Water damage on dyed concrete floor - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

cmac2012 · #1 02-19-2011, 03:39 AM

A client just remodeled the first house she owned (5 now). She's owned it for 30+ years and apparently has a soft spot for it as she just put about $80 K into leveling the foundation (Berkeley hills - it was tilting downhill - built around 1950) and did a major facelift on the basement studio. I did the kitchen and bath and now she’s just about ready to rent it out. Even bought a new stackable washer/dryer for it (!?).

Today the upstairs tenant called me saying there’s a leak under the bathroom sink. I call her, she goes over (across the street), and freaks out on the phone as 4 acoustic ceiling tiles are soaked, one fell in, the floor wet, and she‘s going to show it tomorrow, well today now.

The leak is fixed (wasn't from any of my work, thank God), new ceiling tiles in but the weird part is the water damage on the floor. The guy who did the foundation work put it in - I’ve never led such a job though I worked one once - the type where you use a mold that imitates bricks with the dye applied as a powder which helps to remove the mold w/o pulling any up with it.

I’m going to call the guy of course but came here first. It has radiant floor heating, it was on high for about 8 hours before these pics were shot - the floor was hot, I was hoping the moisture would evaporate and all go back to normal. Maybe not. I put two business cards up to the dark spot on each side at one spot - 5 hours later the spot was in the same place.

Damn, it looked so nice and now this.

chilcutt · #2 02-19-2011, 04:01 AM

Could there be a body buried under the floor?

cmac2012 · #3 02-19-2011, 04:48 AM

Yeah, right.

t walgamuth · #4 02-19-2011, 06:44 AM

There must be a weak area in the cracks that has admitted water under the dyed surface of the concrete. I would suggest keeping the heat on and waiting a week or so and see if it helps. No sense being in a hurry. It's not in the living room is it?

layback40 · #5 02-19-2011, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

There must be a weak area in the cracks that has admitted water under the dyed surface of the concrete. I would suggest keeping the heat on and waiting a week or so and see if it helps. No sense being in a hurry. It's not in the living room is it?

X2
Its mainly around the expansion joints. They are designed to have cracks in the bottom of them so the moisture has got under the surface. A few weeks of warm dry air & it will correct.

mgburg · #6 02-19-2011, 11:54 AM

When you mentioned radiant floor heating, my first thought is "Did the installer (or one of the helpers) accidentally "pierce" any of the tubing while fastening it down? I remember one of those home shows on PBS showing a complete install of RFH from pre-prep-to-finish, and depending on subsurface, there were special clips that needed to be used to hold the "piping" down. All the piping was that special plastic stuff that they dispensed from a "wheel" setup in the middle of the room. This system they were installing had "zones" setup so there was a ton of tubing being laid out and the manifolds to turn on/off each of the zones made the control area look like a "ballast station" on a sub.

Anyways, it was mentioned/stressed that you had to be extremely careful not to puncture, run any equipment over or pinch the tubing or you'd be in for a very expensive "re-do" for this particular project.

I'm hoping, for your friend's sake, this isn't the case...

One other question. Does the whole project look just like the picture you have posted? Or, is it in one certain area, eminating outward from that one spot? If it's the former, then everyone might be correct in that the moisture from the floor-mix just has to finish purging itself. Otherwise, if it's the latter...

kerry · #7 02-19-2011, 12:03 PM

Hmmm? Old brick house across the street had a leak in the upstairs bath that ran for a number of days soaking the (old soft) bricks. Stains were clearly visible on the outside of the house for years--maybe they still are if I look closely. So my confidence of the stains disappearing naturally is not high.

TMAllison · #8 02-19-2011, 12:46 PM

A dehumidifier might pull the moisture out quicker than heat. You can rent them.

I'll bet the stained concrete fill has a layer of visqueen beneath it isolating it from the slab or plywood subfloor. That is going to have trapped whatever moisture hit the floor and prevent it from beinging pulled downward. Guessing the moisture pattern is going to be visible for many months before it dried out, at least to those who know its there.

I've seen limestone, granite, marble and expecially Sadlerstone (concrete tile) floors wick moisture from freshly grouted grout joints over an inch into the edges of 2cm stone which can take as long as a year to dry out. The CJ's in the stained overlay will act the same.

