Hi all,

I am new on the forum and I thought I best join up as I have been having a read through a few threads on here.

I am planning on getting a W210 E300 Turbodiesel estate (Wagon) over here in the UK soon, I decided on a W210 E300 turbodiesel as it has the OM606 engine in - something I know is strong in OEM configuration without needing to mod internal parts.

I am getting the car as a second car, its going to be used as a 'sleeper' and to go to Santapod drag strip for a bit of fun. I do like diesel tuning as its quite easy to get a fair bit of extra power out of diesel engines (although the tuning rules are reversed versus a petrol car with rich on boost being bad!).

Anyway, I just wanted to sense check a few things:

I believe the fuel pump isn't 100% mechanically run - which bit is run electronically?

What sort of power can a stock autobox take usually (I am aware that its usually the torque that kills autoboxes) - I would like to keep an auto box as this can be remapped for different shifts and also with an auto there is no loss of boost between shifts as there is with a manual.

What size as the stock pump elements? Are they 5.5mm or 6mm? Can I change the elements myself or should I just buy a premodded pump (guessing from an OM603)?

What is a safe boost pressure to run? I have seen it up to 3 bar, however I am guessing around 2 bar is going to be safer (and more controllable).

Can injectors be upgraded easily or is it all done at the pump end?

I am basically looking for a diesel sleeper probably running around the 400bhp mark - I have learned that sometimes less is more as higher power cars simply can't get the power down whereas a slightly lower power car can hook up easier, especially on street tyres.

Thanks in advance!

Try this forum - Diesel Performance Tuning - PeachParts Mercedes ShopForum

1) If you don't need the estate for practicality, a saloon is lighter.

2) The control side of the IP is electonic - throttle, idle, etc. There is no mechanical linkage between your foot and the IP.

3) 6mm elements [edit, 7mm previously was a typo], at least in US spec. Replacing standard size elements is not a job you do at home. Larger elements more so. Fortunately, you're in the same continent as Myna in Finland and Dieselmeken (Välkommen till Dieselmekens sida!) in Sweden.

4) There's a lot of flow capacity in the OE injectors.

5) 400 hp in a Diesel probably means more torque than your box will handle for extended periods.

6) Get in touch with forum member shertex who is very happy with his chip - http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/355106-om606-unleashed-my-1998-e300-chip-tuning-experience.html

Sixto
MB-less

Thank you for replying, I like the estate idea as it looks less likely to be running bigger numbers, however I will see what cars are out there when I do get one. My other car is a small Clio 1.5dci hatchback so if I need to move anything around the estate might be useful! I do however agree with the weight saving so I will look into that.

I am going to have a look into how the standard pump could be controlled, I believe some parts of the pump are mechanical, its just the actual fueling control via the rack that is electronic?

I will be looking into getting 7.5mm or 8mm elements - how much power can the stock 7mm elements support? I have already have a look at the pump services of those suppliers, the issue might be getting a stock mechanical pump though as those are quite expensive now!

That's good to hear!

I will get in contact with that members, I know that some ecu remappers can have a torque limiting map which might help save a stock box.

Well there is a short run of mechanical cable from the pedal to electronic system, changeover point is located next to the engine bay fuse box. Maybe adjustable, but probably not.

Take a look at Black Smoke Racing, they have done outrageous things with a OM606. Read they used an AMG E55 trans to handle thier over powered engine (600hp??) Gotta love those wacky Finns. I think they work with Dieselmeken.

__________________
Treetops
06 E320 CDI 127K Miles
87 300TD 231K Miles

99 E300 269K Miles-Sold

Oh, yes. I never understood why the potentiometer is under the hood rather than in the cabin.

Sixto
MB-less

I would want to know exactly what rocketchip changes in the tune before spending money on it, from what I have heard about their VW TDI tuning they have a bit of a hack approach compared to the more skilled tuners. For a project I would think swapping the om606 into an older car might be better, I have a w210 e300d and I don't really like it, its way more fragile and complicated than even a w124.

The OP didn't mention Rocketchip. But since you brought them up...read around and you'll find that Jeff's tunes are well-regarded in both the VW and MB communities. I got a Stage 2 done on mine and it's great...well worth the money.

