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-   -   Do you *really* think the Cold War is over? (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=108131)

aklim 05-29-2007 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst (Post 1520415)
KirkVining, BoneheadDoctor, and Gottadiesel.
Father, Son, and Wholly Ghost.

Was BHD a leftist? Thought KV and GD are left and BHD was on the right? :confused:

Botnst 05-29-2007 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim (Post 1520417)
Was BHD a leftist? Thought KV and GD are left and BHD was on the right? :confused:

Different aspects of the same god: Fanaticism.

Hatterasguy 05-29-2007 11:47 PM

Well said Bot.

Jim B. 05-29-2007 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst (Post 1520419)
Different aspects of the same god: Fanaticism.

Extremism in the defense of lettuce is no vice.:D

LaRondo 05-29-2007 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KirkVining (Post 747950)
I think the rest of the world is about to re-arm because of OUR belligerent activities. Our pre-emptive invasion may have caught the attention of many who wish not to be pre-empted. The Russians and the Europeans, after four years of estrangement under Bush, have figured out they really don't need us anymore. The French, the Germans and the Russians are about to form their own alliance. The price we have paid for our "go it alone" policy is the rest of the world is about to let us do just that.

BRAVO, BRAVO!!!

aklim 05-29-2007 11:58 PM

So we go it alone. Such has always been the case unless others see some benefit in following us. Ever read "The Little Red Hen"? This is the same story over and over again. Soon as they need us for something, they will be back. When they don't need us, we go separate ways. Is there something so strange about it? We are going in different directions so they form their own alliances. Soon as they and us have a common goal or they can sponge off us, they will be back.

LaRondo 05-29-2007 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boneheaddoctor (Post 748254)
Simple, show any history book that states its the Russians that won the war, well outside of Russia there are none.

Someone trying to change history to suit an agenda (such as slam the USA at all costs) by trying to change they facts is revisionist history.

Such as the people who were trying to say we were picking on the poor innocent people if Nagasaki and Hiroshima when we dropped the bomb on them. And that it wasn't needed etc........

I never stated the Russians didn't help. They did, the war was shorter as a result. But we wouldn't have lost as was insinuated if Adolf had not made the mistake of attacking Russia.

Adolf war ein 'Dummkopf'.

aklim 05-29-2007 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst (Post 1520419)
Different aspects of the same god: Fanaticism.

Wonder when people will learn that the left is not evil while the right is righteous and vice versa.

Botnst 05-30-2007 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim (Post 1520447)
Wonder when people will learn that the left is not evil while the right is righteous and vice versa.

When otherwise rational people are no longer seduced by fanatical words from a righteous voice or pretty face.

Hatterasguy 05-30-2007 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaRondo (Post 1520446)
Adolf war ein 'Dummkopf'.

Correct, but the German army was most excellent.

GottaDiesel 05-30-2007 06:55 AM

Lookee here, the fox is guarding the hen-house...

GottaDiesel 05-30-2007 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim (Post 1520447)
Wonder when people will learn that the left is not evil while the right is righteous and vice versa.

They won't, especially when the ones that are suppose to govern with neutrality join the fanatic.

And yes, it is an MB thing. Hattie, you should be ashamed of yourself.

t walgamuth 05-30-2007 07:33 AM

no one can say what WOULD have happened if it had played out differently, but the russian front was a huge element of ww2. the russians did a huge amount of damage to the german war machine at a huge price in manpower. 20 million dead.

to be sure our weapons and trucks played a large part in that.

the whole cold war was about the fear of the russian army sweeping into europe after we left....so we never left.

and we had this thirty or forty year standoff, neither side wishing to slug it out.

tom w

Botnst 05-30-2007 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy (Post 1520483)
Correct, but the German army was most excellent.

Doesn't that word translate to, "stupid"? I don't think Hitler was a stupid man at all. Quite the opposite. There are all manner of theories concerning his mental stability and I think most of them are probably going the right direction. His mania spoke to a people who were treated very unfairly post WWI. His vision provided them with a "reason" for their current miserable status, despite the obvious native intelligence and ability of the people, and also a clear avenue for escape -- strength. People were so sick of their condition that they ignored the signs of insanity in favor of the dream he offered. Even the decent people who met him and knew he was dangerous self-censored, believing that they could control him.

