healed itself!
 

I kid....

No seriously... this one has us stumped. I and the Seller were investigating a small pool of nice fresh oil that we found under the car. A 94 E230 Wagon. And trying to find it we cleaned the whole area around the typical Head gasket leak area (and beyond and more) and we ran it hard. No sign of new oil. Then I left him to it for a week or more. His mechanic tried to get it to leak. He tried to get it to leak. We cannot get it to leak... We have a clean spot around that rear passenger side rear of motor and we cannot get it to show its leak. Anywhere.

This wagon has no history that we know of that we could check. He took the car in on trade. His shop did change the oil just before it was brought over to this shop for me to look at. I saw it first just an hour or two after it had arrived. And we clearly saw the fresh oil on the clean shop floor. And on the belly plastic shield (which we removed to investigate). Had it up and down on the lift. Degreased and washed it.

He and I don't know where to go from here. None of us can get it to leak oil. Price we are agreeing on depends on the fact of a leak or not.

I dunno... got any ideas of how to make a slightly leaking head gasket to show? If it was in my hands I would go far as putting in some dye. But the seller may not want to bother. If I buy it I am buying it on my own eyes and ears.

It is a very low mileage thing. 127K and pretty much mint car with no real other issues. New tires, everything works except the sunroof is slow coming back closed. The wiring harness looks good where I can pull back the covering in three or four places. Looks newish even. We are at $3400 right now so I doubt thats too bad. I would prefer to be at $2500 if I KNEW and could show the headgasket had caused that puddle.

I suppose it is possible that the other shop that changed the oil, dumped oil down on the pan and the trip blew it back off the pan and dripped on the floor. But I hate to conclude that and be wrong.

Any ideas?

There was an oil capacity change TSB from the Factory on that engine...
If you fill the oil level back to the top of the dip-stick and run it , you will then want to check where the head meets the block at the R/R of engine.
Once the oil level gets down to the new capacity , [ which is what has happened in your case] , it is less ikely to leak.
The TSB says to never fill the oil level past the 1/2 way mark on the dip at normal running coolant temp. The capacity was decreased by .5 ltr.

TSB 18-.945
Cap change from 7.5 ltr to 7 ltr..oil/filter capacity . Notation should be changed in owners manual.

TSB 00.57A Ref. 00/134 Level Check Procedure:
Oil level should be check only after the engine is at least 80C and has sat for min of 2 min. The dipstick should then be fully inserted for at least 3 secs. The new level should not excede the 1/2 way mark between Max/Min with car on level ground.
Owners should be notified to refrain from Topping Off oil level beyound 1/2 mark.

<we cleaned the whole area around the typical Head gasket leak area (and beyond and more)>

Which area are you talking about.
104 engines leak at both ends ..the R/R head gasket seam, passenger side ...and the lip seal up front.

We were primarily looking at the right rear Passengers side. We concentrated there because it was " more grime and greasy" accumulation there. But we cleaned that entire side all the way to the front. Although not much build up of greasy grim up front. In fact pretty clean up front. and over half way back. And also we looked there because the oil spot on the undebelly pan (plastic tray) seemed to be located near the back area of that pan were it was dripping out the back to the floor. But probably some blow back was occurring there too.

I did check the dipstick and it was just barely over half way between the marks. It was barely warm at that point and not what I would call Hot like described. However I cannot make any assumption that it was perhaps overfull before that point. It certainly would seem it was very likely.

The total amount of oil leaked, and it was fresh clear oil, was perhaps 3-4 tables spoons. If I would venture a guess on total fresh oil on the pan and floor, I would say about 6-8 table spoons or perhaps a half a cup total all together. But I am sure some could have leaked on the way over and not been left to drip off. But what I saw in all could be considered about 100ml or so.

I can tell you that the shop that would have done the oil change was a Honda dealership. And would not have much experience with Mercedes motors. And the owners manual is missing so they would have had to use some sort of other database to decide how much oil to put in or they just did it by eye.

So it is very likely it as a bit over filled. .5 liters would be a fairly large amount too. But... is leaking then normal when over filled? Seems odd to thinks so but... Seems that overfilling is still showing a leak that needs attention doesn't it? Or is Mercedes saying that if it is overfilled and leaks then the fix is to not overfill it? Or should it be considered a leaking Head Gasket and replaced?

My feeling is that it was slopped on top of the engine, ran back and off the rear or side, and the top was wiped down well to clean up the visible part of the mess. The rest of the oil made it down the engine when the engine warmed up and was driven to the shop.

This was indeed one of our evolving theories.

However Authur's information is very interesting and very close to fitting the whole mystery very well too. And perhaps even more plausible.

