I just fell across this website and I thought it could be useful.
I've been looking for a Mercedes for the past couple months but have had no luck.. been looking for either a 190E manual (did found one but owner never called back) and now.. someone offered me a 1991 300D for 2.2K.
Problem with the cars?
The auto tranny seems to be stuck in first gear and there's some "minimal" rust. I haven't seen the car yet but I wanted to know if it was worth it..

What could be the possible issues for the auto tranny being stuck in one? Could it be anything else than having to rebuild it?

Thanks to all!

Welcome!!

Pass this one up and look for a better car. Sounds like a lot of $ to me for a car with a messed up tranny although I really don't know much about the value of "late" model examples.

Now a 123 I am somewhat versed on just what they should sell for....

Cheers,

Bill

If you decide to pass on it, pass it my way, seriously I'd be interested.
For $2.2k, should be a good buy unless it has a serious problem. They regularly sell for closer to $4k in good condition, mileage or problems will reduce that of course.
The 2.5 turbo is a good engine, has some problems but mostly control issues, more time and troubleshooting hassles than money. The Climate Control should be working correctly including A/C, could be expensive problems there, and steering/suspension sloppiness is a weak point in older 124 bodies which can add up $$.
Rust is an expensive problem in that it significantly reduces the value.
Seems like the transmission could be held in first gear by many things. Externally if the bowden cable is fully extended, it will shift late. Same for a stuck downshift switch (under the loud-pedal). It can also be internal, a stuck piston or modulator maybe?
The engine is protected (should be) from over-revving, run it to redline in first and see if it shifts to second. This might be a bit abrupt if you do it cold or at part-throttle, a high-RPM shift should be done at full-throttle only!!.
Good luck, which would be my bad luck.

__________________

Gone to the dark side

- Jeff

Check out this thread:

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=184188

And this one:

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=170605

I would ask if he's priced out the tranny work. Assuming everything else checks out that's referenced on the second thread above, and you could get the car on the road with a new or repaired tranny for under 4k, you'd be doing pretty damned good. I would think you could get the guy down quite a bit with rust and a bad transmission. Good luck!

__________________

1998 E300D, 287k, barely broken in.

I bought a 92 last Chirstmas from my neighboor. 212k miles, faded paint on hood from so many years of waxing and polishing, extremely well kept interior. Here a list of issues and how much to repair cost me.

+ Transmission had been rebuilt by previous owner recently-$1900
+ Wiper quit working a week later, bad wiper switch- $145 part $100 to install
+ Light switch turned into baby rattle- $55 replaced myself
+ Alda line clogged with soot, no turbo boost due to it- Clean it once a month, no cost to me other than car has no power unless turbo is spooled up.
+ Car does not heat up quickly even with Florida's mild winters suspect bad thermostat- $30 for OEM, have yet to put it in.
+ Radiator has developed a small leak around top- priced it out at $200 part only, will probably do myself before summer hits hard.
+ One of the two electric cooling fans was working- I pulled bad unit out and removed (no exageration) a grocery bag full of bugs. The fan shroud is a poor design in my opinion. It collects bugs instead of letting exit out the bottom of the unit. Fan started working again once I removed all the dead bugs, engine temperatures are back to more normal levels.
+ Injector #5 went out- Makes a sound like a bad lifter at iddle when they go bad. Total cost at local diesel shop $325 for two new nozzles, injector rebuilt and injector pump resealing as the new low sulfur diesel eats the old seals away.
+ Fuel preheater had started leaking diesel- New one is $150 but the original ones can be rebuilt for about $30 in parts as the local Benz dealers carry them. I went the cheap route and rebuilt.
+ All fuel lines and vacuum lines were replaced due to age, total cost about $40 in parts. Did the work myself.

Things that will need addressing in the near future.

Car has original shocks and struts, I want to replace them with good Bilsteins or KYB. I'm looking at about $500 in parts.
AC does not blow air out of Center vents, bad vaccum switch somewhere. Not sure how much it will cost to address.

I paid $3k for the car and I still consider it a good buy. My neighboor is the original owner and is a jet Engine mecanic from Delta, so I know for a fact that he was on top of maintenance. He just got tired of the car nickel and dimeing him every month. I'm not there yet but my wife is (tired of car) as I have spent over $1k in the last 3 months keeping this car on the road (repairs plus some wear items). AC is another notorious weak system in these cars and they are very expensive to repair. Mine was done about 4 years by prior owner.

