When getting parts to do a maintenance run on the wives recently acquired 2012 Volkswagon Passat. Please allow I live up in Canada. Two things where quite noticeable.

Aftermarket parts in far too many cases where no deals. Many where about the same price as dealer parts. If not more expensive. This older 2012 costs about 400.00 to do a filters change and fluids for parts. With me providing the labor. I was all over the Canadain web. Shipping costs out of America are too punative out of America now to consider using their sites. The only reason I decided to take on the Passat diesel buyback. All warranty issues must be decided in the customers favor. Was clearly defined in the terms. Otherwise dealing with their customer service would have been a no way humanly possible situation. Dealers are even surprised that Volkswagon is stating to them. Just fix the issues.

Part two was really disturbing though. Many simple things like switches are over 200.00 no matter where you shop. You cannot help but notice this when parts shopping.

I went on to read an interesting article. On many newer car brands you should expect to spend about a 1500.00 average each year on general maintenance.

This would include consumables like brakes,tires and windshield wipers etc. For the first 10 years of ownership. So about 15K for maintenance in total. Plus additional costs for any real work not considered general maintenance.

Doing the work yourself will save money certainly. Yet overall the sources of cheaper decent aftermarket parts seems to have vanished up here in Canada.

I did talk the dealer into giving me a discount on parts. So in my opinion it really pays to compare dealer parts costs now more than ever. Some are even cheaper than aftermarket. Five liters of transmission fluid and filter including tax where 198.00. Actually cheaper than aftermarket up here. The recommended type 507 engine oil was cheaper than most sources there as well. Same with their oil filters. So a few things come to mind. On any brand new car purchase. Ask what the maintenance runs under warranty are going to cost. As it is getting to the point they insist they even do engine and il filter changes. Average price is reaching about 150.00 for this on many brands.

It is just part and parcel of the modern world I suppose. Buying brand new I probably would stay away from cars with timing belts. Or known really high general maintenance costs. There where two areas where substantial savings with aftermarket parts that still exit. Dealer prices on brake parts and cabin filters are best serviced aftermarket. The dealer price for a rotor and brake pad replacement on many brands is really punitive now. Versus quite economical doing it yourself.

Every one has to make a dollar I am well aware of. Yet almost three hundred for a power widow switch is really getting out of line. There are five hundred dollars in parts in the passats windshield washer system. High general required maintenance costs can displace any gains a brands fuel milage has. There is really something to be said for older cars now. In our case the old 2006 jetta is much easier on the wallet even though they have known issues.

The high parts costs is a relatively modern situation and plagues not only cars but also other durable goods like appliances. There's absolutely no reason for the parts to cost what they do other than "because they can". The underlying implication is to "encourage" you to upgrade rather than repair. Ironically, the cheapest car I have to maintain is the Mercedes 350SD. Even using OE parts, it has the lowest cost of parts and maintenance by a wide margin compared to my 1994 BMW E34 wagon or 2011 Honda Accord sedan.

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Current stable:
1995 E320 149K (Nancy)
1983 500SL 120K (SLoL)

Black Sheep:
1985 524TD 167K (TotalDumpster™)

Gone but not forgotten:
1986 300SDL (RIP)
1991 350SD
1991 560SEL
1990 560SEL
1986 500SEL Euro (Rusted to nothing at 47K!)

You are right of course. Part of the issue is we are a consumer based economy now. We have to buy buy and buy to sustain it. For those like myself.

I am really not into this in a great way. For young people I would suggest they get a know solid older car and keep it up. It is better than this massive depreciation and other costs of newer cars. Going with the current seemingly widespread debt loading to me is like becoming a gerbil on a wheel.

There was a time where I took my three year old car back to a dealer. Gave then a six hundred dollar cheque and drove away with a new one. A six thousand dollar cheque would probably not do it today.

More and more things are getting rigged in the economy. My brother in law asked me to order another crank position sensor last week. I went to my Chinese source. To find out he is now delisted. So instead of 12.00 delivered. The local price is two hundred. I did find another source after some more digging for 26.00 out of China.

A guy there was also selling the expensive original oil filters for a few brands dirt cheap. He seems to have been cut off from direct sales as well. I suspect while not certain is the big parts chains apply pressure to stop many direct sales now. Their markups on parts is some thing they do not want generally known.

I am more interested in mentioning these things for others to consider. We have our cars on expense accounts. So by keeping costs reasonable. The mllage fee rates are based on all the costs of brand new cars on them. We turn a decent profit over the course of a year.

I actually had a bad trip Friday evening. Not bad going down the hundred miles. Coming back a mile or so past the toll booths the traffic in the inside lane was stopped dead. I sat there for a few minutes and decided to get into the passing lane. It was on a moderate hill and the car was crabbing sideways about as much as moving forward on the ice. There was about 4 inches of snow on that ice. I got some stable traction and slowly built up some speed and got up the incline. I got up the hill and led a few other vehicles with my four way flashers on at about thirty miles an hour. No vehicle but one half ton truck passed me.. Yet as he got ahead he lost visability in the heavy snow and dark and slowed down to even slower than me.

