i would guess that the drum part is stuck holding it on there good. i think the pads are opposite of eachother and perhaps would give a bolted on feel. there might be some rust built up on the inside of the pads for the drum holdong it on there good, making a lip on the inside (middle of the car) part. perhaps a screwdriver and a bit of scraping on this lip will free it up.

__________________
-Trevor

OBK #12
1980 300SD 333,XXX miles - Totaled
1986 Mazda RX-7 212,XXX miles - impounded and auctioned off
2005 Jeep Liberty CRD Limited 33,000- SEGR, Provent, Fumoto

Thanks... I'm going to try that first thing, based on my understanding of what you just said. It would be helpful, though, to have a visual notion of exactly what to look for... you know, you can't see much through those tiny holes... just fragments of what is in there... It would be fantastic if there were a tutorial somewhere, illustrated with pictures, on how to go about it...

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1979 240D, W123, 105K miles, stick, white w/ tan interior.

Hey Rino!
I just had the same problem on my 83 240D. This may seem a little unorthodox, but it doesn't require a torch or a big hammer and it worked for me!


Put the calipers and brake pads back on, block up the rear end by the rear end body mounts (those two Big bolts just in front of the rear wheels) NOT the rear swing arms, then start the engine, put the car in gear, hold on the brakes and romp on the throttle. Next shift to reverse and do the same thing.

Mine came loose with a loud bang. They were REALLY on there! I had been banging on them, Heating them, cussing at them, spraying WD-40 on them, but this little trick popped them loose.

Don't get to carried away or you will shear off the little alignment pin. You are just listening for the POP of it breaking loose and then the CLANK as the pin hits the hole in the rotor.

Good Luck!
Chris

Hi Chris!
This assumes freezing due to rust, not to drums, right?
I don't know, man... It seems a very drastic approach... I do not even have blocks of wood large enough for that... and I doubt I can use my jack stands for that...
Honestly, I'd be scared like hell to do that with the car on jack stands...

Let me try the gentler approach that was discussed before, tomorrow... I really hope it works... then we'll see... Again, I'd be afraid the car slips to the ground from the vibrations or something... I don't have much experience with that sort of thing... as you much likely can tell.

Thanks for your advice, though, it is very much appreciated.

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1979 240D, W123, 105K miles, stick, white w/ tan interior.

rino,

i am attempting to attacha pic of the area i have described. it is from the parts link and it is a nice clean rotor.

the area that is going to be rusted is between the pink lines next to the green arrow.

it looks as if the brake pads run between the grooves or the blue lines. so you might have a good "lip" on there that needs to be cleaned.

hope this helps.

Attached Thumbnails

 

__________________
-Trevor

OBK #12
1980 300SD 333,XXX miles - Totaled
1986 Mazda RX-7 212,XXX miles - impounded and auctioned off
2005 Jeep Liberty CRD Limited 33,000- SEGR, Provent, Fumoto

soak them in PB blaster for a while, then hit the bastages with a rubber or lead hammer

They wont break if they're in any sort of usable shape, if u do manage to break one, it was most likely turned (poorly) to be underspecs. Do NOT worry about breaking it...

You're not from the rust belt... are you..?
Fill in ur location PLZ!!!
~Nate

__________________
95 Honda Shadow ACE 1100.
1999 Plymouth Neon Expresso. 2.4 swap, 10.5 to 1 comp, big cams. Autocross time attack vehicle!
2012 Escape, 'hunter" (5 sp 4cyl)

So, here's the scoop...

First of all, I'll say that my reason for getting that rotor out was to find out what was causing the wheels to be hard to turn with a jacked-up rear side. I was concerned about it, and when I came across the stuck rear left rotor, I thought something underneath it might be responsible for that situation. That said...

I just spent FOUR HOURS of my time on the car... Again, I took off the rear wheels and calipers, then tried banging on the rear right rotor (the one that is stuck) with a large rubber mallet, then with a medium-sized hammer... in different ways and for a long time... keeping in mind the location on the rotor suggested by 79300sdtd, to no avail. I tried pulling it out with my hands (believe me, I am a very strong guy). I even tried begging the damn rotor to come out... Cussing at it... It doesn't move at all.

Then it occurred to me to see if I could adjust the e-brakes on both sides with the adjusting starwheels. Using the starwheel, according to the Haynes Manual, is supposed to disengage the brake shoes in the case of an overtightened e-brake trapping the rotor... I released the tension by untightening the starwheel ALL THE WAY ... Nothing... the rotor stays stuck.
Then I properly adjusted the e-brakes on both sides, so that it now takes only 3-4 clicks on the e-brake pedal to fully engage the e-brake, as per the specs. I tested both rear brake shoes by fully engaging the e-brakes and then trying to turn the rotors by hand: the e-brake works perfectly on both sides, the rotors cannot be turned when the e-brake is engaged.

Further: I put the transmission in neutral (this way the rear hubs are fully independent of one another). I tested each one: they are both hard to turn... so it has nothing to do with the right rotor that doesn't come off... I tried the same test in first gear (now the differential engages both wheels, which rotate in opposite directions): the resistance encountered in turning them is the same as turning one wheel at a time, when they can be turned independently.

