T5 transmission to Iron Block M116/117 - Page 5 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Tony H · #61 08-09-2020, 01:09 PM

You are correct Jason. I looked at it some more and have come to the conclusion I will need to cut a hole where the S10 shifter stub is and run a linkage inside the car. I can always patch the hole if ever need be and it will never been seen. The shifter stub will come through the floor behind the A/C surround and the linkage will be under the plastic "console". The hole only needs to be big enough for the "stub" to come through and move. I won't have to modify the tail housing either.

Frank Reiner · #62 08-09-2020, 01:37 PM

Tony,
The Tremec remote shifter in your earlier link:
https://www.thegearbox.org/catalog/item/3819132/10399030.htm
could provide a top cover and shift shaft that would probably work as you describe above. An important component of the Tremec package is the torque link (the aluminum lengthwise casting) that maintains the rotational relationship between gearbox and shift handle. You might have to fabricate your own.

Tony H · #63 08-09-2020, 02:57 PM

Hey Frank,
At first I thought that concept might work but there just is not enough space for a linkage in the trans tunnel. The area around the original shifter hole is right above the bulky area at the end of the tail housing. It would require a very complex arrangement that would probably result in sloppy shifting. I can have a more direct connection to the trans shifter with the shift rod in the car and it will be behind the carpeted A/C surround.
Here's the link to the one on BAT. Can't really see much/any detail on the shifter. Not a fan of the Tombstone headlights but I guess some people like them.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1971-mercedes-benz-280se-3-5-coupe-14/

rwd4evr · #64 08-10-2020, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony H

You are correct Jason. I looked at it some more and have come to the conclusion I will need to cut a hole where the S10 shifter stub is and run a linkage inside the car. I can always patch the hole if ever need be and it will never been seen. The shifter stub will come through the floor behind the A/C surround and the linkage will be under the plastic "console". The hole only needs to be big enough for the "stub" to come through and move. I won't have to modify the tail housing either.

I looked at my t5's last night and though the push/pull would be swapped the side motion would stay correct. But as long as you have a console to cover the linkage up I would go your route. An inner tie rod makes a great base for your remote shifter.

Sent from my SM-J737A using Tapatalk

Tony H · #65 08-11-2020, 12:53 AM

Good idea. I was looking at some kind of Heim joint. There is about 1" of padding and insulation over the area where the rod will be so I can notch it for the rod. The console buts up to the A/C surround so none of the rod will be in exposed area. The wiring loom for the power window switches will need to be relocated. Plenty of ideas on the net for the linkage.
Does anyone out there have a 3.5 stick shift coupe with the original shift handle? Mine had one like this when I bought it and I'm not sure if it is correct.

rwd4evr · #66 08-12-2020, 03:54 AM

Pics and threads. Shame there's no lenght but if you you search the pn on rock Auto you can get specs sometimes. May have to check other brands for the same vehicle.

https://www.moog-suspension-parts.com/universal_inner_tie_rods.asp

Sent from my SM-J737A using Tapatalk

mercoupman · #67 08-16-2020, 08:10 PM

Hi Tony,

Great progress , all very well thought out.
I am doing almost exactly what you are doing , an adaptor to fit a t5 to a early m116/m117 block . You are more down the track than i am as i have the adaptor cnc in mdf as a prototype from a cad file i drew , need to make some minor adjustments than its done, using the register on the bellhousing so its a nicely engineered snug fit like you have done.
i have a 72 euro 350sl manual car arriving soon to use as a template , will try and replicate that but with t5 instead for my w111 coupe . Thieves stole my orig 2.2 engines so going m116/7

However i since found a early spare alloy 5.0l m117 block i had can bolt to the old bellhousing so i may use that . i have a number of 10:1 968 560 bottom ends so may end up with 560 to t5 using the early alloy block though i think 245hp 5.0 /t5 may suit chassis better.

This mustang T5 is very compact . flange could be modded to accept merc donut. single rail remote shifter which is similiar to the single rail merc boxes on the early 220seb coupes which have remote gear lever.

mercoupman · #68 08-17-2020, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony H

Good idea. I was looking at some kind of Heim joint. There is about 1" of padding and insulation over the area where the rod will be so I can notch it for the rod. The console buts up to the A/C surround so none of the rod will be in exposed area. The wiring loom for the power window switches will need to be relocated. Plenty of ideas on the net for the linkage.
Does anyone out there have a 3.5 stick shift coupe with the original shift handle? Mine had one like this when I bought it and I'm not sure if it is correct.

Thats exactly the same factory 4 speed gear knob in my 72 350sl . I know the gear knob for w111 six cylinders is the fine chrome stem with a white or black round ball same as pagodas , and i have seen both yours and the round ball ones on w111 3.5 coupes , ,some ball ones on 69 , then some on 70- 71's so no rhyme or reason, May be different for different markets with different safety standards , the hard ball ones more damaging in a crash ?

