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  #31  
Old 01-28-2010, 12:16 PM
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SOLVED

This problem seems to be this little documented check valve, A 000 476 37 32 AND/OR line A124 470 95 75--

Both of these parts are highlighted in the pdf and photos.

I changed all the clear lines anyway, but they weren't the problem, with the old line and valve in place, it still created an air bubble in line 32 within 20 minutes and the rough run was still there.

Checking the check valve, and I discovered it to be inoperative. Further investigation of the 606 engine manual, denoted a mod to the return line from the filter to the rubber line that connects to the hard line to the tank "For improved starting."

Apparently, the hose and non-return valve prevent air entering the low side supply from the top of the filter and the tank return valve.

See the next post for parts lists and EPC images.

Attached Thumbnails
606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dsc_4162.jpg   606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dsc_4161.jpg   606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dsc_4158.jpg   606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dsc_4157.jpg  
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Fuel low pressure circuit.pdf (234.4 KB, 309 views)

Last edited by markg612; 02-06-2010 at 12:44 PM.
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  #32  
Old 01-28-2010, 12:21 PM
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Shopping lists

I've included both the 47 FUEL TANK and 07 INJECTION PUMP EPC images and shopping lists for the project.

Good luck one and all!
G
Attached Files
File Type: pdf 47 FUEL SYSTEM.pdf (77.3 KB, 254 views)
File Type: pdf 47 GROUP LIST.pdf (206.6 KB, 172 views)
File Type: pdf 07 INJECTION PUMP.pdf (107.8 KB, 204 views)
File Type: pdf 07 GROUP LIST.pdf (233.7 KB, 313 views)
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  #33  
Old 01-28-2010, 12:44 PM
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Location: San Antonio, TX, USA
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nice work in tracking this down!

I just picked up my first benz- '98 e300. an earlier poster suggested a Diesel Purge treatment. I have used this previously on my VW tdi. What is the recommended technique for doing this in the 606 engine?

thanks in advance
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  #34  
Old 01-28-2010, 12:55 PM
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I know some guys like it and claim to see improved performance, I've had 3 60X variant cars with over 750K miles accumulated, of which 200k were mine--I've never used it or thought I needed it, but that's just me. Servicing the injectors and cleaning the intake and charge tubes would be my first choice, but again, that's me.

The supply and return metal line ends are below the washer fluid tank-Separate them there and follow the directions with the product and on their site--it's really well spelled out and pretty simple.
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  #35  
Old 01-28-2010, 01:01 PM
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thanks for the reply mark. the car has 195K mi on it and i want to do this as preventive maintenance- no apparent problems with the car. my practice has been to do a DP and change the air filter, run a tank of fuel, and then change the oil. I just want to have a good maintenance baseline.

EDIT: found the procedure- sorry for the interruption
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=113596&highlight=diesel+purge

Last edited by mi benz; 01-28-2010 at 01:13 PM.
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  #36  
Old 02-06-2010, 11:12 AM
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A 000 476 37 32 Non return valve & line A124 470 95 75 w/valve

More photots
Attached Thumbnails
606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dsc_4167.jpg   606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dsc_4169.jpg   606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dsc_4171.jpg  
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Mark
========
THE WHITE FLEET
2016 GLE300d 4-MATIC 38K BROWN!
2012 S350 Bluetec==94k WHITE

2007 ML320 CDI==166K WHITE (FOR SALE)

Under new management:
2005 E320 CDI--140K--WHITE
1995 E300-Diesel-133.5K--THE CAR IS BLUE
1986 300SL--97.5K (European) AND WHITE. Back in Europe!
1991 190E 2.3-73K California Perfect.--WHITE
1995 E320-Wagon-159K--WHITE (recently scrapped)
1987 300D Turbo-213K--WHITE
1987 190D 2.5 Turbo-288K--WHITE

Last edited by markg612; 02-06-2010 at 12:45 PM. Reason: spelling
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  #37  
Old 02-06-2010, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markg612 View Post
A 000 476 37 32 Non return valve & line A124 470 95 75 w/valve
Holy Buckets!!!!! $132.00 from Mercedes!!!!!
I guess I need it, but sheesh.......
Not in stock either.
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'05 Acura TL 6MT
2001 ML430 My Spare