__________________
14 E250 Bluetec 4Matic "Sinclair", Palladium Silver on Black, 154k miles
06 E320 CDI "Rutherford", Black on Tan, 172k mi, Stage 1 tune, tuned TCU
91 300D "Otis", Smoke Silver on Tan, 142k mi, wastegate conversion, ALDA delete

19 Honda CR-V EX 61k mi
Fourteen other MB's owned and sold
1961 Very Tolerant Wife

Since you're in the UK, I was impressed by these guys in my research. Evolution Chips. Europes Premier ECU Recalibrating Company.

__________________
14 E250 Bluetec 4Matic "Sinclair", Palladium Silver on Black, 154k miles
06 E320 CDI "Rutherford", Black on Tan, 172k mi, Stage 1 tune, tuned TCU
91 300D "Otis", Smoke Silver on Tan, 142k mi, wastegate conversion, ALDA delete

19 Honda CR-V EX 61k mi
Fourteen other MB's owned and sold
1961 Very Tolerant Wife

Just a point of detail, the stock elements are 6mm. I'm running a 7.5mm pump currently with no other mods. My rear tire traction is the torque limiter in the drive train...

__________________
-Evan


Benz Fleet:
1968 UNIMOG 404.114
1998 E300
2008 E63


Non-Benz Fleet:
1992 Aerostar
1993 MR2
2000 F250

Thanks for letting me know, are you running the stock pump but with upgraded elements or have you switched to a fully mechanical IP?

Stock pump with upgraded elements. As far as I'm concerned, there's no reason to switch to the mechanical pump. Performance upgrades didn't set any codes and peak output can be adjusted with a chip or by altering the rack feedback circuit.

__________________
-Evan


Benz Fleet:
1968 UNIMOG 404.114
1998 E300
2008 E63


Non-Benz Fleet:
1992 Aerostar
1993 MR2
2000 F250

Thank you for replying again, I was getting to the point of getting concerned I would need to spend £££s on a mechanical pump. I figured that the part electric pump would be the same.

It also makes sense for it not to throw codes as the ECU still thinks its fueling with stock elements so would just fuel as it would do normally. I thought that it would also be simple to adjust the feedback from the rack as well as if the signal is slightly altered then the ECU won't know exactly where it is and so will overfuel.

Are you still running a stock turbo? Did you get the pump rebuilt professionally?

The EDC pump is identical to the mechanical pump, for all practical purposes, from the rack controller forward. Same pump elements and delivery valves fit both.

The EDC in the W210 is not very sophisticated compared to a modern CDI. It has a MAF sensor but it's primarily for EGR validation. the system doesn't constantly monitor AFR and adjust fuel, it pretty much just looks at RPM, throttle input and MAP to determine fuel.

I'm still running the stock turbo but it's undersized. I'm doing the build up in stages so I can see the full effect of each modification. As for the pump, I bought and installed the elements myself (which you should not do but I was experimenting and was willing to lose the money on them if it came to that). I also built my own calibration machine to balance the pump output.

Ultimately, I will be installing a larger turbo compounded with a supercharger.

__________________
-Evan


Benz Fleet:
1968 UNIMOG 404.114
1998 E300
2008 E63


Non-Benz Fleet:
1992 Aerostar
1993 MR2
2000 F250

As long as the Mercedes tune doesn't end up breaking parts than yeah they are probably fine. I know on the TDI they will let the boost spike far beyond what the computer can read and what is safe for the turbo, etc. But, like I said, if you know what they change in the Mercedes tune and it isn;t going to damage anything I see no problem with it.

Yes, Rocketchip is pretty clear that, on a 606, a Stage 2 is the most you can do without hardware modifications.

__________________
14 E250 Bluetec 4Matic "Sinclair", Palladium Silver on Black, 154k miles
06 E320 CDI "Rutherford", Black on Tan, 172k mi, Stage 1 tune, tuned TCU
91 300D "Otis", Smoke Silver on Tan, 142k mi, wastegate conversion, ALDA delete

19 Honda CR-V EX 61k mi
Fourteen other MB's owned and sold
1961 Very Tolerant Wife