Also keep in mind, in normal configuration, there is a large belly pan of plastic that sits below this all and would catch any oil coming off the motor. We removed that for diagnosis and still have it off. But it was on and intact when the oil was changed, car driven from one shop to another (30 some miles or so) and when I first started examining it. And the oil was dripping from the rear of that pan.

However I am trying not to make a $1200 mistake so I want to flesh out and minimize the risk of that as much as possible. If I (we) conclude that he gets more money for it. However... one always knows there is a risk and has to be prepared for it to bite you in the arse later anyway. Just want to go into it as sure as one can be. If it turns out I buy it and it has to be replaced.... so be it I guess. But now would be a good time to know for sure. To my advantage that is.

The thought is that TSB was Benz attempt to cover their ass with the TSB issue...
I would leave the bottom pan off, add some oil and run the car up to temp, even bringing the rpms up for a few min... then I would put cardboard on the ground under the engine overnight...carboard shows an oil leak right up nicely. That will give a good indiction as to the location. Traveling with the car tells nothing b/c of the airflow effectively transferring the oil.....

I have seen many 104s that leak with a full dipstick and they stop with the lower level directions of the TSB. iIrun mine at 1/2 always, even tho I have changed the head gasket many miles ago. They refuse to go into detail on the WHY of the TSB, but it was something b/c there were 2 more follow up ones....and the final one was the their directions of how to check the dipstick [ which I posted]

Interesting. I think your onto it Arthur. Explains the leak then no leak. And if one wanted to diagnostically make it leak one would put a half quart of oil in there, go for a run and park it again. Then it should leak if its leaking at the gasket. If no leak them perhaps not a bad gasket. Brilliant. I'll try it!

Thanks!

Now, one more question. If it does leak when really full, but does not leak when at halfway mark, would you say go ahead and change the head gasket immediately or run it until it gets worse? Keeping an eye on the usual things like Antifreeze use and Oil contamination or Antifreeze contamination of course.

That is the general idea...and the RPM thing is to get some substantial oil pressure to help promote the leak.

I have search for the reasoning of the TSB [ Technical Service Bullitin] and could never get an answer...but my own thoughts are the possibility of too much oil pressure when topped off, thereby aiding and abetting to the head gasket leak, or just to much oil generally, causing engine cavitation ...just don't know why, just do know from experience and feedback from members here that read this when I posted the info a few years back that there was a difference.
Did it attribute to a failure ..???? Who knows..
B/c there has to be something to it, I just do it to their recommenation.
Same goes for tranny...an over-filled trans will act up as well.
As in Music, less is more.

<one more question. If it does leak when really full, but does not leak when at halfway mark,>

If that is the case , then that is your bargaining chip.
Wether it gets worse or not , you will not know until you put some miles on the car. I know guys who have driven 104 with a gasket oil leak for some time b/c the leak is minor and they usually do not seem to effect either the coolant or the compression.
Myself..if it leaks at all, it gets changed.

I would also go into the diagnostic box in front of the battery and get all the stored codes...that would be very telling on that chassis.....and if it has ASR, that is a liability rather than an asset on that chassis.

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=107630

Yes, it does not have ASR so I got even more interested in it for that reason.

I don't have a specific code reader. Only a ODBII reader.

I was only thinking of perhaps running it until I get this other car sold is all. This car would be designed to replace the Wifes Pathfinder as her Grocery getter car. This particular car (now the pathfinder) gets cranked up on Saturdays only for her and her mom to go shopping and they make about a 30 or so mile round trip. My thinking is a Wagon will haul more, ride more comfortably and actually might get a tad better fuel mileage while providing a little easier entry and exit for Mother in law. The Pathfinder gets 16mpg tops so switching to a wagon that uses premium is probably nothing but a straight trade off though. But since we moved down nearer the "flatlands" we don't need a 4 wheel drive vehicle anymore.

But with four cars already for the two of us we certainly don't need another. So if we get this wagon, one of them needs to go. So I would rather get the money out of one of them to get on with the Head gasket fix rather than raid the savings account at this uncertain time. It could take some months to move the Pathfinder.

"I have search for the reasoning of the TSB [ Technical Service Bullitin] and could never get an answer..."

Many times the reason for TSBs is discussed in the tech section of The Star. If you have the date the TSB was issued, and copies of The Star around that date, it might yield your answer.

That would be a great place to go for the purported, pretextual rationale for it.

<Many times the reason for TSBs is discussed in the tech section of The Star. If you have the date the TSB was issued, and copies of The Star around that date, it might yield your answer. >

Been there , Done that .. I am a Star subscriber.