Gone:
'95 E300 188K "Batmobile" Texas Unfriendly Black
'85 300TD 235K "The Wagon" Texas Friendly White
'80 240D 154K "China" Scar engine installed
'81 300TD 240K "Smash"
'80 240D 230K "The Squash"
'81 240D 293K"Scar" Rear ended harder than Elton John
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  #38  
Old 02-06-2010, 12:40 PM
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Tell them $91.80 or you'll go elsewhere on line--also, Hoehn Mercedes Benz will sell wholesale to all comers--Jeff is the parts manager, but just press a little. The valve it self is $70

http://www.hoehnmercedes.com
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  #39  
Old 02-06-2010, 11:25 PM
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Well, I've got to do something. Drove the car today and it simply would not go. It was smoking like it blew a head gasket trying to accelerate up a hill. I had to pull over and let a couple of cars pass. I couldn't hold 35mph.
I guess I will replace the primary and secondary fuel filters since I've never done that since I had the car, but that really isn't consistent with the fact that it runs better once it completely warms up. Even though it warms up and runs better, it still cuts out tremendously at high rpms.
I guess no matter the cost I'm gonna have to get one of those hoses. BTW, is it just as easy to replace only the check valve? I guess one could cut those clamps off, replace check valve and re-clamp?
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Jimmy L.
'05 Acura TL 6MT
2001 ML430 My Spare

Gone:
'95 E300 188K "Batmobile" Texas Unfriendly Black
'85 300TD 235K "The Wagon" Texas Friendly White
'80 240D 154K "China" Scar engine installed
'81 300TD 240K "Smash"
'80 240D 230K "The Squash"
'81 240D 293K"Scar" Rear ended harder than Elton John

Last edited by JimmyL; 02-07-2010 at 03:03 PM.
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  #40  
Old 02-07-2010, 10:22 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: NW Connecticut
Posts: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg612 View Post
This problem seems to be this little documented check valve, A 000 476 37 32 AND/OR line A124 470 95 75--

Both of these parts are highlighted in the pdf and photos.

I changed all the clear lines anyway, but they weren't the problem, with the old line and valve in place, it still created an air bubble in line 32 within 20 minutes and the rough run was still there.

Checking the check valve, and I discovered it to be inoperative. Further investigation of the 606 engine manual, denoted a mod to the return line from the filter to the rubber line that connects to the hard line to the tank "For improved starting."

Apparently, the hose and non-return valve prevent air entering the low side supply from the top of the filter and the tank return valve.

See the next post for parts lists and EPC images.
My 99 E300D does not have this check valve. Does the mod suggest installing one if the vehicle does not have one or only replacing it if it was a post mod factory install? I am preparing to start the process of replacing all of my fuel lines, o-rings, and delivery valve washers. Now would be the time to add it if I should. Two weeks ago I had my intake manifold off when I replaced all of my glow plugs and injector nozzles. I wish I had know about my fuel system problem then. Oh well, I guess I will become proficient at IM removal and install. LOL! At least my car starts easily now when cold as long as the fuel is there. And what a difference in performance with the new Bozio nozzles. Can you say Rocket!
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99 E300 TD, Mostly wifes car. I'm going to steal it from her.
90 GMC 3500, 4X4 dually. My, I dare you to cut in front of me, truck
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65 Harley Panhead
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  #41  
Old 02-18-2010, 01:37 PM
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Location: Huntsville, AL
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Stumble Solved??

Markg612

So, let me get this right. The cure to you stumble/rough warm up was the little check valve in that line near the fuel filter?

I also have the exact same symptoms, and have had them for quite a while, but it really started as a very light stumble when I slightly ease into the gas pedal at low highway speeds. The stumble has gotten worse over the years (yes years) to the point where it blasts out a puff of smoke when it happens. THis stumble was around before the now present "great start up followed by rough skipping idle after the glow plug cycle". The car can go the entire 10k miles between oil changes without burning a drop so I assumed the compression/rings were good until I read the post from the other member talking about intake valve issues. Scary because I believe when warming up I see puffing in the joint of the pipe that goes back toward the turbo from the egr valve, but only when the motor actually misses. It has also gotten to the point when when warm the car will "load up a bit", meaning, it will not run bad at all, but once warm, if I sit and run for a while, it will smoke like hell for about a few hundred feet, but still run perfectly. Wouldn't know it's happening except for the pretty good cloud left in my rear view mirror. Definitely fuel as it stinks of diesel when it happens so it's fuel not burning oil. Sucks to be a motorcycle following me at that moment.

I have been looking at other posts referring to injectors and pop pressure and spray patterns etc thinking that might be my problem/cure as my car is pushing the 300k milestone on the originals. I figured that just might be it, but the injectors on peachparts are $105 each so I hate to experiment with $650. I am also now a bit unsure if I would have to send them to someone to have all the pop pressurea tested on the new ones if I do go that route.

In any case, I will look tonight, but as a previous poster mentioned, I to am not sure if I have this check valve in that line. Mine is a 1999 turbo. If it is just that line, and changing it fixes this problem, it's a dam good thing you are all the way up in CT because, though I am a somewhat homophobic guy (not that there is anything wrong with gay people - as Seinfeld would say), I might chase you down and kiss you for finding this out. As I said, I have been living with it for years and as it has slowly progressed. I have actually considered getting rid of the car, which I don't want to do. And trying to sell it running like this would just bring a price much lower than its worth.

