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  #1  
Old 01-14-2007, 05:48 PM
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Interesting take on travel to Iran

From the SF Chron travel section:

The joke was barely out of my mouth before I regretted making it.

"The Great Satan," I'd quipped when the Iranian airport security official asked me where I was from. Unsmiling, he looked me up and down and said, "Please come with me."

A thousand thoughts exploded in my head, none of them comforting. But it turned out the man only wanted to walk around the corner for a little privacy so he could ask about getting a visa to come to America.

It was a most unexpected welcome to Iran -- but not, as it turned out, all that unusual. During the month I spent there last fall I had similar exchanges with Iranians from all walks of life, few of them interested in discussing the animosity that has existed for so long between our two governments.


More:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/01/14/TRG1DNG0JT1.DTL&hw=iran&sn=001&sc=1000

Some good photos and a video.

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Old 01-14-2007, 11:11 PM
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A good read. Interesting observations on life "on the street" there. Hopefully. Ahmedinejad will be marginalized by his own people.
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Old 01-15-2007, 12:02 AM
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My worry, and I'm certainly not alone in this, is that sabre rattling and actual sabre wielding by the Bush-o-mon will give Ahmedinejad a new lease on life.

Soft power not only works better than hard power, in many instances, we make money in the process.
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Old 01-15-2007, 04:50 AM
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That's an interesting read, by an Iranian -American author who "grew up in Marin County during the 70's"

When I sold title insurance to 2nd mortgage companies and banks back in the late 70s-early 80's Marin County was my territory. We heard of many many instances when Iranian refugees fleeing the Ayatollah came to California and purchased the new residences and condos with suitcases stuffed with cash.
It was a common occurance.

I wished the author was a car nut, he could have reported on the new Museum of cars owned by the Shah of Iran, it is supposed to be a huge collection of extremely rare, dusty and exotic automobiles.

Ishfahan is supposed to be a jewel, Teheran for the most part really is a smog dump, but it has some nice parks and awesome skyscrapers
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Old 01-15-2007, 09:51 AM
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There is a great movie, "House of Sand and Fog" Jennifer Connelly and Ben Kingsley. It hits a few tender spots, packed into suspense until the end.
I have friends here, who have relatives in Iran. What gets me, is the response to my question, if the euphoria about a possible military escalation with the US is similar to here, just switching the point of view.

Supposedly it's hardly a daily subject, business as usual.
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Old 01-15-2007, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmac2012 View Post
My worry, and I'm certainly not alone in this, is that sabre rattling and actual sabre wielding by the Bush-o-mon will give Ahmedinejad a new lease on life.

Soft power not only works better than hard power, in many instances, we make money in the process.
I'm noticing a possible similarity to China. No so very long ago, the relationship between the Communist Government and the West was very delicate aswell (Korea, Vietnam, Tibet, Tiananmen). I'm not sure when that changed exactly, but somehow that conflict was suddenly just..... gone. Bypassed by economic developments and prosperity.
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Old 01-15-2007, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Vronsky View Post
I'm noticing a possible similarity to China. No so very long ago, the relationship between the Communist Government and the West was very delicate aswell (Korea, Vietnam, Tibet, Tiananmen). I'm not sure when that changed exactly, but somehow that conflict was suddenly just..... gone. Bypassed by economic developments and prosperity.
A fine example of this all is that Vietnam grew it's own rice. One year, harvest was so bad they had to import cheap broken rice to feed the people. Next year, govt said they could keep the profits and by magic, Vietnam started EXPORTING rice. Next year, rice production increased. China has realized that it is not working out so they are changing their ways. Also, losing a big friend in Russia might not help. The Chinese are starting to want more and more of the finer things in life. They are NOT governed by religion. The difference is doctrine doesn't promise you as much as religion. Therefore doctrine can be more easily dispensed with than religion. Doctrine promises you benefits IN THIS LIFE. Now, if you don't see it or see it appearing to come, you might abandon your doctrine. Religion, OTOH, promises you things in the LIFE TO COME. Therefore, it makes it easier to sacrifice and not get so critical about why things are not getting better.
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  #8  
Old 01-15-2007, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Vronsky View Post
I'm noticing a possible similarity to China. No so very long ago, the relationship between the Communist Government and the West was very delicate aswell (Korea, Vietnam, Tibet, Tiananmen). I'm not sure when that changed exactly, but somehow that conflict was suddenly just..... gone. Bypassed by economic developments and prosperity.
Good point and a great opportunity to promote Adam Smith's view that liberty and free trade are so entwined as to be inseparable.