They closed the toll road shortly afterwards as transport trucks where jack knifed across it. I only saw two in difficulty while going through. The one that could not get traction and held me up and another that had slid off the road. The crews that drive the salt trucks and snow plows are not typically hired back for about the next two weeks. So I do not know how they got that mess fixed. Before I went the trip nets decent money all in. The weather forcast and temperatures indicated a slight chance of what I got into. So I would not let the wife do it. We had talked earlier about I would do those runs. Some of the trips this winter if the forcast was not really bad but still questionable. I will never do the trip under a really general bad forcast. As it is always worse in the higher elevations. Hundreds of vehicles get stranded up there. For several days in the winter. In a matter of months these trips pay the cost of the Passat back. I figure Fridays trip paid the bulk of the used rims with like new snow tires cost for the Passat. Although I took the older Jetta.

Yes for sure on the exchange, CPO cars sell. AKA "the stealership" they quote an extravagant price for regular maintenance, then say hey you would be just as well off buying new. That is a win-win for the "stealership". They sell a new vehicle (mark-up for them) then pay a service tech a few dollars for for the maintenance items needed, then sell it as CPO, at a higher price.

The money spent to give the dealership an image. Was really impressive at that one the other day. I had a free coffee and looked on the showroom floor.

They have to so something about those side window total price sheets. They have to get them replaced with so much a month or whatever.

I really believe the total price of a new vehicle is of no interest to many buyers now. Instead can I afford the so much per month. is all they are interested in.

What a tool to get full list or the close to full list price out of them as well. We will throw in a set of floor mats to sweeten the deal comes to mind. As I have mentioned it keeps the economy going.

My girlfriend has a '13 Beetle TDI. So far she LOVES it.

I really like the torque, climb serious hills without downshifting. Not a huge fan of the DSG - I'm a manual type of guy. Save all your bells and whistles and gizmos and flappy paddles and "computer controlled manual" nonsense, if it doesn't have three pedals on the floor, it's an auto.

It's about due for it's first oil change. I was able to find everything for an oil change on Amazon for around $60, including 507 spec oil. This compared to my Subaru, for which oil changes cost $10 and everything can be sourced locally. I haven't priced any other repairs. She did get the warranty.

A powder blue bug has been her dream car for a long time. This purchase wasn't based on ease/cost of maintenance or good sense.

Barry, do you have access to the TDI block heater up there? I'm having trouble locating it down here.

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617 swapped Toyota Pickup, 22-24 MPG, 50k miles on swap

Seems as if diesel has lost its way. I have been driving diesel since the early 80s, you could work on that stuff with a hammer and a crescent wrench. One of the great joys of diesel was it simplicity,I look under the hood of our new powerstroke trucks and I don't even recognize some of that stuff.It has had a check engine light for one reason or another for the last 150,000 miles quite regularly. Our previous generation powerstrokes were stone simple.They ran well into the 400,000 mile range with virtually nothing done to them. The trucks finally rusted away.

I might as Canadian TDIs in those years were sold with them factory installed in Canada but not in America.. You want to have a look on how the factory version is installed. There was really no consistency. Our 2000 and 2006 models did not come with them in Canada.


If really difficult to install in the cars they were not supplied with.. Many used a magnetic oil pan heater. Most TDIs will start at really cold temperatures. Personally I just do not like the engine noise they produce when really cold.


The volkswagon buy back warranty is only good as there is one clause in it. Any warranty issues must be decided in the customers favor. If that clause did not exist I would have never touched one of these cars.


I have dealt with their so called customer service too many times. They can invent ways to avoid warranty work and will if they can. No is their favorite expression in my past with them. It is not only their company executives that should have landed up behind bars.

Make sure the transmission oil and filter get changed out at every 40 thousand miles without fail. These transmissions are expensive to deal with. They were substantially improved in 2011 but remained a work in progress as there were more changes in 2015. Including a real increase in the cost of the transmission fluid. As mentioned in a previous post I paid almost 200.00 Canadian or about 140 American for the dealer fluid and filter a few days ago. The aftermarket ones I found to be no cheaper plus I thought that it might be safer going with the Volkswagon fluids.

The right oil and filter for the engine should be cheaper at the dealers. Also ask for a discount. I was quoted about 6.00 American a quart and about ten for the filter in American dollars. From the dealer I purchased the automatic transmission fluid and filter from. Dealers should be cheaper than here in America as the dollar is stronger.

This is a big part why I only buy Mercedes diesels from 1976-1996. The other is the superior driving "feel".

I consider these loophole cars i.e. they defy the system you describe. The challenge is getting Mercedes to keep supporting with spare parts.

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Why I will never do business with "DieselKraut" again

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/mercedes-benz-used-parts-sale-wanted/378935-why-i-will-never-do-business-dieselkraut-again.html

There are all kinds of personal experiences in my life. A brand new car only stays new for a very limited time in my mind. Set priorities in your life. Buy a house instead if you do not own one should be higher on any ones agenda.


You only live once so get free of the treadmill as early as possible. Learn how to maintain cars is perhaps a good tool to learn how to select one for yourself.