Last edited by leszek; 02-18-2010 at 02:33 PM. Reason: Typo's
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  #42  
Old 02-18-2010, 02:51 PM
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Posts: 377
300K on a turbo car--ugh-my 602.962 was really tired at 285K--The valves take a beating from the turbo's extra heat and pressure over the miles.

I compression tested 606.910 and I do have one cylinder at 420PSI cold, the others are around 460 and one is over 500--I think I have the beginnings of valve recision, as the start issue got worse year over year--one other interesting point, it gets substantially worse with 5w40 synthetic over 15w40 and improves going back to 15W40--Mine too, no oil use between changes either weight. I went through the very same mental gymnastics in my elimination process to determine the cause. One supposition is the check valve helped during start when the engine was new, and as it looses compression over the years, the negative affect of the check valve open is accentuated by the lower compression at start due to age. Use the EPC on Startekinfo by vin number to determine if you car should have it installed.

Area 47, page 4 or 5 I think.

Also, I'm not 100% convinced my replacement of the plastic lines was totally for not. If there is any air in those lines, the engine is not going to like it. Also, the idle issue of load up, I had that too, and without question, since check valve replacement, gone, no issue.

Regarding the injectors, it cost me $12.50 each to have the injectors tested at a Bosch authorized repair center--The address is below--$25 each if they re-certify (re-shim to proper pop off pressure) them and $72 each if the nozzle needs renewing. Strangely enough, I think for the $78 bucks I spent, they may have tweaked or cleaned them, because the engine is super smooth, either that or the replacement of the heat shields and re-torquinng of the injectors set everything new again. An over or under torqued injector is a problem. The place below turn mine with shipping in 3 days. Sent UPS on a Monday, back in hand on Wednesday (yeah, I live close)


I sent my injectors to:

MAGIERA DIESEL INJECTION SERVICE
1145 E SUMMIT ST
CROWN POINT IN 46307-2728

ps--not CT, Chicago
__________________
Mark
========
THE WHITE FLEET
2016 GLE300d 4-MATIC 38K BROWN!
2012 S350 Bluetec==94k WHITE

2007 ML320 CDI==166K WHITE (FOR SALE)

Under new management:
2005 E320 CDI--140K--WHITE
1995 E300-Diesel-133.5K--THE CAR IS BLUE
1986 300SL--97.5K (European) AND WHITE. Back in Europe!
1991 190E 2.3-73K California Perfect.--WHITE
1995 E320-Wagon-159K--WHITE (recently scrapped)
1987 300D Turbo-213K--WHITE
1987 190D 2.5 Turbo-288K--WHITE

Last edited by markg612; 02-18-2010 at 02:55 PM. Reason: spelling
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  #43  
Old 02-19-2010, 01:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyL View Post
I guess no matter the cost I'm gonna have to get one of those hoses. BTW, is it just as easy to replace only the check valve? I guess one could cut those clamps off, replace check valve and re-clamp?
So, any advice on the whole fuel line as opposed to check valve only??? If it can just be re-clamped in the same position as the old one, it would save about $50 bucks......
__________________
Jimmy L.
'05 Acura TL 6MT
2001 ML430 My Spare

Gone:
'95 E300 188K "Batmobile" Texas Unfriendly Black
'85 300TD 235K "The Wagon" Texas Friendly White
'80 240D 154K "China" Scar engine installed
'81 300TD 240K "Smash"
'80 240D 230K "The Squash"
'81 240D 293K"Scar" Rear ended harder than Elton John
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  #44  
Old 02-19-2010, 09:41 AM
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Location: The Bay Area via Phoenix, Chicago and Minnesota.
Posts: 377
I would think so, clamps are clamps--the mercedes part number for the clamps are in the parts list back a ways. Changing just the check valve is easy, if you were to change the whole hose, you'd have to pull the washer tank out.

G
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  #45  
Old 02-19-2010, 12:34 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 19
Don't think I have a check Valve

I don't appear to have this check valve you are referancing on my 99 E300. I do have a small hose running off the side of the plastic fitting that the fuel line runs into that I don't notice on your photos in your earlier post. The hose runs up under the platic valve cover lid and if I remember correctly it runs to the little fitting on top of one of the injectors (I could be wrong on this). I looked at startekinfo.com but it is a bit pricey for a weekend mechanic to poke into for one or two pieces of info. I am guessing my setup is correct as it ahs been there for the many many years I have owned my car. I was really hoping this little check valve was the answer to my woes, but it does not seem to be the case. Here are three photos of mine. Any thoughts?
Attached Thumbnails
606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dscn1308.jpg   606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dscn1309.jpg   606 starts fast and perfect, smokes and misses till warm-dscn1310.jpg  

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