Tony H · #69 08-19-2020, 02:12 AM

I have since looked at pics of several stick shift 3.5 coupes and they all have the chrome stem and round ball so mine was added later for some reason. Maybe the PO thought it looked more contemporary. I'm going with the original ball.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercoupman

Thats exactly the same factory 4 speed gear knob in my 72 350sl . I know the gear knob for w111 six cylinders is the fine chrome stem with a white or black round ball same as pagodas , and i have seen both yours and the round ball ones on w111 3.5 coupes , ,some ball ones on 69 , then some on 70- 71's so no rhyme or reason, May be different for different markets with different safety standards , the hard ball ones more damaging in a crash ?

Tony H · #70 08-19-2020, 02:22 AM

Like I said on the other post-this box has some merit-mostly it is more compact. But the extra length of the Mustang trans does not seem to be a problem and I did not want to deal with interfacing to the CV joint flange and large shifter box. Adapting for the slip yoke was simple. I guess the CV joint is the same thing-a yoke welded to a tube. I'm having a custom front driveshaft section made-should be done this week. I'll post a pic when done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercoupman

Hi Tony,

Great progress , all very well thought out.
I am doing almost exactly what you are doing , an adaptor to fit a t5 to a early m116/m117 block . You are more down the track than i am as i have the adaptor cnc in mdf as a prototype from a cad file i drew , need to make some minor adjustments than its done, using the register on the bellhousing so its a nicely engineered snug fit like you have done.
i have a 72 euro 350sl manual car arriving soon to use as a template , will try and replicate that but with t5 instead for my w111 coupe . Thieves stole my orig 2.2 engines so going m116/7

However i since found a early spare alloy 5.0l m117 block i had can bolt to the old bellhousing so i may use that . i have a number of 10:1 968 560 bottom ends so may end up with 560 to t5 using the early alloy block though i think 245hp 5.0 /t5 may suit chassis better.

This mustang T5 is very compact . flange could be modded to accept merc donut. single rail remote shifter which is similiar to the single rail merc boxes on the early 220seb coupes which have remote gear lever.

Tony H · #71 08-22-2020, 11:51 PM

My original idea of using a 4.5 rear section with a new front section was not feasible since the front section would only be 10" long. I redesigned my idea to use my original 3 piece rear section with a new front section. Now the 2 sections are about the same length. One of the major hurdles was how to interface the new front section to the original rear section since it needs to connect to the splined male center bearing. I came up with the idea to reuse the female spline connector by using the OD pressed into the driveline tubing. It took some searching to find the correct tubing to interface the splined connector. I used 2.125"x.188" tubing. The machinist took a small cut off the OD of the splined connector to insure concentricity and machined a counterbore in the tubing, pressed in and welded. Much stronger than the original spliced connection. This only works on a car that has a 3 piece driveshaft since it has a short rear driveshaft(and corresponding mount). I marked the driveshaft before I too it apart so I can put it back if I ever need to.

rwd4evr · #72 09-04-2020, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercoupman

Hi Tony,

Great progress , all very well thought out.

I am doing almost exactly what you are doing , an adaptor to fit a t5 to a early m116/m117 block . You are more down the track than i am as i have the adaptor cnc in mdf as a prototype from a cad file i drew , need to make some minor adjustments than its done, using the register on the bellhousing so its a nicely engineered snug fit like you have done.

i have a 72 euro 350sl manual car arriving soon to use as a template , will try and replicate that but with t5 instead for my w111 coupe . Thieves stole my orig 2.2 engines so going m116/7

However i since found a early spare alloy 5.0l m117 block i had can bolt to the old bellhousing so i may use that . i have a number of 10:1 968 560 bottom ends so may end up with 560 to t5 using the early alloy block though i think 245hp 5.0 /t5 may suit chassis better.

This mustang T5 is very compact . flange could be modded to accept merc donut. single rail remote shifter which is similiar to the single rail merc boxes on the early 220seb coupes which have remote gear lever.

Use caution. The later 4.0 v6 mustang t5 with that remote shift setup have a 3.73 1st gear set that is not as strong as the 3.35 or and especially 2.95 1st gear set. I doubt it would be an issue with a stock m117 but it is above the torque rating with a healthy 5.6. The factory concentric slave is nice though. I was just looking at this and asked MDL (modern drive line) what is needed to run the early v6 or v8 gearset in the later short tail case. Sorry to thread jack a bit.

Sent from my SM-J737A using Tapatalk

Tony H · #73 09-25-2020, 10:57 PM

Been making slow progress-mostly because the car is in a storage unit and the remote shifter linkage has required about 2 dozen re engineerings to get the shifter to come through the floor in the correct location and to get the geometry correct. It also has to withstand the force of shifting with no flex or play. There is very little room under the original shifter hole in the floor since the bulky slip yoke area is there.
Decided I'm not going to cut the hole in the floor for the T5 shifter until I actually need to-I might change my mind by then.

Tony H · #74 10-08-2020, 12:15 AM

I got the shift linkage done-or the prototype-about as much as I can without actually cutting the floor for the T5. Pretty happy with it. There is no loss of motion. I purchased an aftermarket shifter meant for a Mustang and modified it to work with the S10 extension housing. I had to make an interface plate and machine off some shifter mounting surface to account for the added thickness.

Tony H · #75 10-08-2020, 12:22 AM

1 more pic