I'm debating on whether or not I would want to install a vegetable oil conversion kit inside Tank. This wouldn't be for a while yet, but even so, I'd like to know what's better.

I've seen 300D's advertised on eBay, with various sellers describing single tank conversions, as opposed to the trunk kits. (Not sure if there's a better term for that).

So the question I'm proposing is which is better?

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Never be ashamed to ask for help.

1985 300D
1987 300SDL
1970 Jaguar E-Type OTS
2002 Dodge Intrepid (Traded In)
2011 Ford Crown Victoria

You're going to get a lot of fired up folks so watch out.

Fisrt do some searching here. There are a lot threads about VO. The short is this: To run your car on veggie for any time length, you need lots of heat. VO that is to cold will cause all kind of problems. A single tank conversion starts up on VO at ambient temps. And even a 100F day isn't hot enough to burn the VO competely. VO needs to be atleast 160F to burn completely. A single tank conversion is cheap and simple and will not last very long. If you're going to run VO atleast put in a two tank system. This eliminates the cold start issues, but you still need lots of heat to make things last.

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The two tank systems are the best, and really only option if you want your car to last. The Idea is that you start your car on regular diesel and run it on diesel until the veggi tank has been sufficiently heated. At this point the car is switched to vegi. When you decide to turn the car off you once again switch to diesel to purge all the vegi out of the injection pump so that no cold vegi is in the pump on the next start up.
Even with all this however it is still not particularly good for the engine. You'd be much better investing your time in money in making or buying a setup to produce biodiesel from your vegi oil.

There is a lot of factors to determine whether single or 2 tanks is better for YOUR car. 2 tanks is always preferred if you do not mind the complexity and you value your car.

1) How long you want to keep the car?
2) How many miles on it already?
3) How deep is your pocket?
4) How much you paid for the car?
5) Home-brewed ( designed it yourself ) single or dual tank system or from vendors?

Home-brewed 1 tank can be had for < $150. 2 tanks system is much more. System from vendors varies but you won't see a lot of change for $1K for the cheapest one.

This is what I would recommend. If you use 1 tank, make sure to put after-glow circuit in to make the WVO burns better during cold start. Filter, filter and filter your oil. Install a diesel water separator to de-water your WVO.

I have had good results with my home-brewed 1 tank conversion. The after glow helps a lot and you can feel the engine idles much better during cold start. I am in SoCal with a garage, so the coldest morning may still be above freezing.

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Not MBZ nor A/C trained professional but a die-hard DIY and green engineer. Use the info at your own peril. Picked up 2 Infractions because of disagreements. NOW reversed.

W124 Keyless remote, PM for details. http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/mercedes-used-parts-sale-wanted/334620-fs-w124-chasis-keyless-remote-%2450-shipped.html

1 X 2006 CDI
1 x 87 300SDL
1 x 87 300D
1 x 87 300TDT wagon
1 x 83 300D
1 x 84 190D ( 5 sp ) - All R134 converted + keyless entry.

Gotcha. And I'm going to start searching through the old threads some more to see what's in there for info. I'm figuring there's a ton, since this forum must've been around for a while.

Since I live in New England, I think vegetable oil would be problematic for 75% of the year.

__________________
Never be ashamed to ask for help.

1985 300D
1987 300SDL
1970 Jaguar E-Type OTS
2002 Dodge Intrepid (Traded In)
2011 Ford Crown Victoria

Oh no he didn't

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What Would Rudolph Do?
1975 300D, 1975 240D, 1985 300SD, 1997 300D, 2005 E320 , 2006 Toyota Prius

Tanksowner, I'm a single tanker, don't like to mess with oil in trunk or in back of wagon.
I had about a 50/50 Blend of diesel and WVO and I started up this morning when it was about 20F. I plug in the block heater when i get up and an hour later, start it up.

I blend and in winter run more diesel or biodiesel. Gives me a chance to flush the system. I'm not convinced yet that a single tank system won't last as long. Time will tell. Depends on how much veg you burn and quality of oil. In general 2 tank is probably less wear and tear on the engine and IP. But I don't have any proof yet. Just seems like it would be. Maybe if you let your glow plugs stay on until engine is warm, it doesn't matter if your starting on straight cold veg oil. I can't see inside my engine very easy to tell.

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What Would Rudolph Do?
1975 300D, 1975 240D, 1985 300SD, 1997 300D, 2005 E320 , 2006 Toyota Prius

Just to get the ball rolling!!
Choosing what is better, a 1 or 2 tank system is like choosing what is better, a heart attack or a stroke !! But then its your motor, like your life, do what you like!!

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Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club group

I no longer question authority, I annoy authority. More effect, less effort....

1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
2001 jeep turbo diesel 130k miles
1998 jeep tdi ~ followed me home. Needs a turbo.
1968 Ford F750 truck. 6-354 diesel conversion.
Other toys ~J.D.,Cat & GM ~ mainly earth moving

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=242812

See this review of many manufactures and studies using unmodified (unheated-under 80C) veggie oil as a fuel by John Deere, Bosh, etc.

In a summary every attempt to burn over 10% veggie in diesel engines unmodified (under 80C) resulted in engine failure.

