A Piano Upstairs - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

gmercoleza · #1 11-28-2005, 01:08 PM

We recently got an upright piano from my in-laws, as they downsized to an apartment and no longer had the space. The piano is currently sitting in my 10 x 11 office downstairs, and with it being a little cramped I would like to move it to one of our larger rooms upstairs (the room is about 22 x 14 and is empty).

I will of course call a piano moving company to move and then retune it - I'm not that crazy. The question is: should a piano even be upstairs? Can the floor support it? I have no idea how heavy it is. I'm sort of new to TX and, having done a little bit of work on the house (i.e. electrical, adding a wall and doorway, etc.), it appears to me that construction build quality is not quite as good as it was up north. Should I be cautious?

BTW - this house was built by Centex. I recall when house shopping before we left Chicago, Centex was somewhat on the lesser end of the price and quality scale, but here in TX they seem to be acceptable. Even J.D. Powers ranks them as one of the top builders in TX.

boneheaddoctor · #2 11-28-2005, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercoleza

We recently got an upright piano from my in-laws, as they downsized to an apartment and no longer had the space. The piano is currently sitting in my 10 x 11 office downstairs, and with it being a little cramped I would like to move it to one of our larger rooms upstairs (the room is about 22 x 14 and is empty).

I will of course call a piano moving company to move and then retune it - I'm not that crazy. The question is: should a piano even be upstairs? Can the floor support it? I have no idea how heavy it is. I'm sort of new to TX and, having done a little bit of work on the house (i.e. electrical, adding a wall and doorway, etc.), it appears to me that construction build quality is not quite as good as it was up north. Should I be cautious?

BTW - this house was built by Centex. I recall when house shopping before we left Chicago, Centex was somewhat on the lesser end of the price and quality scale, but here in TX they seem to be acceptable. Even J.D. Powers ranks them as one of the top builders in TX.

ITs all in how it was built....thats a lot of weight on a small footprint. Same issue with Waterbeds....if you jump 6 inches in the air do things fall off a table in the same room?

gmercoleza · #3 11-28-2005, 01:17 PM

No, it doesn't seem that flimsy. But it just has this "hollow" sound when my 3 and 5 year olds run - doesn't really inspire much confidence. My house in Chicago was solid as a rock, and you just heard a slight thud when a large adult walked upstairs. I just wonder if the building codes here are up to par, in other words what thickness of underlayment do they require, spacing between floor joists, etc. I don't want to have to pull the carpet up and start drilling holes to find out. Looking at the ceiling drywall in the right light, I can see something that resembles a slight "sag" between rafters, which tells me the drywall is thinner than the 3/4 that was used on my house in Chicago.

When I get home, I'll have to try and dig up pictures of some work I did when we first moved in. I put a wall and doorway in our entryway in order to make the office out of a second living room. I cut into the ceiling to anchor the top plate and should at least be able to figure out the rough spacing between the floor joists from the pictures.

boneheaddoctor · #4 11-28-2005, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercoleza

No, it doesn't seem that flimsy. But it just has this "hollow" sound when my 3 and 5 year olds run - doesn't really inspire much confidence. My house in Chicago was solid as a rock, and you just heard a slight thud when a large adult walked upstairs. I just wonder if the building codes here are up to par, in other words what thickness of underlayment do they require, spacing between floor joists, etc. I don't want to have to pull the carpet up and start drilling holes to find out. Looking at the ceiling drywall in the right light, I can see something that resembles a slight "sag" between rafters, which tells me the drywall is thinner than the 3/4 that was used on my house in Chicago.

sit in the middle of the room with palms down on floor...have the heaviest remaining member of the house walk real heavy across the floor...do you feel it sunstantially in your butt and palms.....also does that area in the floor below have a very large room? many interior walls are not technically load bearing walls but do in fact strengthen the joists in the floor above. If there is a large open room directly underneither it may be an issue...but if there is a wall tangent to the way joists are run on the floor under it may be far less of an issue. Do you know any builders or contruction types who can eyeball it for a beer or handshake?

raymr · #5 11-28-2005, 01:31 PM

A studfinder from Sears will locate the rafters. But I would wonder how thick they are. Definitely place the piano above a load-bearing wall, if possible.

boneheaddoctor · #6 11-28-2005, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raymr

A studfinder from Sears will locate the rafters. But I would wonder how thick they are. Definitely place the piano above a load-bearing wall, if possible.

they tend to use the cheapest (read weakest) code will allow for....I've been in houses you felt the floor bounce when someone walked on it.....and these were not old places either.

gmercoleza · #7 11-28-2005, 01:54 PM

Interesting observations and advice, thanks for the insight. The room below is definitely wide open, no load bearing walls to speak of (breakfast room). That is partly what makes me leery of putting a piano up there.

