Hi Guys,
I tried to search and cant find a lot, but Rag Doll has a LOT of Negative Camber, I mean EXTREME. Has anyone had experience on what causes it? I talked to an Indy and he said the front springs get old and sag, causing negative camber. I dont see the sagging in the springs, so I could be wrong, but before I go and get her aligned, I'd like to know what I'm up against. She has new Tie Rods, Idler Bushings, and Drag Link, so the front end is tight, I need to get it into a shop, just dont want to go in and do an alignment only to have to do it again in 3 mos. But I guess I'll bite the bullet for now.....

I'd like to see waht your answers are to negative camber!
Thanks
Wes

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91 350SD
14 F150 Eco
19 Fusion Hybrid
11 GT500

normal. a lot is not. could be some tired bushings or tired springs. if it drives right and isnt wearing the tires funny i would not worry about it. personally.

it will make it corner better!

tom w

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Negative camber is not normal.

The upper control arm bushings are a likely cause of your problem. I had the same problem until I replaced the upper control arms.

I had a lot of negative camber and my tires were wearing badly. I replaced the upper control arms (EASY!), and 80% is corrected. Now I need to rebuild the lower arms to correct the rest before I buy new tires.

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'83 240D with 617.952 and 2.88
'01 VW Beetle TDI
'05 Jeep Liberty CRD
'89 Toyota 4x4, needs 2L-T
'78 280Z with L28ET - 12.86@110
Oil Burner Kartel #35

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b1...oD/bioclip.jpg

Thanks for the replies. Looks like I'll be ordering upper control arms, then get her aligned. I can't wait to have a straight wheel again! Paint next!!


Dub

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91 350SD
14 F150 Eco
19 Fusion Hybrid
11 GT500

don't forget the inner bushings adn the sway bar bushings you need with a new Upper control arm.....

4 of each of those bushings....

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Proud owner of ....
1971 280SE W108
1979 300SD W116
1983 300D W123
1975 Ironhead Sportster chopper
1987 GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 Diesel
1989 Honda Civic (Heavily modified)
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Section 609 MVAC Certified
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"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

I'll second (or fifth) the notion of UCA.

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1989 300E 144K

Hey Guys, thought I'd update, since I search a lot and people don't follow up on their posts, I thought I would update what happened.

I ordered and installed new upper control arms and sway bar bushings this past Saturday. Even without the alignment, I could recognize that the negative camber was gone. The control arm bushings were definitely shot, rubber was worn out and you can tell they were sitting against the arm for a while.

Took the car over and got it aligned this morning at Southwest Wheel Alignment (came recommeded by Indy) and they had it done in 1 hour, funny seeing my car on an alignment rack right next to a CL600 getting aligned as well.

Well she tracks straight and feels absolutely great! Handling isnt great, but feels so much safer now. I know its not a sports car, but I expect to handle like a benz. Little by little im getting there!!!

The guy was suprised I did all the front end work myself, and he was actually kinda happy that I 'knew my way around these cars'. I acutally told him about the box adjustment (backwards from other cars). He did advise that I will need lower ball joints and lower control arm busings at some point. Gave an estimate of around 500. YIKES!

ANyway, thats it, the Upper Control Arms fixed the Camber!

Thanks to everyone for everything!
Dub

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91 350SD
14 F150 Eco
19 Fusion Hybrid
11 GT500

I can't remember if it's negative or positive, but i had serious camber problems because of lower control arm bushings the uppers were fine but the lowers were shot. anyway I learned from owning VW super beetles that if you don't fix all the front end problems the newer parts will wear faster than normal because of extra vibration from the worn parts. I would think this holds true on all cars
In other words get new lower ball joints and lower control arm bushings pronto

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Jason Green
1977 240D AUTOMATIC the Beast
1974 Super Beetle



Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.
- Mark Twain, a Biography

I hear ya, Its easy to replace things when money flows easy

I'm doing a little at a time. THe lowers will be done as soon as I have funding.

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91 350SD
14 F150 Eco
19 Fusion Hybrid
11 GT500

this is one case were the more you do the better off you are - as the whole system as to work together to work well...and the new parts will take a premature beating from warn older parts....

another place to look is the front eccentric pin in the lower housing for the lower control arm....how are they aligned?

- ball joints - for a diyer are easiest to cut out and you will need a press to push them back in - it is a little tough - but not too hard - we all will / can help you there...lca bushings are nothing - in and out...now the rear bushings for some reason are a bit harder as they seem to stick...but the fronts are nothing to do...

glad to here it is tracking straight for you - i can not wait until spring to be driving my W123 again!!!

Jake

negative camber is cool.





on vw beetles

RedassigOO, sounds like you lucked out. I am doing mine also, started Friday, and couldn't get the inner bushings and the big bolt out (both sides). Saturday I went to see my buddy Ned, who had a bigger hammer and a longer drift. Used a lot of JB Blaster and really laid it on those bolts, both sides the same. I even hooked up the big bolt to the battery and gave it a good "heat up" and more Blaster. Sunday PM went back for another go at it. Had my son John along for reinforcement and together we beat on those bolts. The passenger side would turn with some effort, the driver side would turn with extreme effort. Well we gave up tell Monday and then I determined it would have to be either the torch, (ox/acetylene) or the sawszall. My son in law has a good torch and a good selection of sawszall also. I decided to go for the torch. It was a bit messy, lots of smoke and stink, and hard on the eyes. But in less then an hour both of them were on the ground. Should get it put together this afternoon.

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Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!

Jim, did you remove the sway bar from the control arm? I did that and then was able to move the arm around quite a bit, manipulating the bolt out. When I reinstalled, I put the bolt in from the front vs the rear, since its hard to do, (mercedes started doing the bolt from the back in 1980 or so), but it was easy from there. Good luck, let us know how it turns out!
Dub

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91 350SD
14 F150 Eco
19 Fusion Hybrid
11 GT500

I 'm about to burn through my second set of 15 dollar junkyard tires, I put on new tie rods because the were worn, and also cause it was easy. but it didn't help much. Upgrading to a wider 15 inch tire has made the inside edge wear much more pronounced.

I was quoted 380 for ucas in wash dc.

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Cheers,
Robert