You can buy my 560SL with a working engine for less than $7 grand. The body is not perfect, but very nice. Higher highway milage car. It'll be in New York in a little more than a month.

There has been a bit of discussion in regard to engine weights in this thread , so I thought I would clear the air with my 2 cents worth .

1. Mercedes SL600 ...........................581 lbs

2. Mercedes 450SL Iron Block..............540 lbs

3.Mercedes 500SL Alum Block.............452 lbs

4.Ford Boss 429 Iron Block Alum Heads..680 lbs

5.Chevy Small Block V8 in 60's 70's.......575 lbs

6.Chevy Big Block V8 Mark IV ..............685 lbs

As can be seen the SL600 is about the same weight as a small block Chevy, so should not have weight issues transplanted in a 380SL .

Some one made a comparison between the SL600 and the SL55 .

The SL600 is a twin turbo V12 and the SL55 is a blown V8 , they have almost the same power ratios except the 600 has more torque but with more weight and a turbo, instead of a blower .

Den Downunder 1982 500SL Euro Red .

Thanks for the reply Den. I was looking for this info, where did you get the numbers.

I just got the SL600 doner car and the 560SL will be in from California in about 2 weeks. So far my measurement show this engine to be physically smaller than the 117 engine both in length and width, at least down below where it counts. I expect to have difficulty in the power booster area and the AC compressor and PS pump may also have to be relocated on the engine. The 5 speed transmission also looks bigger so the tunnel may have to be modified.

The biggest problem I'm having right now is that the SL600 looks repairable and I may just want to fix it. In any case the engine will have to come out to do the repairs, so I may just borrow it for a bit.

John Roncallo

cool project.

keep us posted.

on the engine weights it is hard to imagine that the 600 weighs 130# more than the 500. is it a four cam engine? if so, i suppose that is where all the weight is.

tom w

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Guy's,

The weights were obtained from a few different sources on the net , in particular the SL600 was hard to find , however I had verication from two seperate sources off the web.

The SL600 engine is amazing when you look at all the area's of engineered weight savings , they used magnesium and aluminium extensivly and many areas are hollow where you would expect solid metal.

as I said I got most of the info from one source , but had to do a seperate search for some including the SL600 and 500SL weights.

The main source http://www.team.net/sol/tech/engine.html

Or Engine weight FYI

It was a bit of work but interesting to come up with the numbers.

Den Downunder 1982 500SL Euro Red .

Sounds like a plan, man!

__________________
-Justin

91 560 SEC AMG - other dogs dd
01 Honda S2000 - dogs dd
07 MB ML320 CDI - dd
16 Lexus IS250 - wifes dd

it's automatic.

I have begun the project of fitting the M120 engine into a 1986 560SL

Attached is a picture of the M120 engine sitting on a 560SL subframe. As expected there will be modifications required to the fit the engine to the subframe correctly involving cutting the front cross brace and moving it forward about 1 inch as well as making the rear cross member more shallow to drop the engine low enough to put the crank axis at the same height as the 117 engine.

Prelimiminary indications are as follows

1) Interfearance will exist between the master cyl and left hand air intake boot.
2) The oil filter that I originally belived I would have to mount remotely appears to fit snuggly.
3) A special manifold will have to be made to acess the oil cooler lines.
4) I originally thought the AC compressor would not fit at all. At this time it apears more promising, however a special manifold will have to be made of a narrower compresser will have to be found and adapted.
5) Preliminary measurements indicate the engine front edge will hit the hood. The hood line may have to be worked. This is one modification I did not want to do as the 107 hood is the most beautiful body part on the car. The possibility of droping the engine an inch makes the situations 2, 3, 4 worse
5) Exhaust routing is too difficult to evaluate at this time but it does apear that is is an area where I will have to cut into the chassi.
6) Any rumors you read on this thread about this engine being extreamely heavey and might flip over the engine crane are false. The engine was very easy to remove with the transmission attached. I did it unassisted by myself. Any one who thinks this engine is heavy has not removed a big block Ford FE series engine.
7) I will have the engine weight shorltly
8) Nothing impossible or overwhelming yet however I will have to be carefull to avoid a situation where removal of the AC compressor requires removal of the engine

John Roncallo

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sorry for my ignorance....is that a four or two cam engine?

clearance for the brake booster might be had by twisting the engine a bit.

i did that on my q-jet carb conversion on my 74 bavaria. shimmed the engine mounts about 3/8" or so on the drivers side.

it also might be possible to move the pedal assembly over a little.

cool project!

tom w

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

4 cam. The engine cannot be twisted or the oposite corner will come through the hood. This is a 60° engine with manifolds coming over the heads. It is very tall engine.

John Roncallo

Remote booster? Read on Lancia Scorpion or I belive MG B's? I'm not the one under there, but worth checking out, maybe put the MC in the car, then route the lines underneath, then into the booster, then out to the brakes. Kind of a PITA but it works.

i figured you were way ahead of me but couldn't resist suggesting it.

you might also be able to fit a smaller booster.

tom w

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

FYI, the GM LSx series engines (LS1 - 345 HP, LS2 - 400 HP, LS6 - 405 HP, & LS7 - 505 HP) are all Small Block Chevy sized and weigh approximately 434 pounds complete (LS6 value). These are all aluminum engines and very recent designs. The oldest one in the list (LS1) came out in 1999, the LS7 is about a 3 year old design.

More HP, less weight, better fuel mileage than an MB engine.

This is my LS6, silver and blue since my 560SEC into which it's going is a silver car with a blue interior. This engine has a cam and some valve train work and has been measured at 410 RWHP, about 475 HP at the crank. It's about 1/4" wider than my M117 engine and 3/4" longer, and since the intake is on the front of the manifold, it's lower than the M117.

YMMV

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If you were doing a 4.3 V6, why not just go with a LS series V8? The 4.3 is just a SBC 350 with two cyls lopped off. So the width would be fine and the depth should be ok too. Wonder if a LS series engine would fit into a w114/5? Hmmmm...

__________________
Nathan
'74 280C - gone to a new home for the finishing it deserves.
'64 356SC
'74 914 2.0

I looked into an LS7 $15,000 for the engine. then I need a trans (The idea of a 6 speed standard was apealing). Then I need all the wireing harnesses. Then I need all accessoris. And on top of all that just as much work for the install. Approximatly $22K for all the hard parts less any custom fabricated stuff. I got a complete SL600 wrecked delivered from CA for $8300.00. Its got all hard parts I need. From that point on the cost is approximatly the same.

The MB SL600 engie advertises only 389 HP however it has been my observation over the years that MB uses a bigger horse.

When I am done I will have a Mercedes with a Mercedes engine a 12 cylinder MB engine. Also the engine is not too over powered that I will have to be concerned with the rest of the drive train. I will have the weight of this engine shortly.

John Roncallo

[QUOTE=Roncallo;1397218

.... however it has been my observation over the years that MB uses a bigger horse.


[/QUOTE]

What do you mean by saying it? There are more horses than the factory says? ..or.?

good luck with the project, I hope you take a lot of pictures.