The germans set yet another standard in racing.... - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

merc lover · #1 03-08-2021, 10:56 PM

https://motorsport.tech/formula-1/das-reboot-how-mercedes-innovative-thinking-can-give-them-another-advantage

cmac2012 · #2 03-09-2021, 01:07 AM

Pretty wild. It seems sensors could easily identify which wheel is steering into the turn and some servo could do the work that is done while pulling on the column. You would think it would be more precise and well timed than with this method. Such an automated method could even be used to reduce tire wear on passenger vehicles though I could imagine that being not cost effective.

martureo · #3 03-09-2021, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmac2012

Pretty wild. It seems sensors could easily identify which wheel is steering into the turn and some servo could do the work that is done while pulling on the column. You would think it would be more precise and well timed than with this method. Such an automated method could even be used to reduce tire wear on passenger vehicles though I could imagine that being not cost effective.

Servos add weight. They've got to be powered and controlled. And those things add weight as well.

Simplify and add lightness.

savas · #4 03-09-2021, 02:24 PM

The DAS system was interesting last season, especially for keeping the tire temps up. It's a one and done thing though and won't be allowed in 2021 but it will be interesting to see if it transfer over to road cars for any reason.

cmac2012 · #5 03-09-2021, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martureo

Servos add weight. They've got to be powered and controlled. And those things add weight as well.

Simplify and add lightness.

That makes sense for racing cars. But in passenger vehicles I have to wonder how many people would be able to adequately navigate the challenge. Timing and amount of movement would be important methinks.

Autoputzer · #6 03-09-2021, 05:55 PM

F1 tires (up to now, anyway) have huge aspect ratios (sidewall height/width), and the front wheel alignment has massive amounts of negative camber (wheels tilted in at the top). So, adding some toe-in might cause the tire to deform and bring more of the contract patch into... well... contact with the pavement during braking.

A few years ago, one team fixed the problem with the inside front tire locking up during braking. They had sort of a limited slip differential and "brake shafts" linking two front wheels together. It worked, but was banned as being a mechanical ABS system.

cmac2012 · #7 03-09-2021, 08:41 PM

Oh no, not another one of those mechanical ABS systems!

Jeez, whatever happened to “racing improving the breed?”

Autoputzer · #8 03-09-2021, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmac2012

Oh no, not another one of those mechanical ABS systems!

Jeez, whatever happened to “racing improving the breed?”

F1's as much a contest between engineers as it is a contest between drivers.

savas · #9 03-10-2021, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autoputzer

F1's as much a contest between engineers as it is a contest between drivers.

It’s mostly car/engineer. Did you see what Russel managed to do in Ham’s Merc in Sakhir? From the very back of the grid to the front simply by changing cars.

Autoputzer · #10 03-10-2021, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by savas

It’s mostly car/engineer. Did you see what Russel managed to do in Ham’s Merc in Sakhir? From the very back of the grid to the front simply by changing cars.

Unfortunately, about half the cars on an F1 starting grid are "mobile chicanes."

Mercedes-Benz saw something in Russel. He'll be back there eventually. I read somewhere that M-B will start giving Williams technical help beyond just supplying engines.

That last 0.1% is the driver though, and that makes the difference at the finish line. That's why they're the highest paid members of the teams.

https://youtu.be/knuYY8oiDZU

https://youtu.be/DDjRdi5zv-w

But yeah, spec' racing series are often more entertaining.

Angel · #11 03-11-2021, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by savas

The DAS system was interesting last season, especially for keeping the tire temps up. It's a one and done thing though and won't be allowed in 2021 but it will be interesting to see if it transfer over to road cars for any reason.

its not the same, but my 14y/o repeatedly(?) asks me why cars dont have 4-wheel steering right now.
I try to explain using adult terms like complexity, liability, weight (no one cares...), risk.... but I dont think he gets it...
...this is a good reason to keep children around

-Dad

savas · #12 03-11-2021, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angel

its not the same, but my 14y/o repeatedly(?) asks me why cars dont have 4-wheel steering right now.
I try to explain using adult terms like complexity, liability, weight (no one cares...), risk.... but I dont think he gets it...
...this is a good reason to keep children around

-Dad

When I was in high school one of my very well off classmates had a new Honda Prelude Si 4ws. It's interesting! https://jalopnik.com/heres-how-the-honda-prelude-4wss-four-wheel-steering-wo-1828459598

cmac2012 · #13 03-11-2021, 03:58 PM

Who knows, perhaps in racing the turning at high speed feature might improve tire wear enough to make it worthwhile for them. For the average street driver, does seem like more complexity than is needed. Not enough bang for the buck.