ML500 vs. Cayenne...

[blackmercedes]

My C230 is in the dealer's shop for the week getting it's new tranny. I have an ML 500 loaner. On the way home, I tee'd up at a light next to a Cayenne. The driver was obviously feeling froggy, and looking to humble my lowly Star wearing Ute. Not sure about the HP rating on the "base" Cayenne, but I know that the "S" is over 400 ponies and VERY fast.

The light changed, the ML500 barked a bit on the rubber, hooked up, almost bogged, and then took off! As it bogged, the Cayenne got about a bumper length, but then the ML caught second and I got about a hood's length. I had a nose on him until we were catching the traffic ahead of us, and we both eased on the brakes.

As we pulled onto the freeway, the Porsche driver, obviously miffed, sped around me and drove at a ridiculously high speed into the traffic ahead of us. I chose to play it safe, and let him go, the scent of "win" still whirling around the Star.

Take that Porsche!!

One of the first cars to hand me my ass as a Ferrari driver was an ML55, which I did not notice what it was until it was too late. Good job BM!!!

[el presidente]

Good Kill, John!

FWIW, I believe the 'S' is the base model. The twin-turbo V8 is designated 'turbo'.

[yal]

LOL nice!
Wait til they start handing out the V6 Porsche Cayennes.

[placo1]

Nice to see the ML500 toast the Cayenne. Porsche sure did screw this one up.

[super SEC]

"Porsche sure did screw this one up."
How did Porsche screw up? I don't like it either but then again I don't like sport utility vehicles. Besides, the ML has been the biggest POS Mercedes has ever built. The ML depreciates faster than any Mercedes I've ever seen and for good reason.

Porsche will probably sell every one of the Cayenne models and have waiting lines for the turbo models. Fact is, the Cayenne turbo was something like the fifth fastest production car to ever grace the Neurneberg(spelling?) track. I'd say that is a pretty big accomplishment in itself. Once again, I don't like the Cayenne but I think it will be very, very profitable for them. Oh yeah, keep in mind Porsche has the highest initial quality of any other car manufacturer on the road. Mercedes is way down near Hundai in quality.

[placo1]

IMO Porsche should stick with its roots and the Cayenne & Cayenne S are the furthest thing from it. Other than the Cayenne Turbo the other versions are just another SUV with the Porsche name....that's all.

I'm sure the VW Tuareg and Cayenne S will be competing head to head since their chassis and overall designs are similar as will the new Infiniti and a host of other SUV's with the emphasis on sport. Again the Cayenne Turbo is definitely the sportiest of the bunch but the Cayenne S and the new V6 due out soon will be shortlived IMO.

For the record I'm not a big fan of the ML either, it also strays from Mercedes roots in one area......quality. No offense to ML owners, just stating what I've read.

What I don't understand is why Porsche doesn't take the current 911 and Boxster and make a stripped down (cloth interior, no trim, racing harness) version for weekend racers? They'd be sticking to their roots, finding new customers and it would cost nothing to produce. It would also cost less allowing a larger customer base to purchase them.

I guess everyone is entitled to their opinnion, lets see how it turns out.

[blackmercedes]

Porsche will sell all the Cayennes thay can paint. And I think they should take the windfall profits and subsidize a club-sport Boxster S-CS that is 300lbs lighter and has 50 extra ponies without a price increase. Make sure there are no "cigar lighter" power outlets or cupholders and the cell-phone toting latte-sipping poseurs wouldn't buy it.

Porsche's customer base has evolved into a group of primarily high-income status seekers that have little idea of how to drive and never venture near a racetrack. It wasn't high prices that limited Porsche's appeal 30 years ago. A 911 wasn't priced much higher than a Corvette. Today, they're twice the price. What limited the 911's appeal all those years back was the car's quirkiness. They were not luxury cruisers loaded to the gills with every comfort device. They were driver's cars, plain and simple. They were light (the new 911 is light? not by a mile!), had good power made by free revving engines, terrific brakes (aided by light weight) and simple interiors with clear instruments and little else.

The car I miss more than any other of the one's I've sold is my 1969 911S. And I miss the Porsche that made it.

[jjrodger]

Am I the only person who likes the Cayenne? I like the way it looks and I like what it is.

It does not suit dark colours and it is not photgenic. But the silver Cayenne S I followed for 50 miles last Saturday evening at never less than 120mph looked great in my eyes.

And this is what the Cayenne is that the ML never can be: the best 4x4 out there. It beats the X5 for on-road manners and it beats the new Range Rover for off-road ability. If the G-Wagen were designed and built today, it might look a lot like the Cayenne. The thing has height-adjustable air suspension giving superior approach, crest and departure angles and better ground clearance than the Range Rover. It has a 66cm wading depth, better than anything else. It is available with PSM and PTM and three diff locks meaning it will go places the Range Rover won't go. Get it on the road, and it goes like stink and handles like a dream. Plus it is built in Germany to higher standards and a better design than the ML.

The Cayenne is pure Porsche: the ultimate in design and engineering.

The Cayenne S has a normally aspirated 4.5l V8 giving 340bhp and 420Nm torque. Top speed 150mph, 0-62mph in 7.2s.

