Need comments on this 300TD - Page 5 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

redoubthill · #61 07-26-2014, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tortoise84

You said you wanted to get feedback on problems with the car that we see from the pictures. Well, here's a big one you can't fix: the odometer reading.

The $30K+ price point for a W123 300tdt realistically is reserved for pristine show cars that have 50k mi or less. But hey, if you're Jerry Seinfeld or Jay Leno, who are we to stop you.

Even Jay Leno would not spend that kind of money for the wagon, he has more sense than that.

adt21 · #62 07-27-2014, 09:23 PM

Guys,

Checking back in to let you all know how this turned out. Sadly, I did not end up buying the car, couldn’t get past the pin striping and ended up not being crazy about the way the Manila Yellow showed. It was too close to banana, further from the butter tone that I had been expecting. Some things you only can find out in person. So no long haul with my wife and bewildered children with the discomforts of road mollified by the long conversations that only come late at night on the American highway.

We did have a fantastic time in LA, city of cheese, city of elegance. The flash flood on the Universal tour hasn’t changed a bit, the city around it, however, shucks and jives. Gluten is being shot on sight, while kale is being grown for profit in the highway medians. The Getty is brilliant, Richard Meir’s masterwork. When the aliens come visit I’m taking them there, not for the Monet’s but for the gardens, the buildings, the space and the light. I probably would not take them to Manhattan Beach for rowdy sushi where the fish is pretty good and the waitress’ dace on the tables, at least until me and the aliens got to be friends.

As for the car and the shop. Both were outstanding. JG and Sean were both there and are stand up guys doing high-level work at a fair price. They were happy to let me, and the children for that matter, spend a good amount of time touring their shop. Standards are high. It reminded me of the time I worked as a cabinet maker for a guy who was making furniture, mostly by hand, one piece at a time, on a bespoke basis. This was back in the early 1990s He executed at a level of craftsmanship and attention to detail driven only by an internal commitment to a standard. My employer, a great guy, did not find it easy to discover clients willing to pay the $8000 a dining room table would cost. He understood why this was true but once made a point to me that I have not forgotten. He maintained that the cost of a piece furniture, made to the level he made it, hadn’t change for a 1000 years. If you wanted lived in France in 1215, or Italy in 1660 and wanted a table made by a guy who knew what he was doing it would cost whatever it took to convince a man to spend of month of his life to cut the wood, mill, join and finish it. During that time the man would have to feed, clothe and shelter himself and his family, create or rent a space to work and purchase and maintain his tools plus pay taxes the church would take and the taxes the king would take. Somewhere in that price also was the years it had taken the man to develop the skill set that allowed him to do the work he did. My employer said that’s why 95% of the people in 1215 or 1700 for that matter today were unwilling or unable to pay the price and, today, bought factory produced stuff, or in the past, made their own tables in their spare time, using time that was free, tools and space they already owned without the concerns of taxes. Some few achieved quality, most did not.

With all due respect to the many who are dismayed at the price of these cars, keep this in mind. And yes, there will be some on this board, a few professional mechanics, who can achieve similar results in their spare time. I’d be surprised, however, if anyone could rent some space, buy tools, put up a sign and make a living at doing what they do for prices much different than they are asking for their work.

So, once again, thanks to all for your thoughts and opinions, they are always appreciated. And, as it happens, I’m still looking for a wagon. Anyone out there got a good one?

vstech · #63 07-27-2014, 09:56 PM

good speech. I agree.

look over my post on your thread, and look over the ones I posted.

what color are you looking for? what year? what features.

JB3 · #64 07-27-2014, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adt21

Guys,

Checking back in to let you all know how this turned out. Sadly, I did not end up buying the car, couldn’t get past the pin striping and ended up not being crazy about the way the Manila Yellow showed. It was too close to banana, further from the butter tone that I had been expecting. Some things you only can find out in person. So no long haul with my wife and bewildered children with the discomforts of road mollified by the long conversations that only come late at night on the American highway.

We did have a fantastic time in LA, city of cheese, city of elegance. The flash flood on the Universal tour hasn’t changed a bit, the city around it, however, shucks and jives. Gluten is being shot on sight, while kale is being grown for profit in the highway medians. The Getty is brilliant, Richard Meir’s masterwork. When the aliens come visit I’m taking them there, not for the Monet’s but for the gardens, the buildings, the space and the light. I probably would not take them to Manhattan Beach for rowdy sushi where the fish is pretty good and the waitress’ dace on the tables, at least until me and the aliens got to be friends.

