from a "conservative" Republican.
End welfare for the wealthy - CNN.com

Sounds good.

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Whoever said there's nothing more expensive than a cheap Mercedes never had a cheap Jaguar.

83 300D Turbo with manual conversion, early W126 vented front rotors and H4 headlights 400,xxx miles
08 Suzuki GSX-R600 M4 Slip-on 22,xxx miles
88 Jaguar XJS V12 94,xxx miles. Work in progress.

Sign me up.

Although I am pro-wealth, I think it's rather silly the super-wealthy get Medicare, Medicaid, subsidies, and unemployment checks. I also think the poor should pay more in taxes if they're going to enjoy the perks of being an American. Go to India sometime - our poor have cars, credit cards, TVs, and cell phones. Not quite poor in my 'world view'. You live here? Pay up. I do.

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- Brian


1989 500SEL Euro
1966 250SE Cabriolet
1958 BMW Isetta 600

It certainly is an idea that merits open debate.

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1982 300SD " Wotan" ..On the road as of Jan 8, 2007 with Historic Tags

So you would be happier if our poor were as well off as India's poor?

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

more like they should not be called poor, they should be called "not as rich"

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1982 300CD Turbo (Otis, "ups & downs") parts for sale
2003 TJ with Hemi (to go anywhere, quickly) sold
2001 Excursion Powerstroke (to go dependably)
1970 Mustang 428SCJ (to go fast)
1962 Corvette LS1 (to go in style)
2001 Schwinn Grape Krate 10spd (if all else fails)

I don't understand how your adjusted gross income is over a certain amount and your SS benefit does not decrease. How does that work?

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You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows - Robert A. Zimmerman

Maybe it would motivate them to get out of bed and go do something in the morning! In the thirties when welfare started, it was administered by building roads and bridges using the unemployed for labor at a nominal pay rate. They maintained their pride because they were working for the money rather than a handout. If B.O.'s Stimulus would have employed the unemployed who would otherwise have been on welfare, as opposed to pumping big money into the unions, we could have our roads fixed up, help the poor AND eliminate some of the hand out expense. A triple return.

Don't get me wrong, for those who are TRULY in need, I want to help them in any way I can. For those who want to simply lay around depending on the government to support them like the lady with 14 kids in the other thread, they need to take some responsibility for their own actions.

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2001 SLK 320 six speed manual
2014 Porsche Cayenne six speed manual

Annoy a Liberal, Read the Constitution

It's a start. It's interesting that the govt has an income cut-off for VA healthcare but not so with Medicare. My father was told he didn't qualify for the VA plan so he signed up for Medicare. We were just happy to get him off our company policy.

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1980 300TD-China Blue/Blue MBTex-2nd Owner, 107K (Alt Blau) OBK #15
'06 Chevy Tahoe Z71 (for the wife & 4 kids, current mule) '03 Honda Odyssey (son #1's ride, reluctantly) '99 GMC Suburban (255K+ miles, semi-retired mule) 21' SeaRay Seville (summer escape pod)

This is why Obamacare's private option will fail. Why pay for private healthcare when you can put your employees on the government's tab? It is the rational decision.

Because there are few negative feedback loops in private healthcare and none in government healthcare, healthcare costs rise faster than inflation -- there is no incentive to conserve. Healthcare costs will increase at a greater rate as employees are shifted to gov care because there is no incentive to conserve and very strong incentive to spend.

Regulations have made everyone's private insurance costs go up, interestingly and I suspect not coincidentally, making that public option more palatable to those who would otherwise be opposed to it.

Why conserve? "Someone else" will pick up the tab.

If a company can save a boatload of money by dropping everyone's insurance coverage and sending them to public healthcare, they will. That's why it is, for all intents and purposes, a self-fulfilling prophecy. It's almost as if it was designed that way...

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1980 300TD-China Blue/Blue MBTex-2nd Owner, 107K (Alt Blau) OBK #15
'06 Chevy Tahoe Z71 (for the wife & 4 kids, current mule) '03 Honda Odyssey (son #1's ride, reluctantly) '99 GMC Suburban (255K+ miles, semi-retired mule) 21' SeaRay Seville (summer escape pod)

The poor do pay taxes. They pay sales taxes, and they pay property taxes in the form of rents, and they pay corporate taxes in the form of price pass-ons. They also are required to pay SSI and Medicare taxes. What they get to slide on is income tax. And why not? These people are trying to feed families on one or two minimum wage incomes. And this grotesque generalizations you right wingers do about them having "cars, credit cards, TVs, and cell phones", I'll tell you what, why don't you take some of your free time like I do, and go volunteer to work in a soup kitchen or homeless shelter. You'll find out that plenty of them don't. Go put some slop on a plate and give it to some 10 year old kid and tell me how good these people have it. And the ones that do, what the hell does a TV cost these days ? Like 90$? And why should they be denied one? And credit cards? On what planet? And cell phones? They get 10 lousy dollars a month:

Lifeline and Link Up: Affordable Telephone Service for Income-Eligible Consumers | FCC.gov

And cars? yeah, the ones they and their families are sleeping in.