On the other hand, 2 of the walls are exterior walls. Could all other negative factors be mitigated if the piano is placed against the outside wall that is perpendicular to the floor joists?

boneheaddoctor · #8 11-28-2005, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercoleza

Interesting observations and advice, thanks for the insight. The room below is definitely wide open, no load bearing walls to speak of (breakfast room). That is partly what makes me leery of putting a piano up there.

On the other hand, 2 of the walls are exterior walls. Could all other negative factors be mitigated if the piano is placed against the outside wall that is perpendicular to the floor joists?

it would be mitigated becasue it is at the anchor points of the joists....CMAC2012 is a contruction type and so are several others....I would wait till they offer their opinions. I have no idea what are typical load limits designed into modern houses... They use these engineered joists that are made out to 2X4s that look like a bridge at worst...the ones made from chipboard and 2x4's are actually stiffer. I know what you speak of as a townhouse I used to rent was simmulare inlayout as you describle. I could FEEL my roomate come home even though he went to great efforts to be silent....the old bouncing floor thing...and he was not a 300lber either. more like 180 lbs at the time.

gmercoleza · #9 11-28-2005, 02:10 PM

Thanks again, very insightful.

If it helps any, when I did the wall downstairs I noticed I had real 2 x 10s or 2 x 12s (not sure exactly which). I know this because I secured my top plate directly into them with galvanized decking screws. I did not have the chicken mcnugget I-beam looking stuff (OSB?) or the fake steel girder made out of wood if that's what you're referring to. I have no idea what those things are actually called.

I'll wait to hear what the construction experts here have to say. The more info the better.

What does a piano weigh, anyway? For some reason I have the figure of 700 pounds in my head.

boneheaddoctor · #10 11-28-2005, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercoleza

Thanks again, very insightful.

If it helps any, when I did the wall downstairs I noticed I had real 2 x 10s or 2 x 12s (not sure exactly which). I know this because I secured my top plate directly into them with galvanized decking screws. I did not have the chicken mcnugget I-beam looking stuff (OSB?) or the fake steel girder made out of wood if that's what you're referring to. I have no idea what those things are actually called.

I'll wait to hear what the construction experts here have to say. The more info the better.

What does a piano weigh, anyway? For some reason I have the figure of 700 pounds in my head.

I would bet 2x10....2X12s would be rock sold.....(depending on the unsupported length of course)

Kuan · #11 11-28-2005, 02:29 PM

I have a 600# piano upstairs. That's three slightly fat people. It'll be fine.

boneheaddoctor · #12 11-28-2005, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuan

I have a 600# piano upstairs. That's three slightly fat people. It'll be fine.

its not total weight its more of a weight concentration per cubic foot over a long period thats the concern.

TheDon · #13 11-28-2005, 03:25 PM

if your that concered go out get some 2x6's fab up a support for the floor below.. put some sheet rock on it paint it.. maybe a fish tank in it or somthing.. and you'll be good

J. R. B. · #14 11-28-2005, 07:45 PM

I always feel sorry for the guy who marries a piano playing woman. He has a very heavy load to carry the rest of his life.

Case in point is my poor brother in law who is a heck of a good guy and my sister had a behemoth of a piano. The inside of the thing was cast iron. Moving day for the thing was a disaster with my left hand getting smashed between the thing and one of the doorways. My advise to you is if nobody plays the thing get rid of it. Take it out in pieces and haul it to a salvage yard. If somebody plays it and you decide to keep it I'll tell you how to play a joke on your pianist. What you do is take a couple of thumb tacks and stick them in the felt hammers where they strike the strings inside the beast. What this does is give only those hammers the honky-tonk piano sound. I did this to my sister and it drove her nuts until she found out what I did.

gmercoleza · #15 11-28-2005, 09:56 PM

Well, the advice to get rid of it is not well taken since I am the one who plays piano in the house (not my wife). I play piano/keyboards as well as guitar and drums. I'm looking to keep it, and any constructive insight that can help me decide where to put it in the house would be greatly appreciated.