Just registered and shopping for MB - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

pdxman · #1 08-14-2002, 03:57 PM

Okay everyone, here I am. I've been reading the archives for the past few days after I found this site. I have always felt these types of sites valuable information.

I am a diesel owner for several years ( '93 F350 CC 7.3 ltr) and truly feel these are the most dependable machines. Now I want to bring a car diesel into the picture and MB seems to be a no-brainer decision as far as brand goes. Actually, I thought MB would be way out of my league price wise but after I started shopping do not believe this anymore.

I originally started looking at an '81 CD w/183k ($2495). But the coupes seem less available and do not want to be in a position where that eventually adds to costs.

My next look was at the early 80's (80-84) 300D. Like'em, lots of them, and priced reasonably. But what really got my fancy is the 300SD (84). I like the body style as it seems more modern and 'classier'. All vehicles that age seem to be pushing 200k which is fine as long as there are records to back them up. this seems to be a problem and I usually end the call with a no-thank you. I also frown on vehicles only owned for months rather than years.

Sorry for being lengthy, so heres my questions:

1. What year did the w126 body style start as I like this?

2. Did the 300D's have a 126? If not, what style number reflects the common 300D?

3. Should I expand my horizons on my choices or I am I in good company here? I am looking at spending less than $5k for this 3rd vehicle and use it as my commuter. I currently use my truck and getting better than 17 mpg is my goal plus rack up fewer miles on it.

4. Are there any issues with the turbos failing? pro's/cons on turbos?

5. How many quarts of oil in these? My truck is 10 qts every 3k miles and that $ adds up.

Thanks all and enjoy your site very much...Hope to be 'one of you' in the future!

diesel don · #2 08-14-2002, 05:51 PM

pdxman:

congratulations on joining the forum. it'll save you a million dollars a year in repairs if you enjoy being a DIY.
the 300D's in question are a 123 body style and i happen to be a fan of that. have four of them right now in a grand experiment to lower my cost per mile. its working well...
they hold 7.9 quarts per oil change and the general rule around here is 3k like with your truck.
i would highly recommend them if you find one with records and like the story. i've paid the following ($1000, 3100, 3100 & 5000) for mine and consider all a good deal. miles are racking up very inexpensively as i've not been to a shop in 15 months thanks to this awesome forum. parts are relatively cheap and can be ordered from home and delivered to your doorstep fast.
my turbo's have not failed and i don't hear too many horror stories in that department.
i can't answer many questions on the SD however. my cars deliver between 22-26 mpg.

don

Nate Stanley · #3 08-14-2002, 06:54 PM

As for pros & cons regarding the turbos, they seem to be very reliable. When checking out your purchase, remove the 3" u-shaped duct that connects the air filter assy and the turbo, and WITH THE ENGINE OFF you can spin the impeller with your fingers. If it runs freely with no side play, it's good.

This engine makes 77 HP without the turbo, 123 hp with-- and usually adds economy as well. Mine has 251K, and gets 24 MPG at freeway speeds consistently. Other owners on the forum have reported as high as 30+, the worst I ever got was 19.5 with 3 occupants, a trunk jammed full of luggage, and doing 70 MPH with a 20 MPH headwind.

These cars are excellent transportation values, and are extremely comfortable.

Get the best example you can afford, look for meticulous maintenance records, and enjoy!

suginami · #4 08-14-2002, 08:57 PM

Just to clear things up, the body style of the 300D that you're referring to is a W123.

The 84 300SD that you're referring to is a W126. This 126 300SD was sold from 1981 to 1985.

The body was cosmetically upgraded in 1986, and a 300SDL (long wheel base) model was offered for two years - 86 and 87. This car has a different diesel engine with an aluminum head and iron block, and these are also good cars.

Do not buy any of the diesels after 1987 as they are terrible.

kweimer · #5 08-14-2002, 09:08 PM

My vote goes to the 115 chassis diesels---220D, 240D and especially the '75/'76 300D's. Very simple and not overloaded with vacuum operated gizmos.

pdxman · #6 08-14-2002, 11:15 PM

A local small town paper currently has a '76 300d, 'mechanically sound' with left front end damage for $375 obo. Seems cheap even with the damage but is probably more than I care to work on.

MVK · #7 08-14-2002, 11:40 PM

Welcome
MVK

kweimer · #8 08-15-2002, 02:42 AM

That '75 300D sounds like worth going after except that local small town paper sounds like it is in Oregon. Much further than I want to drive my rollback.

dabenz · #9 08-15-2002, 10:40 AM

In plain language, the modern (to the people here) MB diesel engine started with the 220D in 1968, then got bored out and called the 240D. Then an extra cylinder was added and called the 300D. Then the turbo was added. Then they went to an aluminum head, which seems to be troublesome, and then to the six cylinder. I myself am only interested in the cast iron head.

All are unibody, with the rusting issues inherent with the unibody platform. All are independent rear suspension and are the best there is in terms of reliability.