I think what finally saved the USSR and lowered the casualty rate among the western Allies was his addiction to stimulants, a wonderful combination of cocaine and meth, IIRC. Drug-enhanced sociopathic megalomania helped dissociate him from the world making his military and state decisions less and less sensible.

aklim 05-30-2007 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst (Post 1520449)
When otherwise rational people are no longer seduced by fanatical words from a righteous voice or pretty face.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GottaDiesel (Post 1520576)
They won't, especially when the ones that are suppose to govern with neutrality join the fanatic.

IOW, NEVER?

Botnst 05-30-2007 08:14 AM

How I Spent the War
A recruit in the Waffen S.S.
by Günter Grass June 4, 2007

In 1943, when I was a fifteen-year-old schoolboy in Danzig, volunteered for active duty. When? Why? Since I do not know th exact date and cannot recall the by then unstable climate of the war, or lis its hot spots from the Arctic to the Caucasus, all I can do for now is strin together the circumstances that probably triggered and nourished m decision to enlist. No mitigating epithets allowed. What I did cannot b put down to youthful folly. No pressure from above. Nor did I feel th need to assuage a sense of guilt, at, say, doubting the Führer’ infallibility, with my zeal to volunteer
It happened while I was serving in the Luftwaffe auxiliary—a force made up of boys too young to be conscripts, who were deployed to defend Germany in its air war. The service was not voluntary but compulsory then for boys of my age, though we experienced it as a liberation from our school routine and accepted its not very taxing drills. Rabidly pubescent, we considered ourselves the mainstays of the home front. The Kaiserhafen battery became our second home. At first there were attempts to keep school going, but, as classes were too often interrupted by field exercises, the mostly frail, elderly teachers refused to travel the wearisome dirt road to our battery.

We got to use our 88-mm. guns only two or three times, when a few enemy bombers were sighted in our airspace in the beam of the searchlights. Massive raids—the kind that Cologne, Hamburg, Berlin, and the Ruhr Basin cities suffered—we did not experience. No damage worthy of the name, few casualties. We were proud to have shot down a four-engined Lancaster bomber; the “rather charred” crew members were said to have been Canadians. As a rule, however, service in the Luftwaffe auxiliary was dreary, though dreary in a different way from school. We were especially turned off by nightly guard duty and ballistics classes, which dragged on forever in the musty classroom barracks.

We had every other weekend off. We could, as they put it, “go home to Mama.” And, each time, my joy at the thought of the visit was tempered by my pain at the thought of our cramped quarters—a two-room flat adjoining the small grocery store that my parents ran, where the only space that I could call my own was a low niche under the sill of the right-hand living-room window.

At home, I kept bumping into things and into the lack of things: a bathroom and a toilet, for instance. All we had at the battery was a common shower room and, beyond it, a common latrine. There we would squat next to one another, ****ting into a pit, and that didn’t bother me at all. But, at home, the toilet on the landing, shared by four flats, grew more and more distasteful to me: it was always filthy from the neighbors’ children, or occupied when you needed it. It stank, and its walls were smeared with fingerprints.

The two-room hole. The family trap. Everything there conspired to constrain the weekend visitor. Not even the mother’s hand could smooth away the son’s distress. True, he was no longer expected to sleep in his parents’ bedroom like his sister, but even on the couch made up for him in the living room he remained a witness to the married life that continued unbroken from Saturday to Sunday. That is, I could hear—or thought I could hear—sounds I had heard, muffled as they were, from childhood on, sounds that had lodged in my mind in the form of a monstrous ritual: the anticipatory whispers, the lip-smacking, the creaking bedsprings, the sighing horsehair mattress, the moaning, the groaning, the entire aural repertory of lovemaking, so potent, especially in the dark. I had a clear picture of all the variations on marital coupling, and in my cinematic version of the act the mother was always the victim: she yielded, she gave the go-ahead, she held out to the point of exhaustion.

The hatred of a mother’s boy for his father, the subliminal battleground that determined the course of Greek tragedies and has been so eloquently updated by Dr. Freud and his disciples, was thus, if not the primary cause, then at least one of the factors in my push to leave home.

I racked my brain for flight routes. They all ran in one direction: the front, or one of the many fronts, as quickly as possible.

I tried to pick a quarrel with my father. It wasn’t easy. It would have taken massive recriminations, and, peace-loving family man that he was, he was quick to give in. Anything to maintain harmony. The progenitor had a constant wish for the offspring on his lips: “I want your life to be better. . . . You will have a better life than ours.” Try as I might to turn him into a bugbear, he was not made for the role.

more at: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2007/06/04/070604fa_fact_grass?printable=true

Dee8go 05-30-2007 01:56 PM

The Cold War is over. We've moved on to Global Warming now. What's next?!

