Interesting petition from some through-and-through left wingers: http://rethinkafghanistan.com/

What would happen if declared victory and brought the troops home?

I do think that after almost 10 years it is time to significantly reduce troop levels. The US simply can not afford to maintain that level of operations for a decade. The elimination of OBL may be the "symbolic victory" that allows to US begin to walk away. My guess is that there will be a significant reduction by this time next year (prior to the election).

Afghanistan was the right war fought the wrong way. The first 6 months were perfectly executed. We should have left before that first year was out.

Bush bringing Karzai to Congress was dumb -- it personalized our involvement in Afghanistan with an individual who has proven to be too weak and too unstable to grow beyond, "Mayor of Kabul."

Obama had a great opportunity to leave Afghanistan except he blew it by labeling it the "good war" worth fighting. See, had he been clever he could have declared our original objectives had been achieved (and they were, mission creep crept in) in Afghanistan and begun withdrawal of forces simultaneously with the Iraq drawdown.

Now we're stuck fighting in a land that has never been unified, for a form of government never seen (popular democracy) against people who have religious convictions wrapped with national ambitions -- a perfectly unholy storm.

The taliban would return to power, possibly plunging pakistan into civil war and provide AQ and it's wannabees with a new secure base of operations from which to launch 911 ver 2.0 in a few years time whence we will return and attempt to do what should have been done the first time round only at even more expense.

- Peter.

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Bush waited almost a month after 9-11 to invade Af'stan. By then there was no reason, since OBL was long gone, to procede with an invasion. It was a bigger cock up than Iraq.

How is our presence in Af'stan affecting the success of the taliban in Pakistan?
We can continue to buy off the Pakistan g'ment as we have been doing for the last 10 years, and let them fight the taliban.

The only part of that equation that scares me is the Pakistan part. I would rather we need to go back and bomb some new al Qaeda operation than to continue as we are.

The Pakistan part is a tougher issue. Don't know the answer on that one.

Bin Laden was in Tora Bora when we invaded. He slipped through the cordon and into Pakistan during that campaign. The USA didn't know where he had gone or if indeed, he was still alive until almost a year AFTER the Tora Bora campaign.

I agree with you.
The major problem with Pakistan is that Pakistan is itself terribly divided along a number of different factions. This is largely because of how the country was formed -- an artificial construct of decolonialization, not due to shared national aspirations.

The result is a society with an intelligentsia largely committed to secularist democracy (though less a factor now than after statehood because the murderous religious groups kill secularists and non-Muslims); a military corrupted by decades of misrule; a judiciary fearful of the religious groups and a horribly stratified society composed of a ruling aristocracy and peasants/paupers.

No matter what the USA does, I predict Pakistan will eventually self-destruct in a murderous revolution. Better not ot have a hand in it.

But then, ... there are the nukes. In a civil war, those devices will become a prize for everybody. That will be exciting.

India would probably attack them in that case, let India handle it.

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Declare Victory and leave.
Fortify the Pakistan border ( such as it is). Keep an eye on the nukes, and prepare to take them into "protective custody".
Then leave them to their own fate.

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Declare Victory and leave.

If the Taliban or AQ get outta hand and attack THIS country, NUKE them farther into the stone than they are now. There is no reasoning or negotiating with them. They understand nothing but violence and intimidation. Enough is enough already.

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There was no need to invade. We just took out OBL without an invasion.

The problem with these wars is their is no way to win them, we are inserting ourselves into those country's and trying to fix them. That's not how you win a war. It just causes you to get involved in local politics.

You have to totally destroy the country down to nothing and rebuild it, or colonize it.

So yeah this would be a good chance to declare a victory and pull out by the end of the year.

We should concentrate and put a plan in place to seize the nukes in Pakistan if the need should arise, we can probably include a couple other governments in on it. France would probably help.

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The problem is that Pakistan is actually on the same side as the Taliban on the Indian border (common enemy). The US will never get Pakistan to cooperate fully until the India/Pakistan situation is resolved; and that is unlikely to happen anytime soon.