84 300SD restarting woes after filter change UGH! - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

DJNEWK2 · #1 01-05-2011, 06:52 PM

Hey guys!

I'm right next to a new (to me) 84 300SD that I'm thinking of purchasing and the previous owner let me take her on the road all day and upon our ride I noticed that she was a bit sluggish on hills and suggested we try to replace the fuel filters to start with so we purchased them earlier. Upon MY return from my own errands he has replaced both filters and of course NOW it won't start. He used STARTING FLUID to try to crank it and it ran until it ran that out of course and then he kept doing it but she won't start. I've told him to just screw the Starting fluid at this point and will just pull the filter and fill with fuel or check the lines individually cause I'm thinking its air... MY question is (since I don't use SF but WD40 if I was to spray anything) since not even SF is working,is that also due to possible air or would it just not burn at all?

What I mean is I'm HOPING it's just air since it ran fine (except for the sluggishness) and now it just turns over whether he shoots SF or not. Any suggestions or opinions for why it wouldn't start even to burn off the SF or would it just not start regardless (because its not reacting to the SF either although she turns over forever)? Just filled the tank with fuel too ugh. Any help is greatly appreciated and thanks in advance fellas!

BodhiBenz1987 · #2 01-05-2011, 07:09 PM

Pretty sure you have to prime this one! There should be a little hand pump on the injector pump. Crack the nut on top of the secondary (bigger) fuel filter and start pumping the pump until air bubbles stop coming out under that nut. Tighten nut and start.
That said, if this owner's been using starting fluid that liberally, I might hesitate to buy it.

DJNEWK2 · #3 01-05-2011, 07:26 PM

Thanks but which nut the LARGE ONE on top? I don't think he's ever used the starting fluid until he bought it today cause he's not a Benz guy (it was his uncle's)...he's a buddy of mine and he only tried that cause his idiot neighbor just gave it to him and told him the old ("I know someone who said to use starter fluid to get a diesel goin,etc") lol... I did see that it has the black pump near the other filter so at least its the updated one. I'm def buying it (only $200 cause he was gonna have it towed by those ''we buy junk cars" folks and they were gonna give him $100). His complex won't let him have another car there so it works out. No rust, new Behr Radiator,tint,chrome wheels,new tires,original Becker radio so I didn't care if it ran or not when he told me about it :-)

Anyway I'm gonna do what you suggested (too) but I was just wondering if the air would still keep it from starting WITH the fluid when he did it. Thanks and feel free to throw any more suggestions my way please!

layback40 · #4 01-05-2011, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BodhiBenz1987

Pretty sure you have to prime this one! There should be a little hand pump on the injector pump. Crack the nut on top of the secondary (bigger) fuel filter and start pumping the pump until air bubbles stop coming out under that nut. Tighten nut and start.
That said, if this owner's been using starting fluid that liberally, I might hesitate to buy it.

X2 on the priming.

I have always been lead to believe that the trouble with either is very spontaneous, ~ one bang & thats it. If the car doesnt have too much blow by, the rings/pistons should be fine. Just take the secondary off, fill it with fuel, prime/bleed it plenty loosen hard lines until you get fuel & it should start.
It sounds like the seller has never replaced the fuel filter before, probably likewise on other critical maintinance. You may want to factor that into the sale.
Good luck.

DJNEWK2 · #5 01-05-2011, 07:43 PM

Crazy thing is, the clear filter was just fine and I just poured the fuel out of the other one (MANN) and the fuel looked fine (although I guess that doesn't mean is wasn't clogged?). I'm def gonna change the oil and trans fluid regardless but I'm really wondering about the sluggishness once we get this thing fired up. Another issue is bugging me which is although the glow plug light didn't come on AT FIRST I assumed it had at least a bad plug or relay.It was a tad bit hard to start until I sprayed MY WD40 early this morning (40 degrees)... I'm gonna change the GP's anyway but can the plugs be bad although the GP dash light comes on?

BodhiBenz1987 · #6 01-05-2011, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJNEWK2

Thanks but which nut the LARGE ONE on top? I don't think he's ever used the starting fluid until he bought it today cause he's not a Benz guy (it was his uncle's)...he's a buddy of mine and he only tried that cause his idiot neighbor just gave it to him and told him the old ("I know someone who said to use starter fluid to get a diesel goin,etc") lol... I did see that it has the black pump near the other filter so at least its the updated one. I'm def buying it (only $200 cause he was gonna have it towed by those ''we buy junk cars" folks and they were gonna give him $100). His complex won't let him have another car there so it works out. No rust, new Behr Radiator,tint,chrome wheels,new tires,original Becker radio so I didn't care if it ran or not when he told me about it :-)

Anyway I'm gonna do what you suggested (too) but I was just wondering if the air would still keep it from starting WITH the fluid when he did it. Thanks and feel free to throw any more suggestions my way please!

