #1 IP element before doing this, then reinstall the element and attach your drip tube or injector pipe. Make sure it's at a slight incline. When I said last degree at which you get full flow I meant last degree on the crankshaft balancer, i.e. your start at about 30 deg BTDC, pump the fuel and observe the flow, and repeat at 28, 26, 24, 22 and so on until you no longer get full flow. You'll have to rotate the crank very gently to get it to change by 2 deg. Never rotate backwards as that will mess up your reading. Let me know if this makes sense.

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2004 VW Jetta TDI (manual)

Past MB's: '96 E300D, '83 240D, '82 300D, '87 300D, '87 420SEL

That is what you want. Sounds like your timing is set!

Thanks for the quick replies, gents. DieselAddict - your procedure for checking the IP timing does make sense - I'll try it tonight and see if I can confirm where the timing is now set.
Leathermang - I'm working from this write-up:
http://business.baylor.edu/Richard_Easley//autofaqs/iptiming.htm
It made more sense to me than the one drop per second method for setting start of delivery, and yes, I have the linkage wired full throttle, vacuum disconnected. Thanks again, BigMac