I am just curious. Does anyone know if performance and efficiency of electric cars and/or hybrids suffers in the winter? I see a tesla almost every day and I am wondering how long that guy is going to drive it in the cold...Also other new cars coming out like the Nissan Leaf are all-electrics. I know that batteries suffer in the cold as evidenced by numerous "Car won't start" threads over in DD and TH sections. Thoughts???

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TC
Current stable:
- 2004 Mazda RALLYWANKEL
- 2007 Saturn sky redline
- 2004 Explorer...under surgery.

Past: 135i, GTI, 300E, 300SD, 300SD, Stealth

For lead acid batteries, there is definitely an effect:

http://corrosion-doctors.org/Batteries/high-disch-temp.htm

I'm not sure how much low temperatures affect other types, but I assume that there is some effect.

Most hybrids, like the Prius, have ventilation to the batery cells, but also uses cabin air in low temps. Range probably takes a hit when the car sits overnight in low temps, and even a bit once up and running, but the hybrids do seem to work in the white stuff and also in the scorching sun . . . the joys of modern automotive testing.

What do they use to heat the passenger compartment? Heat pump and electric resistance?

On a lead-acid electric, when temps get down close to freezing, and there isn't any provision for battery heating, you'll lose 50% of your battery capacity/range. First hand experience with that.


Don't know how the higher end/different chemistry batteries in the hybrids re affected. But I have seen one report, supposedly issued by Toyota, that in freezing temps the plug-in models of the Prius hybrids only have a 4 mile range on electric only.

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Just say "NO" to Ethanol - Drive Diesel

Mitchell Oates
Mooresville, NC
'87 300D 212K miles
'87 300D 151K miles - R.I.P. 12/08
'05 Jeep Liberty CRD 67K miles
Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/08/19/review-2010-ford-fusion-hybrid-what-a-difference-60-degrees-m/

Autoblog reviewed the Ford Fusion Hybrid in warm weather (CA) and cold weather (MI)

Warm weather MPG average: 43.1
Cold weather MPG average: 29.4

Not a scientific test by any means, but notable if you are just wondering.

"Anyone who has ever left a laptop, phone or camera in a car parked outside overnight during winter has discovered that electrochemical batteries (at least the ones we have today) don't perform very well when temps drop below freezing."

"Nickel metal hydride batteries used in hybrids are reluctant to let electrons flow at temps much below the mid-30s. That means that a Fusion Hybrid that starts silently when you turn the key in July immediately fires up the engine when the temperature is 10 degrees. "

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2006 BMW M5 "Heidi" @ 109,000 miles
2005 MBZ C55 AMG "Lorelai" @ 165,000 miles
1991 MBZ 300E "Benzachino II" @ 165,000 miles
1990 MBZ 500SL "Shoshanna" @ 118,000 miles

(On the hunt for a good used M103 engine as of 6/10/23, PM me if you have one to sell!)

If its only electric, you going to freeze your Ass off on a cold morning.

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Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club group

I no longer question authority, I annoy authority. More effect, less effort....

1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
2001 jeep turbo diesel 130k miles
1998 jeep tdi ~ followed me home. Needs a turbo.
1968 Ford F750 truck. 6-354 diesel conversion.
Other toys ~J.D.,Cat & GM ~ mainly earth moving

On my Prius, I have logged every tank of gas over 4 years / 80k miles. My experience with this car is that the mileage drops by about 1 MPG in the winter (which is relatively mild here, but does drop below 10F occasionally).

They tell me that this is mainly due to the engine being run rich for a longer period of time after a cold start in order to heat up the catalyst quicker. Winter MPG drop would probably be worse in short trip driving.

Battery performance wise, I can't tell any difference. The switching between engine and battery power all happens by magic and is usually not noticable unless you are really watching for it.

All electric cars? I don't know much about them, but I know enough not to buy one.

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Palangi

2004 C240 Wagon 203.261 Baby Benz
2008 ML320 CDI Highway Cruiser
2006 Toyota Prius, Saving the Planet @ 48 mpg
2000 F-150, Destroying the Planet @ 20 mpg



TRUMP .......... WHITEHOUSE
HILLARY .........JAILHOUSE
BERNIE .......... NUTHOUSE
0BAMA .......... OUTHOUSE

Excerpt>>"Electric cars face additional problems from the cold. For instance, the range can shorten dramatically depending on battery temperature management, as the cold affects the chemistry of the electric car’s battery. Yet Nissan LEAF fans have found a mysterious, unexplained cold weather package for the LEAF. What gives?

The cold weather package, which has never been explained yet is available for viewing on the Nissan LEAF’s Features and Specs website. There is no price, though the cold weather package includes temperature management, heated seats, heated steering wheel, heated mirrors, and a HVAC duct to the rear. The most interesting tidbit to me is the temperature management system. Is it for the battery, or the passengers? Also, for a car that has to conserve its electricity for driving, heating the seats, steering wheels, and mirrors seems like something of a waste of energy.

In talking to Nissan, Nissan-Leaf.net learned that there is indeed a cold weather package, but that it won’t be available on the initial batch of LEAFs. Nissan also claims that it found it more efficient to heat the seats, steering wheel, and mirrors separately than it was to simply blast the heater. Sounds reasonable enough, but will it be enough for those of us living in cold climates?"