well, y'all. I'm really worried about my car.

you may remember i went down to Houston to pick-up my '85 300TD euro, in hopes of driving it back here to Oregon?
you helped me out when I got to Texas with a fuel flow problem AND with finding an impressive euro-mount trailer hitch (special thanks to Reithoven), and got me on the road as far as Cuba, New Mexico pulling a Uhaul before things headed south.

That baby was running GREAT when we pulled into that little town, but the next morning when I went out to start her, it was 10º and windy, and she laughed at me when i tried to start her. I tried until the battery died, and then a nice guy gave me a jump. But when that didn't get her goin', he pulled some STARTING FLUID out of his truck and headed towards my intake. I said "Aren't you not supposed to use that on diesels?" and he said "Naw, this works fine" and I shrugged and cranked it while he started spraying.

It noticably "bogged down" the motor, which still refused to start for so long that my sprayer/jump-starter friend left, and I waited with the hood up for the sun to warm up my block. In the meantime, i hiked a mile up the road lugging that huge battery to get it charged, and bought some "Diesel 911 fuel additive, thinking that when i got back in an hour she'd be good to go.

No such luck. Long story short, after mixing the additive 50/50 into the secondary filter, and a LOT more cranking and battery charges, days later, I'm back home in Oregon only after having rented a Uhaul TRUCK and TOWING my Mercedes home behind it. (Had to get back by whatever means necessary in time for my girlfriend's job interview).

SHE STILL WON'T START. I've changed both fuel filters. I've primed her with the primer pump. I've parked her in the sun and sprayed WD-40 in the intake. I've made sure i didn't disconnect any vacuum lines. I've verified that there's power going to the glowplugs. I've cracked the fuel injector lines and watched them seep diesel as I crank. I watch a bit of white smoke come out of the exhaust, but she doesn't REALLY even seem to be very close.

NOW WHAT? did we destroy something with the starter fluid, and if so, how would i know? any advice on how to proceed w/ this would be greatly appreciated!

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-lee
'83 300CDT (286k)

former proud owner of:
'85 mercedes euro 300TD
'80 mercedes 300TD
'77 mercedes 280e
'80 mercedes euro 250
'82 mercedes euro 250

Check your glow plugs and glow circuit.

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RRGrassi


70's Southern Pacific #5608 Fairmont A-4 MOW car

13 VW JSW 2.0 TDI 193K, Tuned with DPF and EGR Delete.

91 W124 300D Turbo replaced, Pressure W/G actuator installed. 210K

90 Dodge D250 5.9 Cummins/5 speed. 400K

I doubt the starting fluid caused any harm since it didn't explode. How was it starting when you first picked it up? I'd do a compression check.
Cuba is supposed to have a nice hostel/ranch that I've thought of visiting.

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1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

I would first check the glowplugs themselves to make sure they aren't bad. I bet you have one or more out. Also check the relay and the strip fuse. Go to Diesel Gaints GP troubleshooting guide it will walk you through it. Next I would adjustte the valves. Then check the starter, and make sure your battery is still good. Then if none of that works I'd do a compression test. I'd put my money on the glowplugs first.

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Also you may have summer diesel fuel, I would try running it out of a bottle with known good fuel. If you can get the engine warm it will have a much better chance of running. (like with a block heater, or in a warm garage)

Always good to change the filters, make sure there are no air leaks in the fuel system. If the valves are tight, the compression will be down,

__________________
1984 Euro 300SDC, (4spd standard)
1986 Toyota Landcruiser Diesel HJ60 5spd X2

Gone but not forgotten (some sold, some stripped)
1983 300 SD, 1985 300 SD, 1983 240D, 1986 300 SDL, 1985 300 SDL, 1983 300 D, 1984 300 D, 1985 300SD, 1987 300 SDL, 1983 300 SD, 1985 300 TD Euro, 1983 380SEC, 1990 300 D, 1987 300D, 1982 300D, 1982 300D, 1994 E420, 1987 300 TD, 1987 300 D, 1984 300 D

Icefire has mentioned what I was thinking as well. I do not know the distribution pattern of summer /winter fuel in the states but you were working your way north? Or did you refuel along the way at a very low volume fuel supplier? They can be deadly in my experience for having summer fuel left from low volume to non existant sales. Plus the possibility of them pumping some water in is higher. Sometimes we put our diesels into heated garages for most of the day if we suspect frozen water or fuel that is too thick. It sounds like the engine was trying to roll back on the starting fluid. You do want to carefully check the resistance of each glowplug as that is one of your best hopes. If they all check out perfectly then the heated garage is the next best bet in my opinion. Unless it is well above freezing where you are now. Pull your fuel filter and drain it into an old clear jar for example. Put it in a warm place. After another few hours or so try to drain it again. If anything comes out you had frozen water in your filter. If it was there it might be in other places in the fuel system. An event like this removes all the enjoyment from a trip.

Ether (Starting Fluid) will burn out glow plugs frequently. [As frequently as you
use Ether]

Think about it. Your PRE-CHAMBER diesel is running 20-22 to 1 compression and
adding a substance much more volatile than gasoline(Benzine);something has
"To Let Go".