What does this tell me?

1) The resistance encountered when turning the rotors/wheels has nothing to do with the RR rotor being stuck, since the same resistance (actually, a bit more) is also present in the RL side when the car is in neutral...

2) The e-brakes work just fine on both sides and it is unlikely that it is an e-brake issue, since I was able to adjust both sides perfectly.

What about the stubborn rotor that is stuck? In my opinion, after all the tests that I performed today, it is just a stuck rotor (probably rust or the "lip," as per 79300sdtd) performing fine otherwise... Do I need to go crazy and waste even more time over this stuck rotor? I don't think so...

The only thing that concerns me is the two wheels that are hard to rotate, even when the tires and the calipers are off and the e-brakes fully released... What is causing it? It cannot be the bearings causing that... Can it be something with the axle? With the differential? What else? It is here that I think I really need some answers...

__________________
1979 240D, W123, 105K miles, stick, white w/ tan interior.

Just did... thanks.

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1979 240D, W123, 105K miles, stick, white w/ tan interior.

i am not 100% on this, and i am sure someone will correct me if i am wrong, but when you turn the wheel even with the car in neutral you are still spinning the differential AND the driveshaft.

i would check to see if it is any easier to rotate with the wheels on, if it is i would chalk it up as hard to turn the weight of everything moving with a small diameter "wheel".

__________________
-Trevor

OBK #12
1980 300SD 333,XXX miles - Totaled
1986 Mazda RX-7 212,XXX miles - impounded and auctioned off
2005 Jeep Liberty CRD Limited 33,000- SEGR, Provent, Fumoto

I think its time to get a torch...

If you have a bad wheel bearing their should be some play, and you would hear it.

__________________
1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

I have no idea... All I know is that with the transmission in neutral the opposite wheel does not rotate... So, given that the good wheel offers even more resistance than the one with the stuck rotor while the latter is not being involved in the rotation, it tells me that the wheels being hard to turn do not have anything to do with the RR rotor being stuck.

Yes, I tried and it is easier to rotate with the wheels on, but I thing this is just due to the larger diameter the rotating impetus is being applied to (more leverage) and the larger mass providing more inertia...
But you need to understand that, even with the wheels on, there's a good amount of resistance... it takes some effort to rotate the wheels and they do not spin freely... the slight sound they make is as if there is some mechanical friction being applied somewhere... I mean, is this normal in your experience???

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1979 240D, W123, 105K miles, stick, white w/ tan interior.

A torch might be needed... but why worrying about that now when it seems the stuck rotor is not affecting the issue at hand (wheels hard to turn by hand).
If the stuck rotor still does its job while being stuck... I say, let it be, no need to fix things when they work just fine... Do you concur?

Nope, I don't hear that kind of sound... so I don't think it has to do with the bearing.
Besides, the resistance is on both wheels even with transmission in neutral when they move independently from one another (one moving while the opposite one is still...)

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1979 240D, W123, 105K miles, stick, white w/ tan interior.

I have been reading this thread and trying to figure out how to explain the procedure for removing a stuck rotor. So here goes. Try to follow along.
Get a BIG hammer, not a sledge hammer. strike the rotor close to the axle hub. Try to NOT hit the alxe hub but only the center part of the rotor. In other words, hit the rotor at the holes for the lug bolts. This breaks the rotor grip. Hit it in several places around the axle hub. You will know when it comes free. It may even fall off. I have been doing this for years and have never damaged a rotor.

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84 500 SEL (307,xxx miles)

When was the last time the rear end fluid was done?

Is your fuel mileage suffering?

Since its probably never been done, it wouldn't hurt to inspect and repack the rear bearings.

__________________
1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

Hey Rino and all,
I have a hunch that what is dragging is the lining from one of your Ebrake shoes. I had this happen on my 77 240D. The lining broke loose from the steel part of the shoe, then it rotated with the rotor and wound up trapped between the rotor and the other shoe. The ebrake still seemed to work just fine, but driving down the road, I was using a lot of throttle and kept smelling burning brakes.

If you get a dragging sound while turning the rotor with the calipers removed, this is about the only thing that can cause it. Bearings sound grumbley not scratchy.

By the way, regarding the using the engines power to break loose a stuck rotor, the technique is Not an insane throttle happy orgy of maximum revs, clouds of diesel smoke, and a car trying to shake itself off of the jack stands!
I am not recommending getting the wheels up to 150 MPH and slamming on the brakes as hard as you can. Such sillyness is completly un-necessary.
You simply hold the brakes with the engine idling, bring up the power gradually. If nothing pops, shift into reverse, and repeat.

The reason for blocking the car up by the body mounts is that the swing arms will try to move up against the springs when the brakes are held and the car is in a forward gear. If you blocked by the swing arms this would be quite dangerous, but with the car held by the body, the swing arms can move up and down without threatining to belly flop the car!

Good Luck, and let us know what the problem is when you figure it out.
Cheers, Chris