The Cayenne Turbo gives 450bhp and 620Nm, 165mph and 0-62 in 5.6s.

The ML500 gives 308bhp, 137mph and 7.7s to 62mph. It looks terrible, very dated, the design and build are not up to scratch and the off-road ability is really wanting.

I don't think the Cayenne was trying.

Dear Porsche,

Please paint lot's of Cayenne's so I can buy one at a realistic price in the near future. I like your truck!!

Regard's

Rsbiomedical


Not a flame John but I do like the Cayenne, if it proves to be reliable I think the Cayenne and me would be a nice fit. Speed, Hauling and Duck hunting what a great fit!

BTW does the Cayenne have a cam belt or chain?

[jamesnj]

I really like the Cayenne and think it should be given a chance. I think its worth it.

People who own the MLs are not all that pleased with many aspects of the car, plastic. And when the average Joe on the streets learns how much the MLs sell for, he laughs.

I think Blackmercedes driving style is what pushed the ML500 out in front of the Cayenne.


BLACKMERCEDES, how is it you have all the luck? I don't know of anyone else who gets new S500s for weekend drives to BC or ML500s as loaners,even people driving simililarly priced MBs have trouble getting them as loaners when they take their car in for servicing. I don't know anyone who attends these expensive driving schools for next to nothing except you. You must be very influential

[blackmercedes]

Originally posted by jamesnj


BLACKMERCEDES, how is it you have all the luck? I don't know of anyone else who gets new S500s for weekend drives to BC or ML500s as loaners,even people driving simililarly priced MBs have trouble getting them as loaners when they take their car in for servicing. I don't know anyone who attends these expensive driving schools for next to nothing except you. You must be very influential

You're hanging with the wrong crowd. I REALLY want to hang with rsbiomedical! He's the Ferrari guy. I can imagine the neat fun free stuff they get to do. Of course, the admission price is pretty high...

Do you belong to your MBCA chapter? MB Canada aften has events for MBCA chapters, and that's where you can get a high-end "loaner" for multi-day trips. Especially if it's a new model, they are often providing free drives. A bunch of folks in the US got to thrash C32's on a track recently at the "C-Spot" events, though not a MBCA event, that's the kind of thing you need to make sure you get invited to. One way is to buy lots of cars from your dealer. My family/friends combined are pretty good customers (about 7 MB's in the last five years, not the most profitable customer on the books, but a decent commision for a fellow...) and I also refer many folks. That gets you noticed.

As to driving schools, it helps when the school is visiting the track that your cousin is part owner and GM of. Now that he is not, I'm a paying customer.

As to loaner cars, my dealer knows I must have a loaner. In this case they called "last minute" to do my work, and gave me a used model, not technically a service loaner. Their normal loaners are C240/320's, ML350's and E320's. However, the new W211 does not seem to have made it into the service fleet thanks to high demand. They used to order base model C-Class cars with cloth interiors and no options. However, they were tough sellers when their jobs was done. So, cars they could sell easily became the norm, which is nice.

The ML500 I had showed nearly 20K on the odo, and I would hazard to guess it was either a short-term lease return or a salesperson's demo that got conscripted into the job. They had a W211 E55-K sitting outside, but they said "NO!" when I suggested that...

[jamesnj]

Well you're still very lucky BLACKMERCEDES. There are people in this area making 400k+/year who have purchased many cars from the same dealer who can't get MLs or S class sedans as loaners. I have friends whose dads take their BMWs in for servicing and end of with a little 3 or a rental Cadillac as a loaner.

MBCA chapters are laughed at by sales guys around here. MBCA people are seen as enthusiasts, i.e people who like the cars but have no money

You're also very lucky in that you happened to be in exactly the same place as a Cayenne. You must live in the Beverly Hills of Edmonton. I've only been to Edmonton a couple of times, but when I was there everyone seemed to have "extra" ordinary practical cars.

I live near NYC and have seen many MLs and a few Cayennes, but I've never seen both on the same day lol, you were lucky

Toronto and Vancouver seemed to be the place for big money cars in Canada, usually driven by immigrants from Greece, Italy, and in the case of Vancouver---Asia.


Back to the Cayenne, what I also like about the Cayenne is it is marketed with a educated buyer in mind-----the ML is the Rolex crowd, the Cayenne is the IWC crowd

[yal]

Originally posted by jamesnj
BLACKMERCEDES, how is it you have all the luck? I don't know of anyone else who gets new S500s for weekend drives to BC or ML500s as loaners,even people driving simililarly priced MBs have trouble getting them as loaners when they take their car in for servicing. I don't know anyone who attends these expensive driving schools for next to nothing except you. You must be very influential

Yeah and how do you get those great pics too

You're hanging with the wrong crowd. I REALLY want to hang with rsbiomedical! He's the Ferrari guy. I can imagine the neat fun free stuff they get to do. Of course, the admission price is pretty high...

you got mail


I think BM's access to these cars is more based on what's between his ears good dealers like to get accurate feedback from knowledgeable perspective buyers. I think I get test drives because the salespeople like to bet on how much tread (if any) will be left when the car is returned.