The pre-chamber (and accessories) and the glow plugs were never meant to be
subjected to Ether's explosive pressures or heat.

The white smoke coming out of the exhaust is unburned diesel fuel. So it's not a fuel supply problem. You may have to plug in the block heater over night to get it to start if the glow plugs dont work.
Voltage at the glow plugs doesnt mean much. If you use a jumper wire from the post bat post to a glow plug it should spark if the glow plug is working. Glow plugs use about 15-20 amps for the first second of use. If you hook up a wire and dont get a spark the glow plug is probably not working.
Here is a trick I learned from a friend. If you dont have a block heater. You can hook up the heater hoses from another car to your car and run the engine. This will circulate hot coolant through the cold engine and bring it up to operating temp before attempting to start.

Using another vehicle to warm a block......should work well.....BUT.....you should be sure that the antifreeze/coolant in both engines is compatible.....

That's exactly how we warmed up ships from a "dead ship" condition....but, we had the same coolant in the generators and main engines....

SB

Note: I assume that you would connect the two at the heater connections and suitable hoses......

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Diesels:
'85 300D, "Max, Blue Benz", 155K, 27.0 MPG
'84 190D 2.2, "Eva, Brown Benz", 142K, 40.2 MPG
'77 240D (parts car)
'67 Eicher ES 202 Tractor "Otto" (2cyl, Air Cooled, 30HP)
Gassers:
'94 Ford F-150, "Henry", 170K (300 Six) 17.5 MPG
'85 190E 2.3, 148K....Parts Car
'58 Dodge W300M Powerwagon (Flat Fenders) Less than 10 MPG

A frined of mine spent a really cold winter in Gillette Wy and he said that was the only way to get some cars running. Kinda wish I had thought of that.

i'll get my multimeter today from the house and start checking glow plugs via the "dieselgiant" website later this afternoon.
car was starting GREAT before that fateful morning, and where i am now it's inside a 50º garage, the glow plug indicator light continues to come on correctly, and still no go...
SO
i'm guessing the "summer fuel" wouldn't be an issue at this point? and the best guess / hope would be that i burned out the glow plugs with the starting fluid? i guess, assuming she NEEDS glow plugs to start when it's this warm?

__________________
-lee
'83 300CDT (286k)

former proud owner of:
'85 mercedes euro 300TD
'80 mercedes 300TD
'77 mercedes 280e
'80 mercedes euro 250
'82 mercedes euro 250

i'd like to think my car would start without the glowplugs at 50 I'd be looking elsewhere

__________________
commercial fisherman diesel in my blood in my boats trucks and Dear old Dad has had me drivin them since i got my first license in 1968
1986 300 SDL 427654
1999 Chevy Crew Cab Dually 225423
1986 300 SDL 287000 Dad's
1987 190 Turbo 158000 Mom's (my inheritance)

Someone more knowledgable than I please correct me... but could this have happened?

Could it be that when doing your cranking attempts with ether added through the air intake, at some point it combusted too early and kicked the engine into a backwards rotation?

Turning the engine backwards is supposed to be very bad. The few threads I'd read that suggest what happens seem to indicate it screws up the timing.

My thinking is that since ether flashes at a lower temp that gas or diesel, and it was added through the air intake, it would have already been in the cylinder during the entire compression stroke. It might have ignited (more of an explosion, really) early enough in the compression stroke to push real hard on the piston before it was at/past TDC and thus caused the engine to rotate backwards. Might not happen while the starter is turning the engine forward, but I wonder if it could happen as you let off the starter?

Can this happen? Could it have happened? What would the results have been? I'm assembling this from bits I've read -- hopefully someone will come along and say I'm all wrong

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'83 300DTurbo http://badges.fuelly.com/images/smallsig-us/318559.png

Broadband: more lies faster.

All my diesels need glow plugs to start at any temp, unless the engine was recently shut off and already up to temp.

Checking glow plugs is pretty easy, so thats a quick test, I think i would still check the fuel filters for evidence of clogging or summer fuel.

try giving it 1/3 throttle when starting.

Seriously check the fuel though, I sometimes get bad fuel at a local station and then the car is very hard to start.

Also how fast is your starter turning the car over, if its turning it over slowly your not going to get it to start. Give the battery an extra boost,

__________________
1984 Euro 300SDC, (4spd standard)
1986 Toyota Landcruiser Diesel HJ60 5spd X2

Gone but not forgotten (some sold, some stripped)
1983 300 SD, 1985 300 SD, 1983 240D, 1986 300 SDL, 1985 300 SDL, 1983 300 D, 1984 300 D, 1985 300SD, 1987 300 SDL, 1983 300 SD, 1985 300 TD Euro, 1983 380SEC, 1990 300 D, 1987 300D, 1982 300D, 1982 300D, 1994 E420, 1987 300 TD, 1987 300 D, 1984 300 D

The fact that the ether did not explode does seem to indicate there is a glowplug problem.

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13