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Old 01-15-2007, 02:17 PM
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Good point and a great opportunity to promote Adam Smith's view that liberty and free trade are so entwined as to be inseparable.

B
This must be that once-in-a-year moment we actually seem to agree on something
Are you well?
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Old 01-15-2007, 02:35 PM
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Good point and a great opportunity to promote Adam Smith's view that liberty and free trade are so entwined as to be inseparable.

B
I don't know about others. But if I get paid $1000 to treat patients, why should I bother to work harder? Now if you said that the harder I work, the more money I get, now you have provided incentive. As a waiter, if I get 15% of your bill irrespective of the service I provide, why should I care to care about you? Screw you if you don't like it. I get my 15% either way. Now, in most restaurants here, they go with a tip system and I tip according to the service. Poor services gets a nickel and their managers ear ripped. Average service gets 10-15% based on how much the bill is. Great service gets 20-25%. Hot busty woman with low cut dress and short skirt well.......
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Old 01-15-2007, 04:10 PM
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Persian women are hot!

But will they give it up to an infidel like what we are? That is the more important question.
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  #12  
Old 01-15-2007, 10:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmac2012 View Post
From the SF Chron travel section:

The joke was barely out of my mouth before I regretted making it.

"The Great Satan," I'd quipped when the Iranian airport security official asked me where I was from. Unsmiling, he looked me up and down and said, "Please come with me."

A thousand thoughts exploded in my head, none of them comforting. But it turned out the man only wanted to walk around the corner for a little privacy so he could ask about getting a visa to come to America.

It was a most unexpected welcome to Iran -- but not, as it turned out, all that unusual. During the month I spent there last fall I had similar exchanges with Iranians from all walks of life, few of them interested in discussing the animosity that has existed for so long between our two governments.


More:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/01/14/TRG1DNG0JT1.DTL&hw=iran&sn=001&sc=1000

Some good photos and a video.
Thats what I have been saying. The average Iranian is not going to support starting a major war. Thats why when people worry about Iran get nuclear weapons I say don't worry.

Iran was a pretty liberal country before the currant government, and I suspect will return to a more liberal country at some point in the future.
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  #13  
Old 01-15-2007, 10:23 PM
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Thats what I have been saying. The average Iranian is not going to support starting a major war. Thats why when people worry about Iran get nuclear weapons I say don't worry.

Iran was a pretty liberal country before the currant government, and I suspect will return to a more liberal country at some point in the future.
The average American sure as heck doesn't want an expansion of the war into Iran. They have 3 times (or 4 times) the population of Iraq and a brief fly-through of both countries using GoogleEarth will demonstrate clearly that Iran would be a far, far tougher conventional war to fight.

Plus, the whole nuke thing (to me) is not yet compelling. I think they're a greater long-term threat than Saddam was in 2003. I'd put them on par with Saddam in say, 1989. But with that religious compulsion that Saddam didn't have.

If they test a nuke device, and maintain the same virulent hostility to the USA, then that would be the time to nuke them. By nuking every one of their military facilities, nuke research and construction facilities and conventionally attack political targets we could set them back a couple of decades. Then start funding covert insurgencies, primarily using the Kurds but also the marsh Arabs and Paks, both of which have long-standing bad relations with Persians.

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Old 01-15-2007, 10:34 PM
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Interesting points. Still I don't see them as a major threat yet. I'm in the wait and see mode, besides last I heard they are at least ten years away from a nuke.
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  #15  
Old 01-15-2007, 10:52 PM
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Interesting points. Still I don't see them as a major threat yet. I'm in the wait and see mode, besides last I heard they are at least ten years away from a nuke.
Hopefully by then, the internal contradictions of Iran will effect a change.

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