As for the car and the shop. Both were outstanding. JG and Sean were both there and are stand up guys doing high-level work at a fair price. They were happy to let me, and the children for that matter, spend a good amount of time touring their shop. Standards are high. It reminded me of the time I worked as a cabinet maker for a guy who was making furniture, mostly by hand, one piece at a time, on a bespoke basis. This was back in the early 1990s He executed at a level of craftsmanship and attention to detail driven only by an internal commitment to a standard. My employer, a great guy, did not find it easy to discover clients willing to pay the $8000 a dining room table would cost. He understood why this was true but once made a point to me that I have not forgotten. He maintained that the cost of a piece furniture, made to the level he made it, hadn’t change for a 1000 years. If you wanted lived in France in 1215, or Italy in 1660 and wanted a table made by a guy who knew what he was doing it would cost whatever it took to convince a man to spend of month of his life to cut the wood, mill, join and finish it. During that time the man would have to feed, clothe and shelter himself and his family, create or rent a space to work and purchase and maintain his tools plus pay taxes the church would take and the taxes the king would take. Somewhere in that price also was the years it had taken the man to develop the skill set that allowed him to do the work he did. My employer said that’s why 95% of the people in 1215 or 1700 for that matter today were unwilling or unable to pay the price and, today, bought factory produced stuff, or in the past, made their own tables in their spare time, or using time that was free, tools and space they already owned without the concerns of taxes. Some few achieved quality, most did not.

With all due respect to the many who are dismayed at the price of these cars, keep this in mind. And yes, there will be some on this board, a few professional mechanics, who can achieve similar results in their spare time. I’d be surprised, however, if anyone could rent some space, buy tools, put up a sign and make a living at doing what they do for prices much different than they are asking for their work.

So, once again, thanks to all for your thoughts and opinions, they are always appreciated. And, as it happens, I’m still looking for a wagon. Anyone out there got a good one?

I think you are fundamentally missing the point of everyone posting here about the price. "These cars" are not priced at 36 thousand dollars. THAT car is priced at 36 thousand dollars. Big difference. "These cars" can be had all day for 8-15 grand in fabulous shape. in decent usable shape they can be found for 3-5 grand even.

You want a nice wagon, make your budget 10 grand and take a look at all the cars available in that price range.

The problem with someone paying WAY BEYOND market rate for one of these old diesels, is that it gives an artificial boost to the perceived value for the rest of us in the market. You seem to be consistently deaf to all the comments here pointing out just how ridiculous that price is. Yeah, you can pay 36k for an old wagon from a good shop, but you would be a fool to do so.

To give you some perspective, earlier this year I was GIVEN a 300D sedan with less mileage on it than the car you went to look at. thats free, zero dollars, and ran like new. The car had a little rust, but was completely usable.

tortoise84 · #65 07-27-2014, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JB3

To give you some perspective, earlier this year I was GIVEN a 300D sedan with less mileage on it than the car you went to look at. thats free, zero dollars, and ran like new. The car had a little rust, but was completely usable.

I want YOUR friends! So how long have you known Jay-Z?

Skylar Diggins gets Mercedes from Jay-Z's company - ESPN

JB3 · #66 07-27-2014, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tortoise84

I want YOUR friends! So how long have you known Jay-Z?

Skylar Diggins gets Mercedes from Jay-Z's company - ESPN

some guy on this very forum listed it. i put a windshield in it and sold if for the price of the windshield to another forum member.

im just trying to convey to adt21 that the mileage alone doesnt boost the price through the roof. yeah, the guys working on these cars at mercedes motoring are craftsmen, but its not a one off piece of furniture, its a mass produced machine, all starting at more or less the same quality in that realm.

dont pay mercedes motoring a huge price because they bought a car and refreshed it, look around for the car mercedes motoring bought in the first place and buy it yourself. you dont have to pay new car prices to get yourself a nice old reliable diesel.

Skid Row Joe · #67 07-27-2014, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adt21

Guys,

Checking back in to let you all know how this turned out. Sadly, I did not end up buying the car, couldn’t get past the pin striping and ended up not being crazy about the way the Manila Yellow showed. It was too close to banana, further from the butter tone that I had been expecting. Some things you only can find out in person. So no long haul with my wife and bewildered children with the discomforts of road mollified by the long conversations that only come late at night on the American highway.

We did have a fantastic time in LA, city of cheese, city of elegance. The flash flood on the Universal tour hasn’t changed a bit, the city around it, however, shucks and jives. Gluten is being shot on sight, while kale is being grown for profit in the highway medians. The Getty is brilliant, Richard Meir’s masterwork. When the aliens come visit I’m taking them there, not for the Monet’s but for the gardens, the buildings, the space and the light. I probably would not take them to Manhattan Beach for rowdy sushi where the fish is pretty good and the waitress’ dace on the tables, at least until me and the aliens got to be friends.