If you are going WVO-I would urge a good two tank system to heat the WVO to 80C+ before switching from diesel. Sadly most all single tank systems are like driving on bald tires. A blowout is not a matter of "IF" just a matter of "When"

General accepted theory is that 100% unmodified oil needs to be ~160*F to properly atomize and not strain the IP and needs to be injected into an engine at operating temperature to fully combust. There are other problems whence put into practice. Do lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of research and don't necessarily trust anything a company says, they're just trying to sell you stuff. Know what you are doing. VO needs an intelligent approach.

Oh, and grow a thick skin.

P.S. where are you in NE?

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1983 240D 3.0T 4-speed manual, now sold

1989 Subaru GL Wagon 5-speed Touring Edition

I've been driving my 2 tank sys for about 3 years now with no problems with the engine. I would describe my car as an experimental vehicle due to the badly rusted condition so it's no huge loss if it is destroyed (also a good excuse for driving around a "rustic" looking vehicle that some look down on).

winter b4 last I got to the point of just running on diesel for about 20 secs b4 changing over to veg, and it ran fine - and in summer I started not even flushing before shutdown (ie like a one tank sys). Then I had problems this year with the lift pump getting gunked up probably caused by that (got another from the wrecker for $20 - old one had broken piston spring). So now I make sure to diesel flush for 30 sec each shutdown.

Now I'm finding I need 4 or 5 min of running in these cold days b4 switching over. I also installed an electrically heated fuel filter to speed up the switch-over, but I think I need a strong direct line heater just before the fuel hits the injection pump to make it run a lot better, and I assume to protect the engine better judging by the above posts. There's one on ebay for $50 and I've got an idea for a simple home-made one..... Hopefully that would heat to the desired temp almost immediately on start up, so could switch over in 30 seconds or so.

OF course it's not nearly as popular in the NE due to problems in winter.

I think if I installed a sys in another car, I might go for a "Clayton's" one-tank system - a 2 tank system and the main tank has veg oil with about a 2 gallon flushing diesel tank, perhaps installed under the hood if it would fit, or in the side of the trunk. You don't need v much diesel at all, I only fill up about less than twice a year. NOw I think about it there'd be a case for putting some pretty concentrated flush in there instead of just diesel, seeing it uses so little.

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1983 300SD with bad undercarriage rust, with old greasecar 2-tank conversion. About 200K miles, just an adolescent but with premature bone disease.

I put a two tank system in my 240D in the fall of 2006 and just over 50k miles ago. I've not had any problems, no cold start issues, good acceleration, and a smoot idle. I do regular diesel purges, and VO filter changes, and I filter my oil to 1 micron before it goes into the car. Here is a few pics of my conversion - http://s35.photobucket.com/albums/d191/andrewlindgren/Veggie%20Conversion/

I'd be happy to chat you up about it in more detail if you like. Send me a PM if you like.

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That is an impressive system, how much? One thing my old greasecar does is the return veg line does not return to the tank but feeds straight back to the filter - gets the fuel hot quicker and keeps it hot. Now I'm thinking if I put a line heater in, to place the veg filter before the switch over valve so the fuel only gets filtered once coming slowly into the circuit, should make it a lot easier on the pumps. But not worth getting frostbite over so I'll wait a while.

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1983 300SD with bad undercarriage rust, with old greasecar 2-tank conversion. About 200K miles, just an adolescent but with premature bone disease.

IIRC it was about $1700, plus a labor trade for my custom tank. Father-in-law owns a welding business. I tried to not hack up the car so when I remove the system you'll never know it was there. This cost me a little more but it's been well worth it. Last year my wife drove about 20k miles and we spent just under $900 in diesel!
I have a delay timer for the return valve. So when I switch back to diesel the return valve doesn't close for a set time allowing me to not put VO in my diesel tank.

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It is a nice system. It is more complicated than I would like. The 'Return on Investment' is much longer on than single tank. There may be no ROI if the car craps out first, not necessarily due to WVO.

I bought a $700 300D with 300K+ when I first started out on WVO. My philosophy is that it was a car/money I can afford to lose. Installed a $150 home brewed 1 tank kit and have done 35+K miles WVO on it. At the time, it did not make sense to invest $1K+ for a 2 tanks system. It still does not. The 300D is still running strong but is on diesel/WVO blend now as it is my daughter's daily driver in NoCal. This car ROI is many many time over the purchase price and is still counting.

I am toying with a home-brewed 2 tanks system. This is the only 2 tanks system that I would contemplate. The idea is to put a washer bottle under the hood filled with diesel, purge the system with diesel using an electronic timer during cold start. When the car uses up the diesel in the IP, fuel filter and the lines then it will suck WVO from the stock tank. I have all the parts pulled from JY and it is a matter of finding the time to experiment with them. With this simple 2 tanks system, my plan is to have no switching valves, just a simple one-way check valve. That is to stop the diesel going into the stock tank during purging.

In essence, most people would recommend 2 tanks but I find 1 tank acceptable based on my personal experience and warm climate in SoCal.

Good luck.

__________________
Not MBZ nor A/C trained professional but a die-hard DIY and green engineer. Use the info at your own peril. Picked up 2 Infractions because of disagreements. NOW reversed.

W124 Keyless remote, PM for details. http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/mercedes-used-parts-sale-wanted/334620-fs-w124-chasis-keyless-remote-%2450-shipped.html

1 X 2006 CDI
1 x 87 300SDL
1 x 87 300D
1 x 87 300TDT wagon
1 x 83 300D
1 x 84 190D ( 5 sp ) - All R134 converted + keyless entry.