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  #1  
Old 03-31-2012, 06:16 PM
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Just acquired 1987 300sdl with problems…. Need advisement

Hi all,
I’ve been browsing through these threads for the past few days, lots of good information from some very knowledgeable folks.

I just recently acquired my dad’s 300sdl, 260,000mi. My parents were the original owners and it was my dad’s daily driver until about 3 weeks ago. When I say acquired, my dad has now parked it in the front of my house as he no longer has garage space for it at his house. He just purchased a 2012 350glk after getting tired of having to deal with the sdl’s recent problems. I am posting here to ask for some advisement on how to proceed with the car. I’d appreciate any and all opinions on what is realistic. Basically I’d like to have the car fixed up but not sure if it’s worth it.

Here are the known problems:
1. The car still drives but, my dad gave up on the car after it began suffering transmission problems. This only started happening I’d say within the last year at around 250,000mi maybe. Specifically, at times, it doesn’t upshift from a stop. This will happen seldomly (maybe 1 in 3-5 times), but appears to be increasing in frequency lately. When it happens, I pull over for a second, put it in park, then put it back in drive, then it is good for the rest of the trip. We had it checked out at my dad’s mechanic, a Mercedes specialist here in San Diego and he said he couldn’t replicate the problem. He said he dropped the transmission pan and checked all the vacuum hoses but said everything looks to be in good condition. When the car is running fine the transmission does shift, but to me feels slightly jerky as opposed to smoothly.
2. After it had been left here at my house, I gave it a good cleaning interior and checked out the engine. I was depressed to find oil in the coolant reservoir. I asked my dad and he was not aware of the condition, so I am not sure how long it has been like this. We took it have it checked out at my dad’s mechanic again and he said it was headgasket, but advised my dad to continue to drive it and that it would still be ok. That is was basically not worth it to fix it and he also mentioned that he didn’t think he had the tools to perform the job any longer as it had been many years since he had to do such a job. (He services mainly newer Mercedes nowadays). He only flushed and refilled the coolant.
3. Even before the transmission and headgasket issue, the car did have quite a number of leaks, both motor oil and transmission fluid. My dad accepted this and just made sure to keep up with the oil levels and have the oil and transmission fluid checked and changed regularly. For me, if I am to keep this car for the long-term, I would like to address as many of the oil leaks as I can. Leaking oil on the driveway or in the garage is not fine, in my opinion. I mean I understand it is an old car but I’d like it to be in as proper working order as it can be.

Condition otherwise:
Like I mentioned, my parents were the original owners and I know the full history of the car from the beginning, I was in elementary school when my mom purchased this vehicle new. The car has been oil changed and serviced regularly. The car has always started right up, it has never left us stranded anywhere. The car is a Southern California car that has been garaged all of its lifetime. So there is virtually no rust and the body and paint is in good condition. There are no major dents, although there is some paint peeling on the trunk lid, it appears as some acid or something was sprayed on it. The interior is in ok condition, there are some cracks in the dash and a few cracks on the front MB-tex seats. Other than that everything in the interior: AC, radio, sunroof, clock, gauges, and all electronics are in good working condition. Only thing that is not working is the air doesn’t come out the center vent (I diagnosed the problem years ago to a cracked vacuum pump gasket, but had no way to access it to replace it).

Things that have been recently replaced:
New tires
New battery
New AC compressor and converted to the new Freon
New engine “stop button” valve was replaced (car wouldn’t shut-off with key)
New ignition tumbler replaced (key would no longer turn in the ignition)


Some information about me:
I am somewhat mechanically inclined if given thorough complete instructions, but I have not ever performed major engine work. In addition, I work full-time and my job requires me to travel 50% of the time, so I am not able to devote too much time to working on a project right now. My daily driver is a Nissan 350Z, so it would be nice to have a 4door vehicle as a spare car.

If I can find a knowledgeable reputable shop that could/would do the work (Our mechanic that we have been going to for years, doesn’t seem to want to work on it). I think I have some money to put into the car, if it is worth it.

