I'm not sure if anyone has seen, or posted, this directly from the company (MB) site or not...

Can Mercedes-Benz diesels be fueled with biodiesel?

Mercedes-Benz USA now approves the use of B5 biodiesel (standard automotive diesel with a maximum five percent biodiesel content) in all Common-rail Direct Injection diesel (CDI) engines. As biodiesel can be refined from a variety of raw materials resulting in widely varying properties, the only approved biodiesel content is one that meets ASTM D6751 specification and that has the necessary oxidation stability (min. 6h, proved with EN14112 method) to prevent damages to the system from deposits and/or corrosion.

Please ask your service station for further information. If the B5 biodiesel blend is not sufficiently labeled to clearly indicate that it meets the above standards, please do not use it. The Mercedes-Benz limited warranty does not cover damage caused by the use of fuels not meeting Mercedes-Benz-approved fuel standards.

Anyone 'see' the missing line, "...you empty a frying pan into the tank? You are on your own..."

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1987 300D (230,000 mi on a #14 head-watching the temp gauge and keeping the ghost in the machine)
Raleigh NC - Home of deep fried sushi!

I guess the manufactirer is always going to be conservative. Their goals are not the same as those of the typical WVO-er. Doesn't really matter, though, does it?

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" We have nothing to fear but the main stream media itself . . . ."- Adapted from Franklin D Roosevelt for the 21st century

OBK #55

1998 Lincoln Continental - Sold
Max 1984 300TD 285,000 miles - Sold
The Dee8gonator 1987 560SEC 196,000 miles - Sold
Orgasmatron - 2006 CLS500 90,000 miles
2002 C320 Wagon 122,000 miles
2016 AMG GTS 12,000 miles

I've seen that before, VW does the same.
Because there is so much room for chance with WVO/SVO and biodiesel, Mercedes doesn't want to be liable for any (potentially expensive) warranty claims resulting from the use of those fuels. This is not to say that they cannot be used--I have been using B100 without any problems for a few years now. Mercedes just doesn't want to have to pay up if you run an "experiment" in your car.

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99 E300 TD -- sold
01 540i 6 spd

The BIO is not good for the electrically operated high pressure injectors.

It's bad for common rail because the bio part goes into some chemical reaction around 20,000psi.

There is a bit on bio in the Bosch Diesel Engine Management book, I will have to reread that section.

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http://superturbodiesel.com/images/sig.04.10.jpg
1995 E420 Schwarz
1995 E300 Weiss
#1987 300D Sturmmachine
#1991 300D Nearly Perfect
#1994 E320 Cabriolet
#1995 E320 Touring
#1985 300D Sedan
OBK #42

Please note that the missing line is relating to the 616 and 617 engines that most of us are running......it's missing because these engines are NOT of the common rail design, and why I selected this model of car in the first place to run B-100.....if I purchase the B-100 or make my own B-100 it should not make much of a difference......

Although I have no particular interest in burning WVO or SVO, the same train of thought should apply.....I would not attempt to run WVO or SVO thru a common rail system, but that stuff should be fine with our Bosch M pumps....

My reasoning behind burning Bio-Diesel is mainly because it requires no modifications to the vehicle, whereas WVO and SVO require heaters and a 2 tank system......

SB

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Diesels:
'85 300D, "Max, Blue Benz", 155K, 27.0 MPG
'84 190D 2.2, "Eva, Brown Benz", 142K, 40.2 MPG
'77 240D (parts car)
'67 Eicher ES 202 Tractor "Otto" (2cyl, Air Cooled, 30HP)
Gassers:
'94 Ford F-150, "Henry", 170K (300 Six) 17.5 MPG
'85 190E 2.3, 148K....Parts Car
'58 Dodge W300M Powerwagon (Flat Fenders) Less than 10 MPG

My reasoning is exactly the same - sure, the 617s and 603s will run thick vegetable oil, possibly unfiltered/unwashed, in a single-tank system, for a while, but why do that when you can easily make bio and keep running out to 500+k miles?

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1983 300SD 467,000 km - 473 champagnermetallic

location: 34°5' N 106°53' W (Socorro NM, USA)

I think your car and engine are a few days past warranty so it really isn't an issue. I have been using B99 in my 603 for 2 years now. There is a pretty big difference between an IDI and CDI engine. As Forced said the psi is some where north of 20,000 on the CDI.

Don't get me started on the WVO/SVO. They should not be used in the same sentence as Biodiesel, as some folks think its the same stuff. IT most certainly is NOT.


Chris

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1987 300TD 309, xxx 2.8.2014 10,000 mile OCI


Be careful of the toes you step on today, as they may be connected to the ass you have to kiss tomorrow. anonymous

“Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don’t matter, and those who matter won’t mind.” Dr. Seuss

Presently I have the Benz and the Eicher tractor (see my sig), but it is my intention to as many of my vehicles running on one fuel.....Bio-Diesel.....

I am seeking a small pickup.....perhaps a VW Caddy, or an '80ish Ford ranger, or maybe even a Toyota......but a 40 mpg Diesel pickup is a must have for me.....not immediately, but by next summer.....

I have been looking into modifying my Gravely Commercial 12 (Kohler 12hp) with a one cylinder, air cooled Diesel.......my Gravely expert, Richard's Lawn & Garden, in Spencer, WV says it will be a bit more difficult than I had originally thought......it will be expensive probably would be better off buying a finish mower for the tractor......

