No start in the frigid Midwest - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

#1 01-30-2004, 12:38 PM

She sat in the parking garage for almost 20 hours and when I went to crank it over this AM she wouldn't go...battery starting to wear down so I called for a jump.

All glow plugs replaced last week and when it sat overnight for 10 hours in 0 degree weather it started OK.

Have I asked it to do too much sitting in -10 to -20 weather for 20 hours?

Oh, I also put some fuel treatment in the tank knowing how cold it would be over the weekend while we're out of town so I don't think that it's fuel gelling...

BoostnBenz · #2 01-30-2004, 01:29 PM

No block heater? Mine was in single digit temps for just 6 hours and refused to start, still setting in the parking lot 30 miles from here.... Maybe this thread could be of some assitance of things you could try.

psfred · #3 01-30-2004, 01:59 PM

Lucky me, my 300D fired right up at 3F this morning. First rotation, like normal.

What type and weight of oil do you have in there? For extreme winter use and outside storage, I'd use at least 10W30, maybe even 0W40 synthetic for the winter. Cranks MUCH faster than dino oil (the 0W40 pours like water at 35F).

Change back to the normal 15W50 in the spring.

If the oil is OK, your choices narrow:

Block heater if possible -- saves wear and tear on engine and starter.

New battery, make sure the cables are good on both ends.

Check starter and starting speed -- MB starters are known for getting high resisitance windings and running slow with very high current draw, can only be fixed with a new armature.

Valve adjustment on pre-603 engines. You ain't gonna start with slow cranking speed and low compression....

Some MB diesels just won't start without a block heater at 0F -- my brother's

Peter

#4 01-30-2004, 04:36 PM

Of course I have a block heater but was told by the hotel that they couldn't accomodate the plug-in.

Now they have indeed produced a long extension cord and I've been plugged for 2 hours or so.

How long do you think it'll take to "thaw"?

I just tried again but nothing doing.

psfred · #5 01-30-2004, 04:37 PM

You will probably need to let it run several hours, or until it warms up (don't know how warm the factory block heater gets). Probably gonna need a battery charge or jump, too.

Peter

JerryBro · #6 01-30-2004, 04:48 PM

My 84 will start after an hour or so, the 83 takes 3 or 4.

Jerry

JerryBro · #7 01-30-2004, 04:53 PM

My 84 will start after an hour or so, the 83 takes 3 or 4.

Jerry

BoostnBenz · #8 01-30-2004, 05:00 PM

One thing I've wondered is why if you have to plug your car in anyway that they can't put a car charger on that same set of wires so lets say you can get a battery warmer, battery charger, and block heater all going at once.

They all pretty well go hand in hand anyway, if it is indeed that cold out....

#9 01-30-2004, 06:09 PM

A nice guy with a chevy suburban with a diesel with 300k+ miles came from the local garage to give me a jump.

He felt that because there was no smoke while cranking that the fuel in the cylinders was not even being pushed out because it was too cold.

He suggested plugging it in for a few hours, which I've done and which hasn't made any difference.

So I called back and I'm going to have him tow it to his garage.

I absolutely need the car tomorrow AM so we can get to Chicago for business so I might as well do it now instead of waiting until tomorrow AM, chances are it still won't start then.

A little frustrating since I feel as I've done everything possible to prepare for this trip: fuel treatment, glow plugs, etc. but who could have predicted the incredibly low temperatures?

psfred · #10 01-30-2004, 08:20 PM

No smoke, the fuel is gelled. Probably the whole tank to boot -- if you don't have enough #1 diesel or kerosene in there, even melting the fuel in the filter and pump won't do it.

I'm glad someone stopped to help!

Don't forget the cheap and cheerful antigell -- put a gallon of unleaded, or a couple gallons of kerosene if you can find it, into a full tank. This will lower the cloud point to about -10F, and keep you going. I think you can run up to 20% gasoline or 50% kerosene. You will be low on power and may get some smoke, but thats much better than being without a vehicle.

Peter

#11 01-31-2004, 12:03 AM

The guy with the Suburban was actually sent by my insurance company through my roadside assistance coverage.

So, a week ago I was at Wally World and bought 2 bottles of "Diesel Kleen" - one was labelled as being specifically for winter fuel treatment and the other more of a "cetane booster." I put the "cetane booster in my tank yesterday morning at the beginning of our trip, I'm guessing that was the wrong one to use!

dabenz · #12 01-31-2004, 07:56 AM

Even 50/50 #2/#1 is "too thick" for -20F with today's fuel. If you get the chance while the car is inside (to thaw the fuel lines) then siphon the fuel out of the tank and replace with #1. And change the fuel filters if you have the spares handy.

BoostnBenz · #13 01-31-2004, 09:48 PM

Would you recommend using a little kerosene when the temperatures are just a little below 0*F or should winterized #2 and a little antigel be enough to suffice? Last winter I was cutting the fuel with a couple gallons per fillup but didn't at all this year, just a few ounces of antigel and some DFC.

diesel don · #14 01-31-2004, 11:30 PM

Shawnster:

The deal is....you have a GREAT STARTING CAR. None of mine would even consider starting at zero degrees after 10 hours. No way, no how. And I consider two of mine excellent starting MB's.

Its just stinkin cold this year and more of it. We're idling the crap out of our cars. My brother is idling his powerstroke, my friend his cummins. Fact is, if its in the single digits, there is idling going on.

Just took a volleyball team to Detroit this weekend. Started the bus (Detroit Diesel plugged in) at noon on Friday and finally returned it to its spot 7 p.m. tonight (Sat). Never shut her down once. The windows were frozen shut and the door frozen shut but the engine stayed toasty warm.

I'm resigned to two things:

1. I love these crazy cars
2. In the bitter cold, they are either going to be running or plugged in. Period.

I have two keys for each of them and we just lock em and let em run. Nice thing is that with gloves on, you never need to put a key in the ignition cuz it just stays there. Open the back door, reach forward and push down the driver's button, and shut the back door

Don

dabenz · #15 02-01-2004, 10:39 AM

BoostnBenz, don't know where you are but here's what we do up here, where it gets cold and the temperatures can swing real fast. Keep in mind that it's the fuel lines and filters that rule the day when it's cold. #2 to about +10F, then blend with #1. 50/50 ratio by 0F, then it's straight #1. The temps here can drop 10F per hour in the hours surrounding sunrise, so we play it conservative. #1 is cheaper than Kerosine here. You may not be able to get #1, so Kerosine is the only option. I use PowerService for the lubricants, and diesels should have a mechanical water separator. Remember, "winterized fuel" is either a blend of #2/#1 or #2 with additives, and you have to rely on somebody else to get it right. I've seen "winterized fuel" refuse to pump at the station and have also seen trucks freeze at the pump with this stuff, so I choose to rely on me and do my own mixing. If the fuel's good then glow the snot out of it and take your one chance to start. I've glowed ThermoKing engines (60hp Volvo) up to 5 minutes in -30F and the've started (synthetic oil). Keep the starter spinning up to about 10sec after the engine fires and it should keep going.