Bottom line. Car drives better than many late model cars, gets fantastic mileage (30-31 mpg) mixed city/hwy driving and looks great still inside out. Fact remains it's 15 year old car and things will break and/or wear out due to age. If your expectations are to fix it and drive it with the reliability of a Honda or Toyota you'll be very disappointed. If you want a car that (in my opinion) looks better than any Honda or Toyota but do not mind putting money into it every month to keep it runing then get it. I'm an Engineer/Contractor so I constantly have to fight the urge to try and make the car perfect and instead just enjoy it for what it is.

Regards,

__________________
Asantoni
92 300D 2.5T (225K miles)
05 Frontier CC (36k miles)

The vacuum pods are about $30 each and you either need 5 or 6. It is about a 10 hour DIY job as you have to take the dash apart, unless you are GSXR and have done it 4 times.

It's not a bad job if you take your time and lay everything out in the order that you took it apart. There are some good write ups here.

Chris

__________________
1987 300TD 309, xxx 2.8.2014 10,000 mile OCI


Be careful of the toes you step on today, as they may be connected to the ass you have to kiss tomorrow. anonymous

“Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don’t matter, and those who matter won’t mind.” Dr. Seuss

Mmhmm.. wait, can anyone clarify this for me:
I was told that if I wanted a really reliable car I should go for an old Mercedes. How much of that is true?
Something I could do big road trips and not have the car fail on me during the time or anything...
(I'm talking of all models, not just Diesels)

Reliability or durability? IMHO, Mercedes are known for their durability, not their reliability....hope that helps.

__________________
99 E300 TD -- sold
01 540i 6 spd

as long as u keep them maintained there great cars.
you would be suprised at how much abuse they can actually take though...

__________________
82' 300SD

i'll drive my 1986 anywhere anytime with 403000 miles on her but a 20 year old car has stuff worn out just like it's 54 year old owner

__________________
commercial fisherman diesel in my blood in my boats trucks and Dear old Dad has had me drivin them since i got my first license in 1968
1986 300 SDL 427654
1999 Chevy Crew Cab Dually 225423
1986 300 SDL 287000 Dad's
1987 190 Turbo 158000 Mom's (my inheritance)

Very well said, If I had to sum up my MB diesel experience this would be it! I often take the car on road trips to South Florida without any concern of it leaving me stranded. It's the little things that wear out.

__________________
Asantoni
92 300D 2.5T (225K miles)
05 Frontier CC (36k miles)

I bought a 91 300D 2.5 about 2 years ago that had the same transmission problem. What I found was a broken plastic gear on the governor in the transmission. Not a bad problem to fix. Parts cost was about 2 bucks from dealer. BY the way, when I pulled the governor out only 1/2 of the gear was there. I never found the other half but the trans works great. I did have to replace the radiator and fan clutch and both electric fans. Of course I had a few other problems but nothing big. The car has 305K miles on it and I would trust it to go anywhere. It gets about 21 MPG when driving to and from work which is only about 3 miles/day city. It gets 34MPG on the highway at 70-80 MPH. Great car.

__________________
84 500 SEL (307,xxx miles)

I will give you my experience and opinion.

First, if you are not a car nut and will be satisfied with just a reliable car, buy a Toyota Camry. Seriously, a lot less trouble. There are many things about MB that simply appeal to most of us MB nuts.

Second, if you don't do much of your own repair work, then the repair costs can be pretty high. That is not to say that the paying to repair other makes is a lot lower. It just that MB require more attention to maintenance.

Maintenance cost. I had a '79 300CD Diesel in the early 80's that I drove for 150K without major repairs. In around 1998 I bought a '90 300E with 100K on the clock. Drove that car for 75K and spent at least $5,000 in repairs. Some were necessary, some were simply trying to keep the car in top shape. Traded for a '92 300E with 110K. That car is now at 242K. Repairs by previous owner were in the neighborhood of 10K. I have probably spent another 10K. These were all business miles and repairs were tax deductable. The nice thing about these cars is that when you replace worn parts the car comes back to running and riding like it was new.

