I've got one with about 130,000 mi and am relatively satisfied. I follow the Dodge TDR site quite a bit and noticed, in response to an inquiry about this same model, that an ex MB tech popped up and really gave them the thumbs down.

Any comments?

New to the site.

Where is the Dodge TDR site? What did he say about the car? The only major problems I am aware of are the weak head, bent rods, and oil pump failure. The Trap problem has been taken care of by MB for free.

David

That's what you get for frequenting a Dodge site.

Great car.

__________________
Chris

'04 ML500 - 53k, Inspiration Edition, Desert Silver
'11 Audi A4 Avant - Brilliant Black
'87 300SDL sold
'99 C280 Sport sold
'85 190E 2.3 sold

The TDR site is in the same v-bulletin format as this one..
Address
www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=27217

Hope this address works for you

No serious problems other than head and bent rods from gulping carbon chunks out of the intake -- and the later probably won't be a problem if you use synthetic oil after getting the EGR port clean.

Amazing power for a 3L diesel, and if maintained properly run the traditional 500,000 with little or no trouble.

Very expensive to rebuild, though -- typical exchange price for a rebuilt engine is $7000, pistons are $2500 a set, etc.

MB appears to have discontinued the engine for emissions reasons rather than reliability -- the 601 and 602 are identical except for # of cylinders and crank. They have been replaced by TDI engines in Europe -- more power, less smoke, more like gas engines.

The 350 is another story altogether -- same engine, bored out to 3.5L, bends rods in "normal" use -- same rod, 25% more horsepower.....!

Peter

__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

David,

Thank you for the pointer. Visited that site; I could see why the ex MB did not like the 87. He was right about the 617 engine being the best and the cheapest. I have the 85 300D, 85 300SD, and 87 300D. Replacement parts for 87 300D are expensive; the 300SD is okay; but the 300D is very cheap.

The 87 300D is fast, quiet, good diesel mileage, better handling. I had heard some terrible stories about the 603 engine but hardly any bad things about the 617 engine.

It is a trade off. The problems with the 603 are acceptable to me. Different people have different need or preference but I like all of my MBs. One thing for sure, 3 adults in the back seat of a 87 300D (W124) is not comfortable. W123 and W126 have more room. W123 is easy to park and still comfortable with 3 adults in the back.

David

Peter and/or David

Is it possible that that the deposit you talk about is coming from the EGR. When I had my intake manifold off to swap out glow plugs there was lots of dirt in there which I suspected was coming from the exhaust gas recirc.

That prompts another question.. about glow plug life. most of these were shaky at 90,000 mi. Normal?

Also I took a lot of stuff off to get at them; Is there a technique to avoid this?

Any thoughts or comments

Thanks
David Oxland

The dirt which causes bending rods is coming from the EGR valve. Some people have the EGR valve deactivated to avoid the dirt deposit in the intake.

David

The glow plugs on my '87 are marginal these days. Not quite ready for replacement, but nowhere near as good as new. If I lived in a cold climate it'd be replacement time for sure, but they'll go another year or two down South. I just give 'em another 5 seconds or so first time in the morning.

I think they age out with time as well as number of starts/milage on the car.

Did you have to pull anything besides the intake manifold? I'm not really looking forward to that job myself.

- Jim

Thanks gentlemen for the reply,

I've already taken care of the egr valve, doesn't seem to be much sense in letting the thing destroy the engine.

I don't have the car here at the moment but I do remember having to disturb all the clamping gear on the fuel injection lines and that the plastic clips were all heat affected and brittle. You would probably happy if you had a complete set before hand. Cheap and satisfying.

One other thing interesting about the glow plug job was that about 2 years after replacing them starting performance started to drop again. Let the dealer have a go and they couldn't explain it. Just went back to watching the poor starts and then one day SWMBO (she who must be obeyed) came in and said that it didn't glow or start at all. No glow plug indicator. Checked the 80 Amp fuse in the glow plug relay and it was blown. What was more interesting was that it's clamping screws were both almost loose and that clamping pints showed signs of heating. This would have interfered with current flow and caused a premature rupture of the fuse. New fuse for 85 cents, properly tensioned, and all's right with the world.

David Oxland

Most of the crud in the intake is from coked oil, not exhaust -- the EGR is after the trap oxidizer or replacement catalyst, so there isn't as much soot as one would normally get on a diesel. The hot exhaust gases coke the blowby onto the manifold, whence it can chip off in hunks and go flying.

Better prevention than disconnecting the EGR is to clean the intake once in a while, and use synthetic oil since it won't coke anywhere near as badly as dino oil.

Glow plugs last a while, but do go bad. The pencil type are subject to heating element sag -- the element will weld to the side rather than the tip, so the tip doesn't heat. They will have a little blister 1/8" or so from the tip when this happens. Keeps them from working properly, as the tip is what ignites the fuel, not the side. Classic bad fuse is cracked almost all the way through, only makes good contact intermittantly. Cheap fix.

Peter

__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

Is it reccomended to take off the intake manifold and clean it out? I've got 247K and it runs 100% but I don't want a bent rod anytime soon.

BTW, I was blabbing with a MB mechanic I trust very much about these 603 engines and he said he sees about the same failure rate between the 300 and 350's. Bent rods, cracked heads, rods coming out of the side of the engine. I saw a 350SDL on his lot with 147K with a rod sticking out of the block. I dont think there is anywhere near the failure rate on these 300's but he seems to think so...