500E versus 300E steering - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Tom Garrison · #1 01-29-2006, 10:13 PM

Is the steering more acurate with less play on a stock 500E versus a stock 300E? I know the 500E comes with a smaller diameter steering wheel, however, would like to know what to expect from the actual steering. I also know Porsche helped with the setup of these cars although I do not know whether Porsche did any work on the actual steering. I own a 300E with some suspension modifications, however, have always felt the steering is a weak point. Any input from those who have driven a 500E and secondarily a stock 300E as well, would be greatly appreciated. TG

Holeshot · #2 01-29-2006, 10:16 PM

I just replaced my 300E with a 500E. Honestly.. I don't have any issue with the 500E steering, but then the 300 did not both me either as neither are over-boosted like some PS systems.

It's not as sharp as the steering on my autocross car but, I wouldn't want it to be! Since I don't know what your issue is with the stock 300E steering I can't tell you if the 500E is better, same or worse. All I can offer is that it does not both me at all.

t walgamuth · #3 01-29-2006, 10:33 PM

if so the response off dead center is always much more immediate on cars with this. the traditional benz recirculating ball is a little slow to react off dead center compared to many cars. this is also a factor of having a lot of caster in the front end. it is a trade off to gain stability in a straight line at highway and higher speeds.

ie if you are going 155 on the auto bahn you dont want steering so sensitive if you sneeze you are in the guardrail.

personally i have always liked benz steering a lot. it is in my opinion very safe and fast enough.

tom w

yhliem · #4 01-30-2006, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

if so the response off dead center is always much more immediate on cars with this. the traditional benz recirculating ball is a little slow to react off dead center compared to many cars. this is also a factor of having a lot of caster in the front end. it is a trade off to gain stability in a straight line at highway and higher speeds.

ie if you are going 155 on the auto bahn you dont want steering so sensitive if you sneeze you are in the guardrail.

personally i have always liked benz steering a lot. it is in my opinion very safe and fast enough.

tom w

Mercedes did not use rack and pinion in its production passenger cars until recent years. Until then recirc ball was the standard fare; even for the 500E

t walgamuth · #5 01-30-2006, 04:39 AM

or shortly thereafter racks began appearing first on the v8 cars in i believe the e class.

tom w

gerryvz · #6 01-30-2006, 07:18 AM

I believe that the 500E used a bit more aggressive ratio (slightly less turns lock to lock) than a stock 300E, and the system is recirculating ball though is laid out differently due to different engine/suspension layout.

I'd observe the other observations about recirculating ball made here to be correct. Rack and pinion is smoother for most drivers, and some say more responsive. It's also cheaper to manufacture than the old recirculating ball systems. Not a surprise given MB's hollowing out of components and quality in recent years though. A budget-driven vs. an engineering-driven decision.

Cheers,
Gerry

softconsult · #7 01-30-2006, 07:51 AM

Can't attest to the 500E, but suspect that it is similar to my '92 W124 Factory Sportline. Steering Ratio is tighter, as in less turns of the smaller steering wheel from lock to lock.

Steve

gsxr · #8 03-21-2006, 05:35 PM

The V8 models use what I believe is a beefier steering box with a slightly different ratio. The standard 6-cyl sedans basically have two boxes available... standard ratio and Sportline, which is quicker and fewer turns lock to lock. The 400E and 500E use the same box, but it's different than the 6cyl boxes. Interestingly, there was a 400E Sportline box that was available only in Germany, with what appears to be a quicker ratio standard 400E/500E. All are the recirculating-ball type boxes. I've got the 6-cyl Sportline box on my diesel and I like it... 2.9 turns lock to lock, compared with approx 3.1-3.3 on the stock box. The coupes/cabrios use different boxes with much slower ratios - not sure why.

Here's a link to a PDF file with the factory specs for the various boxes:

http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/W124/steering_boxes.pdf

EliotW · #9 04-06-2006, 08:35 PM

Very interesting on the steering boxes, thanks

t walgamuth · #10 04-06-2006, 11:49 PM

i changed the steering wheel on a saab i had to the smaller ems wheel. the feel in the steering response was dramatic, i thought. so before thinking of changing the steering gear i would suggest fitting a smaller wheel first and seeing if that does it for you.

course if your steering gear is worn out then finding one with the quicker ratio would make some sense. i bet they are marked like diffs are with the ratio either on the body or on a tag.

when i go from my 84 500sec to the 90 350sdl which has the smaller wheel i always have a few awkward moments but soon it feels like home.

tom w