MB liked to use vacuum for the fancy stuff like automatic transmission controllers, power door locks, etc. Expect leaks and maintenance on these items in an older car.

MB must have gotten Bosch electrical engineering rejects to do their glow plug system. Many variants, and all automatic systems subject to problems.

AC is an issue with any older car.

220D, 240D, 300D had W115 chassis until 1976. Considered one of the world's best engines, but the 220D and 240D are slow vehicles in today's "you look out for me" driving environment, especially with an automatic transmission. Perfect commuters in a low traffic density area with either transmission. 220/240D engines take less than 6qt in a "proper" oil change and get low 30s mpg when properly maintained.

W123 is considered one of the best chassis styles. Any 20 year old car sticks out, except the MB W123. Less of a rusting issue than W115 simply because they're newer. More than W124 simply because they're older. I have searched on this web site and am surprised to see very few turbo problems related to the turbo itself. No personal experience, but the issues look like only maintenance issues, in my opinion.

These cars are not for people who do not do their own work, unless they have deep pockets for overpriced and inexperienced labor. Just be aware that you may have to play catch-up due to the previous owner(s) unwillingness to do the maintenance. Catch-up may be a thousand dollars for parts alone. If you do your own work and keep the car then you can brag to your friends about having the lowest cost per mile in the neighborhood.

diesel don · #10 08-15-2002, 01:27 PM

kweimer:

Do you have 1000 of these cars or what? I was looking at your list. Very cool if I read it right?

don

kweimer · #11 08-15-2002, 02:25 PM

Don,
I don't have a thousand, but my wife thinks I am headed that way. I am sure you read my list right. What you see on my list is what I have. Not to mention a dozen Nissan 300ZX's and two dozen Nissan 200SX's (Nissans are 1984 through 1988). And a 1995 Nissan UD1800 rollback wrecker to haul my new acquisitions. And my old 1985 MightyMax pickup truck to drive to Pull-a-Part once a week to get more Mercedes parts. I continue to add to my Mercedes collection whenever I run into a good buy at impound yard auctions or even a private sale at the right price. I like to work on old cars, especially Mercedes. Being retired, it keeps me busy and out of trouble.

thebern · #12 08-15-2002, 09:02 PM

And I thought TXBill was obsessed.

diesel don · #13 08-15-2002, 09:55 PM

kweimer:

I'm speechless. I just brought my wife down here to read this so that I would look more balanced. I have three daily drivers and one that I'm storing for my son (takes driver's ed soon).

That's a great hobby and probably a fun investment. Do you think that the MB's will turn the corner in 5-10 years and begin growing in value?

Where do you store all of them?

don

kweimer · #14 08-15-2002, 11:07 PM

Don,
Who says we have to be balanced? Our best excuse is that we are not balanced!
As for daily drivers, I too, have three: 2 300D's and 1 240D. In passing, I have a 1990 Jaguar that stays in the garage most of the time because seems every time I start to take it for a drive the battery is run down because of all the electronics (runs down in about 4 days)---then I have to unhook the battery, recharge, then reset radio, alarm system, etc.---a real PITB. Like last week---I get into the Jag, turn switch---click---click---click. I go "outback", get into a 300D that has been sitting for 2 months, turn switch, start and go. I can leave a 220D/240D or 300D sitting for two months and not have a problem starting. IMHO I think the 115's will become more in demand as more people realize how solid and simple this series is---and you can't beat that tight turning radus. I can make a U turn where other drivers have to back up at least a couple times to make that turn in a tight situation.

I keep all these cars in my back yard (I have a 20 acre "back yard"---or as I call it, "outback"). The wife's 240D stays in the garage with the Jag. Unfortunately, due to insurance requirements, I cannot give the ones that run the exercise that they need. I already have 6 vehicles on insurance---and I can't drive but one at a time---and the rate is the same as if there were 6 drivers. Typical relatively inexpensive "classic car" insurance requires that cars be in showroom condition, garaged, etc.

Like you say, a great hobby and a fun investment. More fun than the stock market has been.

The Warden · #15 08-16-2002, 12:16 AM

pdxman, welcome aboard! I was in a similar situation not too long ago (in fact, I even have a diesel F-series; have you ever been over to Ford-Diesel.com?). I agree with the others; go for a cast-iron head. Aluminum head engines have a tendency to lose head gaskets way too quick.

Eseentially, from what I can gather, if you look at the new Benz models, the 300SD is the equivelant to the modern S-class, while the 300D is the equivelant to the modern E-class. I wound up choosing the 123 300D 'cause I wanted a turbo (live in the S.F. Bay Area; too easy to get run over if you've got a slow-moving vehicle) and wanted a smaller vehicle for a commuter driver (been driving physically large vehicles for a while; figured it was time to try something new

). The 126 cars are definitely bigger, more comfortable, and have more amenities...but I have one of those gut feelings that my 123 would survive a nuclear blast if theblast was far enough away to not physically melt the car down.

I too am a truck guy first and foremost, but I love my lil' 123

Good luck with your decision!