617 IP $&^##@% rear bolt - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

OM617YOTA · #1 12-24-2016, 07:33 PM

Merry Christmas all, and happy whatever you celebrate to those who don't do Christmas.

I'm swapping the IP on my 617 in my truck, and attempting to do so without removing the oil filter tower. I have everything loose/removed save the rear bolt. I have the two bolts holding the bracket removed from the block, just working on the last one connecting the bracket to the IP. I've gotten it loose, just having to get in there and lean way down and get one finger from each hand on it and keep rotating it 1/10th of a rotation at a time.

Thus far I have spent more time on this one bolt than I have on the entire rest of the removal procedure, including removing the other IP from my spare engine(lots of room to get to that bolt).

Now, calling down the wrath of the Mercedes gods upon me...............do I really need to put that rear bracket back on? Anyone go a significant amount of time without it with no issue?

The IP is both a fairly heavy and fairly long assembly creating lots of leverage on the mounting point, and Mercedes wouldn't have put that bracket on there if they didn't think it was unnecessary. The engine vibrates a good bit, so that's even more stress. I'm also not in an MBZ luxury car application, my truck is taken offroad and bounces around plenty. I'm sure the 617's in G wagons have that bracket.

Guess I've pretty well talked myself into putting it back on. Thoughts?

kerry · #2 12-24-2016, 07:47 PM

Somebody recently posted a picture of the Mercedes OE tool for that bolt. Perhaps that or a facsimile would make the job easier.

dkr · #3 12-24-2016, 07:55 PM

There's a wrench you need with a funny bend in it. I tried finding it on eBay for you, but wasn't able to. I do see them from time to time.

Dkr.

leathermang · #4 12-24-2016, 08:03 PM

I tried googling '$&^##@%' but could not find it...

mach4 · #5 12-24-2016, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OM617YOTA

.......do I really need to put that rear bracket back on? Anyone go a significant amount of time without it with no issue?

I've no first hand experience, but the reading I've done here and other forums would tend to indicate that it's no problem running without it. Personally, unless I were swapping the IP on an engine out of the car, I'd do without....but I'd keep the bracket and install it the next time I had the engine out.

Can't help you with the "special" wrench - I've never seen one.

Edit: Here it is: http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/shopcart/TOOL/POR_TOOL_MERCED_pg115.htm

Looks easy enough to make if you've got a welder....
Good luck

Steve_in_NV · #6 12-24-2016, 09:36 PM

Is this the $&^##@% tool you're looking for?

https://**************.com/store/ip-snake-wrench-adjusting-removing-om-61x-injection-pump

A good source for Mercedes stuff

Dan Stokes · #7 12-24-2016, 09:40 PM

I had to pull the oil filter canister (or whatever you call that thing). Then I jettisoned the bracket. But my duty cycle is, as previously noted, not typical. I can say, however, it has caused no problems. Dieselmeken says that the bracket is not critical, IIRC. At least SOMEBODY who knows more than I do said that!

In my mind's eye I'm thinking about how all that looks and wondering if you could cut a notch at one or more of the bolt holes so you could just loosen some or all of the bolts and just slide the bracket out for future removals. Not sure if that would work - I'd have to go look at the spare engine and chew on the concept a bit. Or how about if you made a bolt with a LONG head so it sticks out where you can get on it instead of buried back in that restricted area? More thoughts.

Dan

mach4 · #8 12-24-2016, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve_in_NV

A good source for Mercedes stuff

...or not. I would agree that it is a source, but not necessarily a good source.

No reason to buy from them anyway as it's available from our sponsor.

Rogviler · #9 12-24-2016, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve_in_NV

Is this the $&^##@% tool you're looking for?

https://**************.com/store/ip-snake-wrench-adjusting-removing-om-61x-injection-pump

A good source for Mercedes stuff

I have that wrench and it will definitely get more places than a simple 90-degree one.

Disagree that it's a bad source for stuff, but obviously it's passe on here since it's a competing vendor.

-Rog

vstech · #10 12-24-2016, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogviler

I have that wrench and it will definitely get more places than a simple 90-degree one.

Disagree that it's a bad source for stuff, but obviously it's passe on here since it's a competing vendor.

-Rog

The concensus here is he overcharges for plagerized mb training and parts... it is a taboo topic here for the competitive source anyway.

ROLLGUY · #11 12-24-2016, 10:44 PM

I usually leave the bracket, as it holds the other end of the return spring. It is not hard to put back in while installing the IP (I've done many). The bolt is a different story. I have successfully installed one before, but it took at least an hour to finally get it in and tight.

OM617YOTA · #12 12-24-2016, 10:45 PM

Thank you gents, really appreciate your help with weird wrenches and input on running without the rear bracket.

Got the IP off, will start reassembly tomorrow. Depending on how time goes, I'll either run without the bracket or bend up some wrenches.

After the new IP is on and running smoothly, I'll tear down the old one and do an autopsy. Fingers crossed, hopefully this is the issue!

Thanks again.

OM617YOTA · #13 12-24-2016, 11:51 PM

HAH!

Per the FSM:

"For loosening and tightening of fastening nuts or screws on supporting bracket, use self-bent box end wrench 13mm."

Accompanied by a little diagram indicating a 45 deg bend. Yeah I'll be bending a wrench tomorrow. Good times.

Rogviler · #14 12-25-2016, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vstech

The concensus here is he overcharges for plagerized mb training and parts... it is a taboo topic here for the competitive source anyway.

Eh, don't want to pay for information I can understand (never seen evidence that it was bad though). Don't want to buy Chinese parts I can understand (though this site sells plenty). I just don't understand the vilification. Personally, when I look up a thread on something, half the time there's five different answers, some of which are blatantly wrong. So that's what free can get you.

In either case, know what you're buying or not buying. Take everything with a grain of salt. The tools I've bought get a thumbs up from me. Beats tracking something down and hoping I don't screw it up when I modify it to work. And I LOVE making tools, don't get me wrong.

-Rog

funola · #15 12-25-2016, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OM617YOTA

......

The IP is both a fairly heavy and fairly long assembly creating lots of leverage on the mounting point, and Mercedes wouldn't have put that bracket on there if they didn't think it was unnecessary. The engine vibrates a good bit, so that's even more stress. I'm also not in an MBZ luxury car application, my truck is taken offroad and bounces around plenty. I'm sure the 617's in G wagons have that bracket.

Guess I've pretty well talked myself into putting it back on. Thoughts?

You gave good reasons to put it back on. I'll add that everything has a natural frequency, when that natural frequency is reached, vibration can amplify and if strong enough could cause cracks. That bracket is for support and prevent the IP from vibrating.

When I did the timing adjustment in my 85, I used a 13 mm gear wrench on that end bolt, wedged in place (so it does not fall off the head of the bolt). A long piece of wood shaped to fit as a wedge works best. The gear wrench can be placed from up top by looking down between cyl head and oil filter housing while reaching from below the oil filter housing with the wrench. With the gear wrench, you can spin that bolt on/ off in a few minutes.