<I don't have a specific code reader. Only a ODBII reader.
>

All you need is a 12v led from Radio Shack. The part # mentioned is already 12V [ meaning it already has a resistor built-in]...and has leads already on it , so you do not even have to make the tool if you just want a quicky code check on that car. You use it the same way as the tool, but you ground the led lead for the required tme instead of using a push-button sw. But for another buck, get the sw to make it easy........
That is all that is actually needed, right off RS shelf.
If you buy the car, you are going to want to make one with the sw and a chassis anyway....handy tool on that pre-OBD2 system, as you can see on that code page.
The tool is just a copy-cat extension of the built-in led/sw circuit. I justs copied the wiring off the Schematic of the Diagnostic Socket from the built-in one and put the 2 components in a case with leads so it is portable from car to car and also allows you to get into those other modules ..[ which is where the real Mangement codes are] On that chassis , I would be interested in pins 8 and 14, along w/DM . I also have plug ends that convert the leads bananna plugs to the plugs for the 38 pin DS. So, it can be used on all those models. You only need the banannas for that 16 pin box.

Ok trip to Radio Shack is now in order... Not sure I quite understand the actual way of use of it yet but will begin researching that.

Pretty simple..
Do a search..there is tons in there.

On that car, the tool requires 12v to operate, so make those leads red and blk, as auto electronics are basically red for pos and blk for neg. Those leads will just plug into the #1 pin for neg [ ground] and the red to pin #16 for 12 v positive. That gets your 12v power to the tool............
Now, I make the third wire a different color, just so you don't get them confused....the odd color just goes to the different pins ..each pin is wired to a specific Engine Management module .
Example ..Pin 8 is the HFM/SFI ignition module...you go to that pin and it will get the codes in that module.
The retrieve/clear procedure is the same as one uses with the built-in LED , with a couple of exceptions for memory clear...but I will get to that after you get the codes just to save any confusion...
You just want to go see if any of the mentioned pins have any codes , as the CE lamp does not tell you that...the CE lamp only tells one if there is an offending emmissions code in the built-in module [= N/59 emmissions module]
The pressing down of the sw. simply sends an Initiation signal to the module and that sig tells that module to send back the stored info in the form of a Flashed/Numerical format back thru the odd lead...you count the return signal flashes and look up the code in that chart I sent you too.
These two mentioned pins [ 8/14] on that car tell much info from EA/CC/ASR/IGN/Injection/Etc...so they are the main ones you want to know, and you will not have anyway of knowing that there is a problem til you buy the car...just b/c there is NO CE means nothing... Car Sales guys use the Old No CE trick all the time....you want to go get the real codes before purchase..I certainly would.
If you get a Single Flash for those module, you are real cool b/c that means the are NO codes ..a very positive sign of the electrical mangement systems on that car.
That car is the last of the OBD1 Flash Format, so guys like them as far as owner code access...........
*One last note:
LED's are POLARITY sensitive, so make sure you adhere to the correct -/+ wiring... so many guys make the tool and then report back that it doesn't work, only to find they did not check that. When the tool is done , a quick test is to try it across your battery terminals... rd to rd / blk to blk...press sw., if it does not light when you press the sw, it is not in polarity.

Got it... Power suppled correctly to the tester, then plug into the pins wanted to explore, flip switch, and count the flashes. One flash is good. More flashes means read corresponding list to determine reason.

Sounds fairly easy. Wonder if my independent has one of these I could borrow. Might be worth a call...

.... on a Related note... I am about convinced this car does have a Head Gasket leak and am going to proceed on that assumption. However that leaves me guessing at value. Many be someone will wish to venture a guess.

The car has 127K miles on it. Paint is above average. Clear coat intact. No bubbles. Interior is Leather and both it and carpet is well above average and all little things work as they should. Original working radio. New tires (perhaps not the best brand but brand new). AC and heat and vents work, all windows work from all their various positions, Locks all work. Spare, jack and tools and first aid kit there. All instruments work and instrument lights work as should. All original floor mats in perfect shape. All lights work and are intact. 2 owner all souther car. Clean carfax record

Things not working and needing attention:

Pull release for hood needs replacing
passengers side mirror broken but glass and pod intact. Probably needs replacing though. Might can fix. I can do body work and have facilities and experience to paint two stage. I figure a couple hundred to replace. Looks like someone who did not know how to go into the mirror tried to get into it the wrong way and did more damage than should have.
Sunroof slow to close. Quick to open.

Unknown but probably good. He inspected wiring for me and I have to now inspect in person. He relates that he pulled back all places he could find and wires looked normal and even maybe newish. Still need to verify.

His last number he said he needed was $3400

My thought was no more than $3000 (assuming wiring harness is good and figuring the head gasket is leaking) My indy has quoted me $1000 to $1200 for the job.

"leather and carpet well above average" means nothing. Either it looks great with no wear or it has problems.