Botnst 05-30-2007 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dee8go (Post 1520838)
The Cold War is over. We've moved on to Global Warming now. What's next?!

StarWars!

Dee8go 05-30-2007 02:01 PM

Oh, I thought we were done with that, too. You know, after the Reagan administration.

Botnst 05-30-2007 02:04 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dee8go (Post 1520845)
Oh, I thought we were done with that, too. You know, after the Reagan administration.

TimeWars!

Zeus 05-30-2007 02:10 PM

Exterminate! Exterminate!!

http://blog.ravijain.org/content_images/dalek_small.jpg

Dee8go 05-30-2007 02:28 PM

Now yer talkin'!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst (Post 1520849)
TimeWars!

Bot, I think you could sell that concept to General Dynamics or Lockheed. I'm sure the Bush administration could get into the TDI (sounds kinda like "SDI, doesn't it?) That way they could get us to quit thinking so much about that war we probably shouldn't have started and can't figure out how to get out of now.
We can beat the terrorists by going back in time and killing them before they figured how to terrorize us. I think that idea has "legs," man!:D

Botnst 05-30-2007 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dee8go (Post 1520876)
Bot, I think you could sell that concept to General Dynamics or Lockheed. I'm sure the Bush administration could get into the TDI (sounds kinda like "SDI, doesn't it?) That way they could get us to quit thinking so much about that war we probably shouldn't have started and can't figure out how to get out of now.
We can beat the terrorists by going back in time and killing them before they figured how to terrorize us. I think that idea has "legs," man!:D

I think you'd find a true-believer and willing partner by teaming-up with HaddaPella.

Jim B. 05-30-2007 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst (Post 1520602)
I don't think Hitler was a stupid man at all.

...... his addiction to stimulants, a wonderful combination of cocaine and meth, IIRC.

Characterized by manic outbursts of energy, wild grandiose speechmaking, ............................and a desire to annex the Sudetenland.

GottaDiesel 05-30-2007 03:50 PM

Seems there is a freak obsessed with me...

Hatterasguy 05-30-2007 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GottaDiesel (Post 1520576)
They won't, especially when the ones that are suppose to govern with neutrality join the fanatic.

And yes, it is an MB thing. Hattie, you should be ashamed of yourself.

For what please tell, I'm dying to hear...

Hatterasguy 05-30-2007 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst (Post 1520602)
Doesn't that word translate to, "stupid"? I don't think Hitler was a stupid man at all. Quite the opposite. There are all manner of theories concerning his mental stability and I think most of them are probably going the right direction. His mania spoke to a people who were treated very unfairly post WWI. His vision provided them with a "reason" for their current miserable status, despite the obvious native intelligence and ability of the people, and also a clear avenue for escape -- strength. People were so sick of their condition that they ignored the signs of insanity in favor of the dream he offered. Even the decent people who met him and knew he was dangerous self-censored, believing that they could control him.

I think what finally saved the USSR and lowered the casualty rate among the western Allies was his addiction to stimulants, a wonderful combination of cocaine and meth, IIRC. Drug-enhanced sociopathic megalomania helped dissociate him from the world making his military and state decisions less and less sensible.

Towards the end he couldn't be reasoned with. By 1945 his orders were starting to be ignored by his Generals. He would give orders to attack a city, and the army that was supposed to attack either didn't exist anymore, or were running as fast as possible from the Russians. I think after the fall of Paris he was pretty much in his own world.

hill 05-30-2007 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boneheaddoctor (Post 748231)
You are trying to state revisionist history.......

Russia definately shortend the war by saping German resources......but We would still have won even without them. It just would have taken longer and cost more American lives.

Are you sure of this statement? General Patton disagreed with your analysys

hill 05-30-2007 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fahrgewehr2 (Post 748794)
In addition, Russia and Germany were close to actual military alliance before Hitler committed his blunder

This is not true. Hitler had planned operation Barbarossa before the Pact of Steel. Stalin only entered into that phony agreement so that he could build up his military, as after the officer purges the effectiveness of the Soviet Military was severely compromised, as seen in the Finnish Campaign of '39.

Stalin knew the Krauts were coming, just thought he had bought more time.

Oh my god another history buff! Barbarosa was planned before even the invasion of Poland. According to my Grandmachen before the purge of reformist and Jewish generals this was discussed.


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