Two observations.

1. Some people do live in houseboats, and probably have financing arragements equivalent to mortgages on homes. In fact, I met a guy from the Houston area this summer who lives on a houseboat in the gulf. Should he be treated differently than you in deducting "home mortgage interest"?

2. Unintended consequences. Recall if you will (& can) the Luxury tax on yachts costing over $100,000. It was so effective it was repealed in 1993, iirc. It had a mostly negative effect in the boating industry, causing boat builders to go out of business, and increased unemployment
New Luxury Tax Trimming Boat Sales - New York Times

This "luxury tax" also applied to cars costing over....ta da.... that outrageously lavish sum of ...$30,000. That went on the ash heap too... but it smoldered longer before being extinguished.
Inside Politics: A hard-earned lesson

If the interest deduction on 'luxury yachts" is no longer allowed ---> the after tax cost of ownership goes up-----> followed by decreased sales--->lost jobs----> higher unemployment---->.

Besides, do the truly wealthy finance these purchases? These are the real boogey-men, no?

Egg Harbor Yacht's saga...

History of Egg Harbor Yacht Company, Inc

During the 1950's, C.P. Leek purchased the remainder of the company's stock from his partners and merged Egg Harbor with Pacemaker Yachts. By the 1960's, this combined organization had become one of the largest manufacturers of pleasure boats in the country.

Despite being part of Pacemaker Yachts, Inc., Egg Harbor managed to maintain its own identity. While Pacemaker concentrated on manufacturing products for the mid-priced, high volume end of the market, Egg Harbor steadfastly maintained its focus as a limited quantity builder of high quality cruising and sportfishing yachts. Egg Harbor's reputation grew through the 1960's and 1970's, with offerings that ranged in size from 30 to 48 feet. Both companies converted from wood to fiberglass construction during the 1970's.

When it first became fashionable for conglomerates to acquire boat companies, Fuqua Industries purchased Pacemaker Yachts, Inc. (including Egg Harbor) in 1965. Both companies were subsequently sold to Mission Marine & Associates in 1976.

Both Egg Harbor and Pacemaker were profitable business units under their new ownership, however, Mission Marine was a highly leveraged min-conglomerate. The parent company experienced severe financial difficulties when the prime interest rate soared to 20% during 1979. As a result, Mission Marine was forced into Chapter 11 that year.

In 1980, the assets of Egg Harbor Boat Company were purchased by an investor group that included Phil Boyd, Jr. and Donald Leek (both sons of the original founders), Peter and Walt Johnson, Jr. (second generation owners of Johnson & Towers, Inc.) and Robert Traenkle (a Pennsylvania businessman and boating enthusiast).

Phil Boyd retired as President of Egg Harbor during 1983 and Rudy Lehnert, an Aeronautical Engineer and avid sportfisherman, purchased Boyd's stock and joined the company as Vice President of Engineering. At this time, Traenkle became President and James Mercanto, formerly Vice President of Marketing & Sales, became General Manager.


Through the 1980's, Egg Harbor invested heavily in new product development, refreshing and expanding the breadth of its line from 33 to 60 feet.

With steadily increasing sales and profitability, the owners prepared to sell shares in the company through an initial public offering. This plan, however, was aborted when the stock market experienced a severe adjustment on what became known as Black Monday, during mid-October, 1987. In reaction, Robert Traenkle agreed to purchase all shares of Egg Harbor Yacht Company through a structured transaction initiated in 1988.

Under now consolidated ownership, the company launched an aggressive new product development program. This culminated in the Golden Egg Series, introduced early in the 1990 model year, which featured four new cruising/sportfishing models as well as two new Aft Cabin cruising models.

While these products were well accepted by the market, the timing for this investment proved fatal. The market for new boat sales soon plunged as a result of a general economic recession, a new luxury goods tax and cumulative overbuilding by the entire industry.

In spite of Egg Harbor's successful performance during the 1980's, the company was unable to service the relatively high level of debt it had accumulated as a combined result of the stock purchase and its aggressive investment in new product development.

This situation prompted Traenkle's former partners to repossess the company and voluntarily file for protection under Chapter 11 of the Federal Bankruptcy Code, during January 1990........

It's called "triple dipping", I know of a guy who is retired military and receives a military pension check, gets a Social Security check and he also runs and profits from a business. Known as "triple dipping".