As for the car and the shop. Both were outstanding. JG and Sean were both there and are stand up guys doing high-level work at a fair price. They were happy to let me, and the children for that matter, spend a good amount of time touring their shop. Standards are high. It reminded me of the time I worked as a cabinet maker for a guy who was making furniture, mostly by hand, one piece at a time, on a bespoke basis. This was back in the early 1990s He executed at a level of craftsmanship and attention to detail driven only by an internal commitment to a standard. My employer, a great guy, did not find it easy to discover clients willing to pay the $8000 a dining room table would cost. He understood why this was true but once made a point to me that I have not forgotten. He maintained that the cost of a piece furniture, made to the level he made it, hadn’t change for a 1000 years. If you wanted lived in France in 1215, or Italy in 1660 and wanted a table made by a guy who knew what he was doing it would cost whatever it took to convince a man to spend of month of his life to cut the wood, mill, join and finish it. During that time the man would have to feed, clothe and shelter himself and his family, create or rent a space to work and purchase and maintain his tools plus pay taxes the church would take and the taxes the king would take. Somewhere in that price also was the years it had taken the man to develop the skill set that allowed him to do the work he did. My employer said that’s why 95% of the people in 1215 or 1700 for that matter today were unwilling or unable to pay the price and, today, bought factory produced stuff, or in the past, made their own tables in their spare time, or using time that was free, tools and space they already owned without the concerns of taxes. Some few achieved quality, most did not.

With all due respect to the many who are dismayed at the price of these cars, keep this in mind. And yes, there will be some on this board, a few professional mechanics, who can achieve similar results in their spare time. I’d be surprised, however, if anyone could rent some space, buy tools, put up a sign and make a living at doing what they do for prices much different than they are asking for their work.

So, once again, thanks to all for your thoughts and opinions, they are always appreciated. And, as it happens, I’m still looking for a wagon. Anyone out there got a good one?

Not sure why you didn't buy the car? The obvious >"banana yellow color"< was rather apparent to me from the pics? "Pin striping." Seriously!? Pin striping would be a deal-breaker on a 30 year old car??!

adt21 · #68 07-27-2014, 11:15 PM

Really, that's it. Didn't like the color, thought it would be a milder tone of yellow, also was bothered by the pinstripe more than I thought I would be.

As mentioned, still looking for a good wagon though, apparently, not a very yellow one. Colors I'd prefer are dark green or brown, could do red too. Blue interiors a no go but most others OK.

Skid Row Joe · #69 07-27-2014, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adt21

Really, that's it. Didn't like the color, thought it would be a milder tone of yellow, also was bothered by the pinstripe more than I thought I would be.

As mentioned, still looking for a good wagon though, apparently, not a very yellow one. Colors I'd prefer are dark green or brown, could do red too. Blue interiors a no go but most others OK.

My first Mercedes-Benz was used. It was pin striped, and had a blue interior.

Best car I ever owned.

adt21 · #70 07-27-2014, 11:29 PM

Like them eye-talians used to say, De gustibus non est disputandum

Skid Row Joe · #71 07-27-2014, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adt21

Like them eye-talians used to say, De gustibus non est disputandum

I don't understand foreign languages. What did you post?

Did you have roundtrip airlines tickets to get home from California?

ah-kay · #72 07-28-2014, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adt21

Like them eye-talians used to say, De gustibus non est disputandum

De gustibus non est disputandum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

ah-kay · #73 07-28-2014, 01:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adt21

It reminded me of the time I worked as a cabinet maker for a guy who was making furniture, mostly by hand, one piece at a time, on a bespoke basis.

I hope you understand what "bespoke" means. It is custom made or made to specification. The W123 wagon is NOT custom made. They are mass produced in the thousands. NO W123 can command that kind of money unless it is gold plated by the restorer. If you want a trip to LA then just say so. There is no need to bring us all along to look at the car. I doubt that you intended to spend that kind of money on a mass produced car in the first place. It is a flimsy excuse to give it a pass because of pin-stripe and color.

t walgamuth · #74 07-28-2014, 05:18 AM

I smell a fish.

I think we all just got our chain yanked.

adt21 · #75 07-28-2014, 08:12 AM

Nope, no chain yanking at all. Whole thing has been in earnest and, for that matter since I'm still looking for a car, continues to be in earnest.

It's important for me to have the board know that you guys are not being toyed with. One is that I really am looking for one of these cars and am sure you guys can help me. The other is that its never a good feeling to think that you're being played, which is the last way I want to repay your generosity. If anyone really wants to verify feel free to shoot me PM and we can communicate off-line.

With respect to the question of "bespoke." You're right, what the MM guys are doing does not involve creating something from scratch or a great deal of the design process that is the hallmark of a bespoke whatever. However I think the word has value in this setting since the rehabilitation of the cars they are doing involves a series of decisions individual to the cars, as well as a fluid and personal work process that very different than the mass production model under which the cars were created. This process is a lot closer to what happens in a craft process than in a factory process. The shop, by the way is a fantastic space.

Meanwhile, I'm in the market for a good wagon, anyone have/know of one? Happy to pay fair price.