But by my way of thinkin'....by the end of 2008 I should be Diesel powered on everything but the Chainsaw and Brush Cutter (they are both Dolmar, a German Co.....and even they don't offer Diesel chainsaws and brush cutters...) I have Free Natural Gas, so my standby Generator is Natural Gas driven......

And before there are any comments.....I don't want to build my own compressor station and run NG in all of my stuff.....maybe there will be a Hydrogen Fuel Cell for Electricity.......

Just livin' as sustainably as possible out inna boonies......

SB

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Diesels:
'85 300D, "Max, Blue Benz", 155K, 27.0 MPG
'84 190D 2.2, "Eva, Brown Benz", 142K, 40.2 MPG
'77 240D (parts car)
'67 Eicher ES 202 Tractor "Otto" (2cyl, Air Cooled, 30HP)
Gassers:
'94 Ford F-150, "Henry", 170K (300 Six) 17.5 MPG
'85 190E 2.3, 148K....Parts Car
'58 Dodge W300M Powerwagon (Flat Fenders) Less than 10 MPG

I would like to see the information about CDI's and 100% biodiesel being incompatible due to electronic injectors or high fuel injector pressures

From what I have read D.C. of India has been running tests with CDI's and neat biodiesel. The results have been positive according to D.C. of India.

http://www.blonnet.com/2006/12/06/stories/2006120605260300.htm
The Managing Director and CEO of DaimlerChrysler India, Dr Wilfried Aulbur, in a statement said, "The biodiesel project is at a very exciting stage now. Our vehicle tests with 100 per cent pure (unblended) biodiesel continue to show positive results. We have widened the fleet of Mercedes-Benz cars powered by biodiesel and have set up storage and dispensing facility for biodiesel at Pune to facilitate fleet-testing and research upon shelf life and storage issues of biodiesel."

http://www.daimlerchrysler.com/dccom/0,,0-5-7165-1-446319-1-0-0-446301-0-0-243-7165-0-0-0-0-0-0-0,00.html


http://www.indiacar.com/infobank/articles/mercbiodiesel/index.asp

http://www.mercedes-benz.co.in/companymilestone.htm

Now if someone wants to point to the fact that it's Jatropha Biodiesel and NOT soy based, I won't debate that point. The Germans found out long ago that the soy bean is not the best oil to make fuel out of, hence the reason they prefer rapeseed. Now what the mods were done in 2004 to the C220 CDI's I don't know. But I have read that the later phase of the project is not doing any mods to the "extended fleet" of CDI's.

Update: http://www.csmcri.org/Documents/Biennial%20Report%202004.pdf

page 77...
DaimlerChrysler undertook tests with our neat biodiesel in view of the high standard of specifications achieved by us. Mercedes Benz C 220 CDI manual transmission vehicles (two numbers) were used for this purpose and these were used without any engine modification. As a precautionary measure, some plastic seals in the fuel system were replaced with inexpensive rubber seals although this may not be necessary in the future.

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1999 E300DT (131,800) 154,000 Black on Black SOLD

2006 CLK 500 coupe Capri Blue on Grey (zoom,zoom)
47,000mi

04 VW TDI Passat 80,000mi
(Techno)

How to eliminate oil dependency through market-driven approaches.
“We could cut oil use in half by 2025, and by 2040, oil use could be zero,”
The Sound of Diesel Speed
Ode to MB

The major problem is fuel certification. There are a number of questions that surround this issue. Several companies started at 5% and now have gone to 20%. If you remember, one of the issues with European companies and diesels in the US was the inferior quality of US diesel over the last 20 years.
I've never heard of the pressure issue before, and am more than willing to investigate it, especially if someone provides some links.

I've personally been involved with running both WVO and Bio-D (up to B-100) in Ford PSDs which have 500 PSI (min) pressure. I believe that the pressure is normally 2500......No issue with B-100....

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87 300SDL - 215K Miles !!
99 F-350CC Dually PSD - 190K
86 300SDL - 189K
All on B-100

Ford, GM, Dodge and International set the limit at B5 also. I have started looking into running bio in some of our work trucks and we've got one of each. Others might, but I haven't checked.

Their main concern is the lack of standards and certification across the various types and producers. The new ASTM standards should help address most of those concerns and the vehicle manufacturers ought to raise those limits. B5 allows them to be "bio compatible" but leaves them enough margin for error (as far as the fuel source goes) to be safe.

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1980 300TD-China Blue/Blue MBTex-2nd Owner, 107K (Alt Blau) OBK #15
'06 Chevy Tahoe Z71 (for the wife & 4 kids, current mule) '03 Honda Odyssey (son #1's ride, reluctantly) '99 GMC Suburban (255K+ miles, semi-retired mule) 21' SeaRay Seville (summer escape pod)

My brother - who is in the marine business - sold a Yanmar marine diesel engine to a customer near Watertown, NY for installation into a Gravely. Maybe we should start a Gravely biodiesel SIG?

Because
A) you have to mess with sodium methoxide to make biodiesel
B) Because you have to have a biodiesel processor to make biodiesel
C) Because you have to handle methanol
D) Because it costs more money to make BD than to burn WVO
E) Because you need to titrate mefore making BD
F) Because you have to wash BD
G) Because making BD take time
H) Because making BD takes up space
I) Because you have to store nasty, hazardous, flamable chemicals

and finally the 10 reason to burn WVO instead of BD
J)You don't have a by-product called Glycerol that you can't sell (unless you want the FBI, and homeland security agents on your tail) and can't ever use that much soap

All the cruddy WVO I get just gets thrown in the trash, it's usually a quart out of 15 gallons that i dispose of, the rest gets burned.

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Closing the store
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