So I’m basically asking what is the best way to go?
Just Let it go? (If I were to, I’m not sure how to sell a car with engine and transmission problems, so donating it would probably be how I would go, as I don’t have the time to part it out and sell it piece by piece.)
Or try to have it repaired? (If so, any recommendations on where to take it or if you think I would tackle it on DIY, complete and I mean very detailed instructions on how to work on it). What other things would need to be considered for replacement/repair.

Also, how much do you think all in all it would cost to have it running right and would that be better spent just getting a used other car?

Thanks in advance for reading my rather large posting. I know it is long, but I wanted to frontload as much information as I could to help you make an informed opinion on the matter. Looking forward to your responses.

BTW, I also been watching some of the YouTube videos put on by mercedesource, I wish this shop was local to San Diego. He just purchased a 300sdl as a project car.

Thanks again,
Jay

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  #2  
Old 03-31-2012, 06:38 PM
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Welcome to the forum.

How much money do you have to spend on the car? Search OM603 and cracked head. It may only be the head gasket, but if the engine has been overheated it could need a new head.

You need to find a mechanic that is familiar with older models like you have.
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  #3  
Old 03-31-2012, 07:17 PM
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Especially since the car is "in the family," it may be worth fixing (a) if the car has emotional ties for you and (b) you plan to keep it for another five or ten years. Based on your description, it sounds like the engine needs (at least) a new head gasket and, depending on the head number, a new head [new to the car, could be previously used]. The transmission probably needs an overhaul, too. Those are the big things.

Replacing the head gasket and/or the head may be within your ability but given that you work, you should plan on the car being in your family's garage for a week or more. I replaced the head on my '87 300D Turbo (same engine as yours) and it took me several days because I was learning as I worked. I don't know how many shop hours are given in the books for that kind of job; perhaps someone here does. Multiply by $100 per hour to arrive at a total if you have to pay someone to do the job. Add $1000 if the head is to be replaced with a (used) later number. A head gasket kit and other parts (you never know what you'll find) will add at least another $500 and I am being very generous -- others will want to double my numbers.

Getting the transmission fixed is also expensive and is something that very few people can do themselves. The least expensive way would be to buy a used transmission; your total cost might be as low as $1000 but you are shooting craps as the "new" transmission may die in a few thousand miles. People usually go that route only for cars they are selling, so that the problem goes away with the car. Such folks also have the ability to install the transmission themselves so their cash outlay is very low. You may not have that luxury. Rebuilt transmissions are available, somewhere around $1500 plus shipping and installation. Results are usually good although some have had reliability problems. A complete overhaul with R&R by a reputable local transmission shop that stands behind its work will cost you around $3000 (California prices). You may be able to get the work done for less but caution is advised.

Bottom line: It's probably not worth it. You could buy a similar car in better condition for less than it would cost you to repair yours. This is a pity, because your car looks good otherwise and it would be a shame to have it hauled off to the junkyard.

Jeremy
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Our all-Diesel family
1996 E300D (W210) . .338,000 miles Wife's car
2005 E320 CDI . . 113,000 miles My car
Santa Rosa population 176,762 (2022)
Total. . . . . . . . . . . . 627,762
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  #4  
Old 03-31-2012, 07:44 PM
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No upshift is typically caused by a faulty kickdown switch (under the "gas" pedal) or solenoid (on the right rear of the transmission). The easiest way to check the switch is to remove the fuse (I think it's either 5 or 8, but check the decoder map for "AT kickdown"). If that doesn't "fix" it, the itself solenoid may be mechanically sticking. You can service it from under the car, without even removing the pan.

Head/gasket has been discussed.

Engine oil leaks: cooler lines (plenty of threads), oil pan gasket (PITA), rear seal (PITA), front seal (not so bad), pan extension (on left side, easy).

