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  #16  
Old 01-04-2007, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRIESL View Post
Does the 603 have the similar head design as the 617? I think what causes a person so much fear when looking real close at the head, contemplating removing the thing is that there is this lack of ability to get to the bottom sprocket. It is housed in what many here on this forum seem to call the "abyss." My 617 is stripped down to rockers, and I'm going in for the job, but I got to tell you, the abyss scares the crap outta me. A slight indescretion and a weekend job turns into an engine rebuild.
The trick to the game is not to end up in "the abyss".

To avoid this fate requires that you always keep upward tension on the camshaft sprocket. This is best done with bungee cords and an overhead beam.

When the head is first lifted off the block (get an engine hoist), you shove some welding wire through the chain at the very top of the block to prevent the chain from falling. Naturally, you must unhook the bungee cord to get the head over the top of the camshaft sprocket. The welding wire prevents the chain from falling into the abyss at that time.

The abyss also is fond of grabbing two of the four small cap screws that secure the front of the head. Two of them are inside the timing chain cavity, and one mistake, or one slip, and the screw is down the abyss. Don't use anything but one of the flexible claw tools to start and remove these screws.

The abyss is also find of grabbing the camshaft thrust washer when you pull the sprocket off the cam. If you don't block the camshaft at the rear........it will slide backwards in a split second and the camshaft thrust washer (directly behind the camshaft sprocket) will fall into the abyss.

All these little tidbits are not in the FSM, however, and that's what makes the process a bit dangerous.

My strong advice is to GO SLOW and stop when you get tired or frustrated. Catastrophe is the next thing that will occur.

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  #17  
Old 01-05-2007, 09:34 AM
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nhdoc, thanks for the write up, that is awesome. Where does one buy that $15 subscription, that sounds like monies well spent.
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  #18  
Old 01-05-2007, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by SpeedRacer View Post
nhdoc, thanks for the write up, that is awesome. Where does one buy that $15 subscription, that sounds like monies well spent.
You'd be much better off spending a little more money and getting the FSM.
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  #19  
Old 01-05-2007, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by SpeedRacer View Post
nhdoc, thanks for the write up, that is awesome. Where does one buy that $15 subscription, that sounds like monies well spent.
alldata.com...you buy a subscription for each car you own for one year. You can then access the same database that most techs use and follow - it is copied directly from the MB WIS/FSM anyway.

http://alldata.com/products/diy/index.html

I just checked and it is actually $25 for the initial subscription and $15 for each additional car...I have a couple of cars so I forgot they charge a little more for the first one.
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  #20  
Old 01-05-2007, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Carlton View Post
The trick to the game is not to end up in "the abyss".

To avoid this fate requires that you always keep upward tension on the camshaft sprocket. This is best done with bungee cords and an overhead beam.

When the head is first lifted off the block (get an engine hoist), you shove some welding wire through the chain at the very top of the block to prevent the chain from falling. Naturally, you must unhook the bungee cord to get the head over the top of the camshaft sprocket. The welding wire prevents the chain from falling into the abyss at that time.

The abyss also is fond of grabbing two of the four small cap screws that secure the front of the head. Two of them are inside the timing chain cavity, and one mistake, or one slip, and the screw is down the abyss. Don't use anything but one of the flexible claw tools to start and remove these screws.

The abyss is also find of grabbing the camshaft thrust washer when you pull the sprocket off the cam. If you don't block the camshaft at the rear........it will slide backwards in a split second and the camshaft thrust washer (directly behind the camshaft sprocket) will fall into the abyss.

All these little tidbits are not in the FSM, however, and that's what makes the process a bit dangerous.

My strong advice is to GO SLOW and stop when you get tired or frustrated. Catastrophe is the next thing that will occur.
I don't know the 606 but since it is more recent I'll go off my unwanted intimate knowledge of the 603 head. There is no abyss. There is a separator on the timing cover that keeps the chain from ever falling in, unlike the dreaded possibility on the 617. I'm guessing that this is another nice to have that was added in the 603 along with the rear stop for the cam to keep it from walking during the installation. That said, when removing the cam gear keeping the chain from moving is a bit tricky. It will get to a point of looseness where cam no longer moves, but chain does. Mine moved a couple of degrees upon removal, but as long as you have marked the chain AND the gear in the same place, generally you just line up the two and timing will be maintained (including IP).

The key to removal on the 603 (and presumably the 606) is respecting to the letter the cam tower removal/retorquing sequence and the head bolt removal/retorquing sequence.

EDIT : There remains the timing case abyss which can suck in nuts and bolts. Be careful! I let one go down there and came to the conclusion that the magnet on a flexible rod is the BEST tool EVER (read : you do not want to take the timing cover off a 603 with the engine in the car)
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  #21  
Old 01-05-2007, 10:11 AM
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I posted this on the other thread dealing with broken GPs...Speedracer stated he was able to get the threaded part out...so I responded:

"Speed, if the threaded part is out why not start it up and let the compression blow the rest out through the hole?

I bet it would shoot out like a bullet."
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  #22  
Old 01-05-2007, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nhdoc View Post
I posted this on the other thread dealing with broken GPs...Speedracer stated he was able to get the threaded part out...so I responded:

"Speed, if the threaded part is out why not start it up and let the compression blow the rest out through the hole?

I bet it would shoot out like a bullet."
Maybe it would be better to just crank the engine by hand? Just to avoid any catastrophic possibilities.
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  #23  
Old 01-05-2007, 01:01 PM
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Rodney Herson in N. Dallas did mine ~4 years ago. Of course, it wasn't exactly inexpensive...

- JimY
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  #24  
Old 01-05-2007, 07:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nhdoc View Post
"Speed, if the threaded part is out why not start it up and let the compression blow the rest out through the hole?

I bet it would shoot out like a bullet."
I'm having the exact same problem with one seized up GP (at the threads), and I'm pretty close to drilling out the threaded part. Once the threads collapse it looks easy to remove the rest of the plug, and none of mine were carboned-up so I'm not expecting my stuck plug to be.

Speedracer, is it correct that you have three stuck plugs? Have you removed the head yet? If you try starting the engine, will it run on only three cylinders? I know it can run on five...did it starting up this morning

Would turning the engine by hand generate enough compression in the affected cylinders to blow out the remnants...or would the air just blow past the plug? And I'm guessing the glowplug would shoot out like a bullet with the engine running...I'd put a piece of cardboard by the IP to protect all that stuff.....and myself

On second thought, I would strongly advise against using compression to blow the plug out......simply too much to go wrong..you could end up with a bottom end rebuild if a piece of GP found its way into the cylinder.
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  #25  
Old 01-05-2007, 07:23 PM
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My engine started up on only 2 glow plugs last year in sub-zero conditions.

Took about 10 seconds of cranking and grumbling, but she did it

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