This forces you to buy some tools. Usually the first time I used them saves me their cost over farming some work out. Then the majority of them are free for my use for the rest of my life. Their salvage value is minimal. I have no ideal of how much all my tools have cost. All I am aware of is they have saved me hundreds of thousands of dollars over the years. Even at age 77 I am reluctant to part with them.


Being at the systems mercy is not the best scenario. I have run across a newish trend. Taking advantage of peoples ignorance is becoming endemic.
People just do not know what is involved in many jobs. So those bidding on them can take advantage to an unbelievable extent.

Those prices sound steep....I've found parts prices on my GLK250 diesel to actually be lower in most cases than I was paying for W201/W126 parts. And I need a whole lot less of them! Fluids are generally expensive...but its like that with all modern cars.

If you want to see expensive maintenance, look no further than a recent (2011+) Subaru....they cost more to maintain on average than MB or VW.....and are in the "top 10 most expensive to maintain" vehicles list. :O Crazy considering they are just an "economy/average" car. A friend of my brother just forked over $2,500+ on his Forrester for tires and some "maintenance". He also paid far more for a brake job recently than I've ever paid on a MB, even my brother's W211 E350 with sport brakes package was cheaper.

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-diesel is not just a fuel, its a way of life-
'15 GLK250 Bluetec 118k - mine - (OC-123,800)
'17 Metris(VITO!) - 37k - wifes (OC-41k)
'09 Sprinter 3500 Winnebago View - 62k (OC - 67k)
'13 ML350 Bluetec - 95k - dad's (OC-98k)
'01 SL500 - 103k(km) - dad's (OC-110,000km)
'16 E400 4matic Sedan - 148k - Brothers (OC-155k)

I was not really cognizant of automotive price parts changes, Until I had a front caliper start dragging on the older 2006 volkswagon. Out of curiosity I asked the ex service manager of the largest Volkswagon dealer in the maritimes.


What does a dealer charge for this. He said for a caliper pads and a rotor. I will cost you about 600.00 dealer. You would probably get a new caliper though. Both front rotors and a set of pads aftermarket are only 66 dollars in Canada delivered. A rebuilt front caliper is going to be under a hundred. Calipers in general are more expensive in Canada by a substantial margin. Plus shipping out of America is too high to consider.

I thought at the time. That job on average takes very little actual time. So Volkswagon must really be marking up parts. We may actually get rotors here cheaper than in America.


Some time back and probably even now. They were cast in China and the finish machining was done in Hamilton Ontario. I do not buy coated rotors as I have had separation problems with the coatings. That is probably about all we get cheaper up here I imagine.

Update on my brother's coworker's expensive subaru maintenance:

It broke down on the highway today the day after he spent $2500 in maintenance and got the car back from the dealer. It "started shaking badly" before this happened. It has 30k miles on it.

Guess other brands aren't always flawless either...

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-diesel is not just a fuel, its a way of life-
'15 GLK250 Bluetec 118k - mine - (OC-123,800)
'17 Metris(VITO!) - 37k - wifes (OC-41k)
'09 Sprinter 3500 Winnebago View - 62k (OC - 67k)
'13 ML350 Bluetec - 95k - dad's (OC-98k)
'01 SL500 - 103k(km) - dad's (OC-110,000km)
'16 E400 4matic Sedan - 148k - Brothers (OC-155k)

I do a fair amount of auto repair work for friends/family members and I kind of agree with the above observations. Parts for Mercedes are pretty expensive but I really don't think they are much higher than parts from other manufacturers.

I've been astounded at some of the prices Toyota seems to be charging for replacement parts from the dealer.

Of course then there are other manufactures that don't have any parts availability after 12 years I think? I had an issue with the fuel tank sensor in my Dodge truck a couple of years ago and the parts counter guy at the dealership indicated they don't have any obligations to provide certain parts for vehicles 'that are too old' and this was a 1998 truck.

Dealership service and parts costs are high with ANY manufacturer. This is because dealerships have huge overhead costs. Walk around a Mercedes dealership and look at the amount of $$$ they've had to spend to equip their service departments. I'm guessing most people that think dealer parts/service are over priced and are constantly throwing around the 'stealership' term haven't run a high end business. Flame suit on.

If you think they are stealing from people open your own service shop - Im sure you'll make a killing providing an alternate service path away from the stealers.

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98 Dodge-Cummins pickup (123k)
13 GLK250 (135k)
06 E320CDI (323K)
16 C300 (62K)
82 300GD Gelaendewagen (54K)

Dealers for the last few decades have been encouraged to overbuild. By the manufacturers. The overhead is then really substantial.

If I just use their facility for service. . I would not want to feel I was buying a piece of it. They got so out of touch with many of their policies.

Three really strong independants operations have opened up locally. About 70.00 an hour and their mechanics are good.

One of the shops of theirs I was in was extremely well equipped. Actually to a suprising degree with lots of room and four hoists for two mechanics. They appear to be saturated with BMWs and other expensive brands.

They are not local mechanics and are obviously pulling business from a distance. I expect their hourly rate will increase. More Mercedes cars there than exist in our area quite frequently.