Transmission leaks: many O-rings are accessible from the "outside" without removing the transmission: governor cover, B2 and B1 piston and reaction valve, etc. Shift shaft. They will need some hunting to ID which is the troublemaker.
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  #5  
Old 03-31-2012, 07:50 PM
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the repair of the head has been documented many times over here on the forum, it sounds to me like the car is in fantastic shape and spending 2 or 3K fixing the problems with it should be done.
that said, you could likely sell the car as it is for around $1.5K if you document the problems the car has, a mechanic will likely buy the car from you, perform the repairs himself, and sell the car for 5-9K in SoCal... or up north where they are less plentiful in perfect shape...
Please let us know what you decide to do.
oh, one more thing... has the trap-ox been replaced by the dealership? if not, you may be due a free repair, and possibly a free replacement head (EXTREMELY RARE< SO DON"T COUNT ON IT...) above the turbo, if you have a shielded pipe, it's been done, if you have a round muffler thing there, it's not.
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  #6  
Old 03-31-2012, 09:11 PM
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elaborate on the "stop button" valve. do you just mean the stop lever on the engine? i ask because your mechanic said the vacuum system was fine, but the car not shutting off with the key is a very obvious vacuum problem. it could affect how the transmission shifts, for sure. when you say it won't upshift from a stop, do you mean it's slipping?
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  #7  
Old 03-31-2012, 10:21 PM
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Car looks pretty good. You need to properly diagnose the problems then decide. Personally, if it only needs an engine & transmission, I'd buy them & install.

You may have something much simpler to fix. Every time I think something bad is wrong, it turns out to be an inexpensive repair.

You REALLY need to find out the problem and not sit back guessing.
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  #8  
Old 04-01-2012, 04:08 AM
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Thanks to everyone for your responses. Please know that I am reading everyone’s replies and taking in the information. I truly appreciate it.

@Bio300TDTdriver - The engine has not overheated to my knowledge. Although there is oil in the coolant reservoir, the temp has managed to stay at 80° steady even with the AC running. And I agree, since my dad’s mechanic seems unwilling to work on the car, we would need to find a trustworthy shop knowledgeable with working on this engine. That might be the most difficult thing for us. As long as it is prudent, I can come up with the funding for the repairs. Key word being prudent.

@Jeremy5848 – If it were to be repaired, I would not mind keeping it for 5 years or more. I am a fan of the styling of W126 chassis and am astounded with its overall durability after 25 years “in the family”. Also very impressed with the efficiency of the diesel engine, over the years we’ve experienced up to 30mpg with this big boat of a car. That is good especially in these times of high gas prices.

@BoiseBenz – I will check the fuse out tomorrow. I did watch the youtube video from mercedes-source which explained the kickdown switch causing no upshifting transmission on his 300sdl a few days ago and afterwards I did shoot a bit of spray lubricant on the kickdown switch behind the pedal. It did not change anything that I could notice. In my own opinion and mind you, I am not at all that knowledgeable on these transmissions, I just have a suspicion that it is vacuum related. Not that there isn’t any vacuum, but more that it is not getting complete vacuum, maybe a slight leak? I don’t know if that makes sense or not. But the fact of the matter is: it doesn’t happen all the time. There can be weeks between occurrences, and then sometimes it can happen twice in one day. To be more specific regarding the problem, it only has a problem “at times” upshifting from 1st gear into 2nd, meaning the car gets stuck in 1st. And it doesn’t happen all the time only sometimes, not necessarily frequently. When it happens, I just pull over, put the shifter into park, then put the shifter back into drive and it resolves itself and then it is ok for the rest of the trip. As long as the car shifts into 2nd there has never been any issue with shifting through the rest of the gears. I take the car on the freeway and it drives nicely at 75, 80mph and higher no problem.

@vstech – yes, the trap oxidizer was replaced by the dealer early on…. I believe we were part of the first wave of recall notifications… I wish I could get a free head from the dealer on a 25 year old car, that would be something.