Reliability. My experience is that in well over 200,000 miles of interstate travel in the 300E's I was stranded exactly once. That was my fault for not paying attention to the distributer cap and rotor.

I continue to follow the same approach. I enjoy driving a Mercedes. I like to look at them in the driveway. The Chrysler mini-van and the Toyota truck do nothing for me. I don't work on them at all. About 6 months ago I bought an S Class. '97 S320 in top shape with dealer records for less than $12,000. It has had some of the major predictable repairs completed. The thing about driving older MB is that the repairs hit when they hit.
You have to be financially able to fork over the money. Air Conditioning systems are complex and prone to failure. On the two 300E's I had 3 failures at around $1,200 a pop.

In conclusion, you really need to do your homework before jumping into the purchase of an old Mercedes.

Steve
'97 S320 116K
'92 300E Sportline 242K

Personally I look at this a little differently.

If you're comparing 20-30y/old cars, you're not going to find many Hondas, they've all rusted into the landscape long ago.
Many of the cars represented by people on this forum are 25 years old or older, I'd guess that 25y/old is an average at best. Further, the diesels were usually purchased by high-mileage drivers, got lots of miles and again I'm guessing that the average mileage on these cars represented here is 200k-250k miles. Many are unknown as in the years when these cars were valuable and traded in, it was common to turn back odometers, I worked for several car dealerships in the '80s including M-B, I heard the "code" being spoken frequently for turning back the clocks. This is less common now, I'm confident it still happens, but better records are kept to track it (although dealers know how to circumvent it by selling at out-of-state auctions etc.).

So, you're comparing 25+ year-old Mercedes which have 200,000-500,000miles on them, are old enough in many cases to have been neglected by at least one of many owners, to Oldsmobuicks and Japanese cars younger and with less miles.

My experience is that they are dependable, reliable, but mostly safe and robust. Some choices were made by Mercedes-Benz at the time to have a slightly less efficient car to increase reliability and safety, that's what you've got. Another compromise was made for the sake of serviceability, space might be "wasted" in an effort to provide access to service items.

A Mercedes is a Mercedes, can't really be compared to other cars directly.
If you're looking for operating cost and reliability, you can probably find a younger Japanese econobox 5-speed for less money which will give good fuel mileage and reliability, and you throw it away when it wears out. If you want a Mercedes, you want it regardless of the costs, and you need to be willing to play "catch-up" on neglected maintenance items and do what it takes to get/keep the car in proper condition. Also, most of us don't want partially-operational cars, we'll stay the course until everything looks and functions as it should, part of our culture.

The car you're considering is a 124body, my favorite. An earlier 123 or other would likely be simpler, when you get out of electronic controls and airbags, they are easier to maintain to the point eventually of an air-cooled VW Beetle.
The 124's slightly more complicated design gives you a completely different driving/handling experience over its earlier cousin, more fuel efficient and much improved performance, and better crash avoidability and survivability. It has a smaller brother (the 190) and a larger one (126), personal taste as they get more comfortable and roomy as they get larger, but less efficent and less handling/fun to drive also, ... I like the 124. The engine in the car you're considering is the 602, a turbo-diesel 2.5L 5cylinder. Performance, noise level, fuel efficiency, maintenance intervals, and smoke output are all improved over the earlier 5cylinder and it has a great reputation for durability & reliability. Less power than the 1-year 6cyl, but a better record for repair costs.

And again, if you don't want the car, please point me to it, I enjoy the culture and the hobby.

__________________

Gone to the dark side

- Jeff

Alright... that about sums up what everyone here has been telling me. Well, I'll have to think about the diesel; my dad might consider it.
Personally, I just got myself a W201 2.6. I'm kinda surprised by the Mercedes gearbox though, it's really different than other ones I've tried. The car didn't hold up in third gear on my driveway, could the clutch or transmission be tired?

I'll consider what everyone has told me. I'll still look into the the 300D for my dad, but he didn't really want it much because it needs a new transmission and he was kinda skeptic as to how you can break a Mercedes transmission... I mean, we've always been told the transmission and engine are really tough and you'd have to really pull on it in order to break it, so that's making him think again about the car.

But thanks to everyone for their input!
If you have anything else to say, feel free to!