The ocean influnce and damp weather in Berkeley isn't going to help matters....

professor · #9 02-19-2011, 12:55 PM

Looks like water trapped underneath the floor and it has saturated all adjoining areas where it could have naturally seeped out.
The cement might crumble and get weak and like Kerry said, the stain might be permanent. Water has minerals and they will deposit leaving stains.
You must find the area that let the water go under the floor and pool between the subfloor and the cement. The fact that you have a floor heating system could be a problem as the cement detaches from the subfloor leaving room for water to settle.

cmac2012 · #10 02-19-2011, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

There must be a weak area in the cracks that has admitted water under the dyed surface of the concrete. I would suggest keeping the heat on and waiting a week or so and see if it helps. No sense being in a hurry. It's not in the living room is it?

It's a studio apt. That is THE room.

Here's the craigslit ad:

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/apa/2217154571.html

Good feedback from all, thanks. We're in a 5 or 6 day rainy period so humidity is likely high. I'm thinking it will improve but I also think the stain will remain in part. Ultimate fix might be to paint it, which wouldn't look nearly as cool.

The stained area is under the leak from the bath above, the spot where the four ceiling tiles were ruined. Prior to this and now, no indication that the floor heat plumbing is faulty.

mgburg · #11 02-19-2011, 03:21 PM

Your best bet at this point might be to "seal" off the room as best you can, stick in a self-draining dehumidifier and a couple of blowers to help circulate the air in the room and help dry the "crack" areas deeply. For how long, I won't even guess.

When I had the extension added to my transmitter building in Colfax 2 years ago, the walls were up and the pre-stressed concrete planking was in place, but the membrane for the roof hadn't been placed...and sure enough, the weekend before the roofers finally arrived, it rained.

The walls absorbed whatever seeped down the sides and the floor, which had "some" waterproofing on it...well, it had "some" waterproofing on it.

The roofers showed up on Monday, said they were sorry, but they ended up putting 2 industrial-sized portable dehumidifiers inside the shell. Even AFTER 3 WEEKS of dehumidifing, the walls were still a little damp. Couldn't wait any longer, so on went a base-primer, then it was followed up by two coats of white.

Today, some areas, both inside and out, are flaking. Nothing I can do except keep the air flow going, scraping off the flakes, and then, sometime this summer, do some spot-fixing with the paint.

Water and masonry...they mix and then...it's the ch!ts...

Skid Row Joe · #12 02-19-2011, 05:01 PM

Water will seek it's own level. Water will travel laterally or upward as a vapor as it's drying. Unless water floods, it does not travel downward beyond a given material's porosity/wicking. It will always evaporate laterally/upward.

Water can permanently discolor/stain marble, and many manmade/manufactured materials. You'll just have to wait and see if it does it to this floor.

mpolli · #13 02-19-2011, 05:28 PM

They usually use a water based polyurathane type sealer. So that is likely what is trapping the moisture.

Skid Row Joe · #14 02-19-2011, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpolli

They usually use a water based polyurathane type sealer. So that is likely what is trapping the moisture.

It is highly unlikely that this floor will be "trapping" any water - regardless the composition of sealer used. The water entered from above, (the ceiling poured water) it will exit the same way it came in. Upward or laterally to the drying source. Water does not travel downward in the evaporating process. Once the water source is stopped, nothing is permanent as far as the water is concerned, except possibly the discoloration of the floor because of water standing/flooding.

Skid Row Joe · #15 02-19-2011, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by layback40

X2
Its mainly around the expansion joints. They are designed to have cracks in the bottom of them so the moisture has got under the surface. A few weeks of warm dry air & it will correct.

This floor looks more like stamped, or formed concrete. That is, a metal form was pushed into the still wet concrete, at some point in time, giving the appearance of individual tiles, then removed.

Expansion joints aren't placed in that angular fashion, especially that close together. Interior expansion joints, or cool joints are placed every 20' or so. If you fail to put them in during construction, God will place them there for you in the form of cracks.

It's a very attractive and durable construction surface. My entire home's 1,800 SF of floor space are concrete. Not one stitch of carpeting. Yuk!