@sleepstar – yes the engine stop valve lever was replaced around February 2012, but the transmission issues were prevalent months before that and they continue to persist after. One day it just didn’t want to shutoff after the key was out of the car; however, the lever was able to shut the car off. My dad brought it in and they diagnosed it as a faulty stop valve lever, it was replaced and the car shuts off fine now. Things like the vacuum central lock work flawlessly.

I elaborated a little more in my response to BoiseBenz above, but we have not experienced any slippage with the transmission, it is not upshifting from 1st to 2nd, this is from a stop. See my clarification above.

@ Junkman – Hopefully I can find a shop here that can give a proper diagnosis. When and if, I will cross my fingers that it is an inexpensive fix. I agree with you about the guessing, my first step in trying to figure it out is starting the dialogue with you nice folks here on the forum.

Thanks again everyone, please keep the dialogue going.
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  #9  
Old 04-01-2012, 08:39 AM
1986 300sdl 1985 380se
 
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Posts: 484
The A/C does not blow out of the front vents? where does it blow out of? If it only blows out of the defrost, that is a vacuum issue or a CCU issue. The default setting for the vents are defrost. I agree with checking the kickdown switch. Remove your carpet on the driver's side and UNPLUG the kickdown switch and drive it and see if the transmission still has the same issues. Also check every vacuum line under the hood. A dislodged vacuum line will cause the air to only blow out the defrost, and also will produce really weird shifting issues. Also check the actual vacuum hose where it attaches to the transmission itself. I have seen too many Benz owners give up on their cars for simple vacuum issues.
I love the color of your car. Same color as mine, although my interior is dark blue. As for the head gasket issue, if you decide to keep the car, find a good independent mechanic and let him do it. The MBCA site has a listing of good shops based on the state you live in. Good Luck.
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Old 04-01-2012, 09:01 AM
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Nice SDL !

Cheers, I am new to the Benz thing, bought mine last summer. So I will not give advice about the repairs. However, if you can swing it, keep her. The rust free body alone is the ace in the hole.
I bought mine at a yard sale for 500, it sat for 3 years outside and was not running, but up here 500 is the scrap value so I gave it a go.. I drive and fix as required. It spreads out the parts cost. As for the big jobs, eg trans and head fix and repair,, I will buy parts based on my budget over 3 to 4 months and plan to fix over the winter in the basement. Having said parts removed and cleaned up first. I am not, a qualified mechanic, but with the advice of the guys on this forum I have and will do the repairs myself. You have a nice car there and I wish you well in your venture.
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  #11  
Old 04-01-2012, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayq View Post


@sleepstar – Things like the vacuum central lock work flawlessly.

Central locking operates from a separate pump; it is not related to your other issues which, as other posters have said, could very well be vacuum-leak related.

Jeremy
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"Buster" in the '95

Our all-Diesel family
1996 E300D (W210) . .338,000 miles Wife's car
2005 E320 CDI . . 113,000 miles My car
Santa Rosa population 176,762 (2022)
Total. . . . . . . . . . . . 627,762
"Oh lord won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz."
-- Janis Joplin, October 1, 1970
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  #12  
Old 04-01-2012, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayq View Post

I work full-time and my job requires me to travel 50% of the time, so I am not able to devote too much time to working on a project right now.

If I can find a knowledgeable reputable shop that could/would do the work (Our mechanic that we have been going to for years, doesn’t seem to want to work on it). I think I have some money to put into the car, if it is worth it.


Just Let it go? (If I were to, I’m not sure how to sell a car with engine and transmission problems, so donating it would probably be how I would go, as I don’t have the time to part it out and sell it piece by piece.)
Sadly, this vehicle has reached the end of its economic life. The cost to restore it to a reliable daily driver is absolutely prohibitive if performed by a mechanic. You're looking at a minimum of $6K in just the transmission and engine, alone. If the head is cracked, which is a definite possibility, you're looking at an additional $2K just for the part.

