180e brakes
 

hi all
i have a 1991 180e and have some questions about brakes.

1. since these things are pretty thin on the ground it will probably be another 180e owner who can best answer this one, but were ventilated front discs standard equipment? since this is the el-cheapo 190e (eg. no abs) i'd guess that solid discs were standard and ventilated discs were not even an option, but some specs i have seen say that they all had ventilated front discs.

2. are the calipers for the ventilated discs the same? i'd guess not because the ventilated discs are about twice as thick but if they are the same it will make for a pretty easy upgrade.

3. what other australian w201 models had ventilated discs as standard? i am thinking about an upgrade and want to stick with parts from the same series. if i am going to go to the trouble i'd probably go ventilated front and rear. i understand that the later 2.6L models had ventilated discs all round but i am flying in the dark a bit here.

4. is there that much of a difference between solid and ventilated discs performance-wise? while i think this is a great little car, i'd only rate the brakes as average, but don't want to go to the trouble of changing if it won't make a signigficant difference. i don't drive it very hard (apart from the odd italian tune-up) but even in normal traffic conditions the brakes aren't that impressive. i haven't had any problems with them (pads changed very recently and no leaks or any other problems were evident) but they are just a bit ordinary.

thanks
mlc

wow Ive never even heard of a 180E.

that said, you'll need the bigger calipers too, possibly the hub and steering knuckle as well.

thanks for your reply john
the 180e is a low budget version of the 190e. it was released in australia only and was kind of a stripped down version to get the price below australia's luxury car import tax. while it is mechanically similar to the 190e, it had no sunroof, no abs, no power windows (although i have seen one or two with them so that would have been one of the few options), no alloy wheels, a 1.8l engine and apparently solid disc brakes. they are pretty popular over here because they are a bit of a granny's car so most aren't driven hard and many have low mileage - mine had 63,000 kms on the clock when i bought it and it was pretty much like new.

in other respects i believe it was pretty much the same as say a 2.0l 8v 190e, so i am not sure about needing different hubs and steering gear. i have read about updgrading 190e brakes using discs and calipers from a 400e without changing the hubs but i didn't want to do that because i'd have to use larger wheels, which can lead to wheel rub and other fun stuff like that.

any ideas, anyone?

thanks
mlc

it just seems like that would be overkill for that car. are the brakes really that bad?

180e brakes
 

i wouldn't say they're bad exactly, but on a car that i think is otherwise great to drive, this is a real weak point. it does get noticeable at higher speeds. even with a raging 82kw it can get up to some reasonable speeds - it's rated to 185kmh or something like that but even when you're doing 140 it would be nice to have better stoppers. it doesn't owe me anything so i don't mind spending a bit on this improvement.

by the way, nice stable. i like the look of your w123s especially. got something against gasoline?:)

The 180E was a uniquely Australian re-badged version of a 190E-1.8. The 180E badge was used to distinguish this "special edition" model from the higher priced and more highly specified 190E-1.8 (and of course 190E-2.0, 190E-2.3 and 190E-2.6 which were all sold in Australia). The 180E marketing strategy and pricing worked well and they sold in good numbers. Surprisingly today the 180E has a resale value comparable to those other W201 models which sold at up to double (or more) the price of the 180E when new.

Now to your brake question. All W201 models shared the same rear brakes with solid rear disc rotors. Even larger model MBs such as the W124 ran solid rear disc rotors and only went to vented rear rotors on the highest performance models. Therefore I would have no concerns as to the capability of the rear brakes.

The 190E-1.8 (180E) ran solid front disc rotors, as did from memory the 190E-2.0. The 190E-2.3 and 190E-2.6 ran vented front rotors which obviously required wider calipers to accommodate the thicker rotors (although the pads were the same size for all types). Only the 16-valve models (which were not officially sold in Australia) gained larger diameter vented front rotors with larger calipers and pads. On the 190E-2.3-16 the front brakes were the same size as those on the W124 300E (with M103 motor). Bigger front brakes still were only used on the 24-valve (M104) and V8 (M119) versions of the W124 (in Australia we never got anything bigger than the M104 in a W124).

If you have concerns as to the capability of your front brakes you could look at fitting those from a 190E-2.3 or 190E-2.6. Those from a 190E-2.3-16 or a W124 would possibly be overkill for the 190E-1.8 (especially those from an M104 or M119 powered W124).

Greg

180e brakes
 

thanks greg. btw i read your post on ozbenz about the "non-existent" 180e, and while it's nothing to debate, as a proud 180e owner i prefer to think that the 190e 1.8 was the imposter ;).

anyway, i think i remember that you are located in sydney, but do you happen to know of any benz wreckers in brisbane?