Oh for $200, go for it! Sounds like that can't be a bad deal.
The large nut on top of the larger filter is the one you need to loosen. Just enough so when you pump the pump, fuel and bubbles come out from under the nut. Do fill that filter first, it will save you a lot of pumping time. The air would prevent it from starting even with the fluid, because even if the fluid ignites, it's just going to die if all it gets is air right after. The later models (the 86 and 87) are self-priming so you just crank and crank, but it won't work on the earlier engines.
As for the sluggishness, the filters could have been clogged without the fuel looking bad, although generally you'd see a bit of a yuckiness in the clear one. If it's still sluggish after the filter change, try a valve adjustment. That can make a huge difference.
Yes glow plugs can go bad without the light failing. I don't recall the process for testing continuity on the OM617, and can't look it up right now since I'm at work, but I'm sure one of these gentleman can chime in.

The light can also go bad without anything being wrong with the plugs or relay.

DJNEWK2 · #7 01-05-2011, 09:03 PM

She's good to go and running finally (after only a few pumps and just holding down the pedal) THANKS! I'm about to put her on the road for a sec to check on the sluggish behavior and will be back with an update!

newtodiesel · #8 01-05-2011, 09:15 PM

I wanna see a $200 SD, picts please...he's gonna be mad once u get it on the raod and see nothing is wrong w/ it. Dang good tires too, good for you

DJNEWK2 · #9 01-05-2011, 11:39 PM

I sure will post some before and after pics (although its mostly just gonna be elbow grease). He won't care since he thinks its too big and as he says HATES diesels lol. Its a cream color although its VERY dirty and the brown saddle interior is just dirty/junky as well. Luckily my other 300sd that has a bad motor (that's a story of diesel reliability in itself & I'll briefly explain later)has the same color interior thats flawless...my intention was to locate another motor for it but since this one has ZERO rust and the trunk doesn't leak and the body doesn't have one dent I'm gonna transfer anything I may need to this one from the other. I'm STILL gonna get another motor for "Goldie" cause I love the color and she gets compliments daily.

BTW, If there's any doubt about the robustness of these motors, let me share what happened to "Goldie":
As I have a selection of cars, I had Goldie in the garage cause I was changing the oil and I always let it sit either overnight or all day or whatever while I drive another car etc. Well anyway, since I ran her on Veg oil, I haven't bought fuel for her for a while now. My GIRL who sometimes works in TN (& I knew she was gonna drive one of the cars) decides she wants to drive the "free" car so she didn't have to fill up. Needless to say, I have NOOOO IDEA how I forgot about the oil change cause she moved the drain pan out of the way when she left! She was blessed (I think anyway) but she drove Goldie to TN and back to GA and when she got about 2 mi from home she stopped. Tow driver I was on the phone with when he got to it said it was my radiator hose of all things! I had him bring her (and my girl) on home and she started up AGAIN although I heard a loud ticking noise...She still starts and ticks loudly but if I accelerate she cuts right out and I know a rod or something is gonna give but I've come to the conclusion (a long time ago but confirmed now) that these are friggin tanks and now I have ANOTHER ONE Yaaaay!

pgringo · #10 01-06-2011, 03:13 PM

hold on a second! are you saying she drove the car with NO oil in the crankcase?!?!!!!

pawoSD · #11 01-06-2011, 06:09 PM

Lol, you'd be lucky to make it a couple miles in a diesel with no oil in the crank case.

DJNEWK2 · #12 01-06-2011, 06:42 PM

Yes sir THAT'S WHAT I SAID! She ticks loud as hell know but most def didn't have oil (and only had some duralube and Mobil oil whenever I changed the oil) but all I can say is maybe it was the duralube?? (and GRACE OF GOD) she made it back close enough to the house... I totally still change my oil like this but tell her NOT to drive and have put post it notes on the steering wheel if I leave so she doesn't do the same thing and really blow my motor lol!

pgringo · #13 01-06-2011, 07:14 PM

but it MUST have been the WVO that killed the motor.

DJNEWK2 · #14 01-06-2011, 09:39 PM

No,no I doubt if it was wvo but NO oil (& she aint "dead YET) lol

compress ignite · #15 01-06-2011, 10:01 PM

You WILL start buying LOttSA lottery tickets IMMEDIATELY !!!

1.Running (Which is basically what your buddy did) a Pre-Chamber,Glow Plug
Diesel on ETHER Invariably BURNS OUT the GLOW PLUGS! (RAPIDLY)

2."The Supreme Commander To BE" drove an SD from Atlanta,Georgia to
some place across the Tennessee Line AND BACK,with little or NO OIL?
[That's a Minimum 180 MILE round trip!!!]
I would be calling whoever Mercedes P.R. firm is (Or their In house Ad People)
THIS is the BEST, I've ever heard of!
(AND Stuttgart MIGHT give you a new one!)

(Although,I have to be honest with you...
Ain't No Way an SD DROVE to the COBB COUNTY LINE.Without an OIL PAN?)