As you stated, you do not have the time to perform the work yourself. Even if you did, and did it for the love of the vehicle, you'll still invest more than $5K by the time you're finished (others have spent considerably more on the exact same vehicle).

And, when you get finished, you'll have a vehicle that is worth, at the very most, about $4K.

It's worth next to nothing in the current condition. One of the forum members might take it for the scrap value ($500 or so).

It's worth noting that most of the members who posted on this thread never owned one of these vehicles and have no clue as to the costs associated with fixing them. My experience is based on the two that I currently have and the one previously possessed by "Hatterasguy". He has a litany of posts from about five years ago regarding the repair of this vehicle. He spent over $10K on repairs to this vehicle and he DID NOT need to remove the head.

The members here tend to look at the bright side when it comes to other people's money. Don't let them do it to you.
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Old 04-01-2012, 12:17 PM
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I kind of agree with BC It could be very expensive to maintain a 25+ year old MBZ unless you do the bulk of the work yourself. You can also over repair the car as it isn't worth much money.

However, you have all the time in the world to get it right slowly as it is not your DD. There is a right way and there is cowboy way to fix a car. There is cheap way or expensive way as well. Make a list of what need fixing and prioritize them based on safety, ease or costs. Do it gradually over time.

I spent very little money on my cars but they are all in tip top conditions, at least 3 of them. The other 2 in 'restoration' in progress. I use snake oil like 'Blue Devil' to fix head gasket with good success. So do not lose hope. I also work full time and do not have much time to work on them. I get parts from JY when they are on 50% sale, Ecology in San Diego.

You would find the SDL is a worth your time or money ( depends on how much ) to fix it up. My rule of thumb is that if it takes more than $3k to fix a problem then I will push it off the cliff or sell it. I live in San Diego and PM me if you want some pointers. Physical help, possibly, but I cannot promise.

Happy motoring.
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  #14  
Old 04-05-2012, 03:05 AM
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I definitely would not let it get scrapped. AKA "Donated" I am the owner of a 87 300D more importantly a "OM603" car as you are and as were most of the people commenting on this. Now i'm not saying that your car is worth much more than scrap in its state maybe a little more, but If you have owned a OM60xxxxx engined car, then you know the sense of pride you feel when you command one down the road. If you decide to let it go Im sure someone in your area is dying to fix one of those cars up and drive it. but make sure to get a second opinion of damage assessed before giving up. that car is at full depreciation and once road worthy again will hold its value for years to come.

If you have a hard time finding a cost conscience shop for your car, I have a friend that works at Mercedes of San Diego and he might know of a shop in that area that might not gouge you as bad. others on this site might know of a good shop down in that area too. You could start a new thread Im sure it would get lots of response.

There is a reason these OM60xx cars are horded by the people who know.

Last edited by davidlee; 04-05-2012 at 03:18 AM.
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  #15  
Old 04-05-2012, 10:27 AM
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There is a decent chance your mechanic is a perceptive fellow and knows the bills to deal with this problem at his level are not practical. On the otherhand between yourself and a good knowledgeable shade tree mechanic on ocassion you could perhaps handle this.

First you have to find out if the transmission really needs replacement yourself. Using this site and the archives. You do have some major advantages like you know the indicated milage is correct unless your father remembers any period of odometer failure.

It seems to me that a solid replacement engine and transmission known to be really good out of a wreck might be a cheap enough option. Members like Brian are also completly right. Unless you get directly involved and control costs including Major part aquisition it is not really practical.

In your case there is some personal sentimental value in the car having been in your family since new. If not pushed for storage space and time or need you might want to take some time to really think this through before deciding on a course of action.

Much depends on any residual atachment to this car from a family perspective. I for example would like to have one of my fathers cars to bring back over time.

Also depending on your age and experience in life you might learn some real scrounging abilities as well. There are a few cars that I regret selling over my lifetime. Changing your mind after it is gone is usually not workable. Remember that you do have a rust free body so you are far from starting with nothing.

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