With those miles, if color and condition are good, and it is expected to need a head gasket, you're in the right range at $3k IMO, for retail.

[QUOTE=cphilip;2048382]Got it... Power suppled correctly to the tester, then plug into the pins wanted to explore, flip switch, and count the flashes. One flash is good. More flashes means read corresponding list to determine reason.

No " flip the switch".... it is NOT a toggle sw...the switch has to be a Momentary/ Norm Open PB type switch...which is a push button switch..Normally OPEN ...you have to turn ON the key and then push the switch ON for 2-4 seconds.. that 2 sec. is the initiation sig to the module being tested ...release and then the code will flash back..write down the code and do the procedure again..they will keep flashing back in numerical sequence until the first one re-appears..you then know the module has gone thru the entire storage bank. Go to next pin w/odd color lead and do it again for that module. etc....
Ideal is a Single Flash, but I doubt you will see that .

It is near flawless as far as wear goes. Not even a lot of wrinkles in the leather. There is a tad of fiber wear off on the drivers floor mat but surprisingly not too much. No stains. The Zebrano wood clear coat has not started to crackle anywhere. No dash fade or sun fade and no cracks in any of the plastic parts. Appears a garaged car well maintained. Best I have looked at anyway. That partly the reason for my interest.

The color combination is that Goldish tan metalic with Cream interior. A nice color combination for the South. I wrote those codes down somewhere planning to look them up but seem to have lost the slip I wrote them on. I'll see if I can get a picture up of it. Maybe you can tell me the correct colors it has in the mean time.

I failed to mention that there is a new Water pump on there, and a new (saw a remanufactured sticker) Power Steering box on it and appears all new hoses. The wrong coolant is in the car now, but it is fresh and clear. No signs of chocolate moose under the oil cap, no signs of anything in the coolant but needs changed to be correct type.

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...ip/MBGold3.jpg

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...ip/MBGold2.jpg

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...ip/MBGold1.jpg

Gorgeous colors, looks like Smoke Silver with Mushroom vinyl/MB-Tex interior. My '91 had the same colors only leather, timeless.

I can see why you're wrestling with the purchase. In my opinion, if you like the car, colors etc., the condition is right, paying a premium for it is not a bad thing. You could let this one go and the next one would be a white with blue interior ex-service car, and then wish you had ponied up the difference for the one you liked (unless you like the white/blue nautical thing of course, just an example). I bought two '94s a week apart, the first one a good low-mile car, then a black on black one came up with heated leather, I paid triple what I paid for the first car (and with more miles too!). If I could only have bought one, it'd be the one that makes me smile because the colors look just right, even for the extra money.

Buy it and hope the HG is okay? I believe that trade-in for a clean one is only around $2500 BTW, so take the guy $3000 cash (or a check), hand it to him and say: I can get this much today, and it's off of your year-end inventory. Have the rest of whatever you feel your top dollar is in your pocket if he lets you walk, go out to the car after telling him you'd like to take a last look, you can always hand him the rest and make it happen, no shame in buying a good car at a fair price. December is the lowest-selling month of the year for dealers, and the end of the year is when most of them have to count their inventory for taxes. I've bought around half of my cars in December, close to 2/3 of them in November & December, money talks.

<Not even a lot of wrinkles in the leather.>>

It's a Wagon ..with MB/Tex.

Which I prefer In an older model.

IIRC there is a slight difference between upper and lower exterior color. Two tone to a very slight degree. But its not terrifically distinct difference.

Yea sorry about the newby Leather reference. I do prefer the MB Tex too. It actually is nicer than the leather. Feels better to me. Has all the power options in the seats though.

It is a clean one. I first (well in the process) offered $2500 on it and would love to stay there. He told me yesterday he has $3400 in it and would take that. I said I would think on it and, of course, need to relook at it hard again. Verify for myself the wiring was good. He is, today, driving it with a bit more oil in it to test that out. I will probably sleep on it, hear what he has to say about the Oil fill test and decide if I want to offer $3000 and see where it goes from there.

The only other color I am keen on is White with Cream or Mushroom interior. I have looked at now five cars. Three of them white. All higher mileage and not in as near clean condition. All but one had indications of Head Gasket leak perhaps. One of those with 4 matic and a busted front boot. A real list of knicks and things to fix. Wasn't worth $1500 that I offered and he though it was worth way more. Most of the ones I have looked at or talked to the seller about were in the $2000 to $3500 range. One of those was over 230K with no documents. Not too torn up but not mint. A recent one I looked at had documents of new wiring and head gasket some 60K earlier in its life and it was $4900 and it sold while I was thinking about it. No big loss there but was a nice well kept car. Not as mint as this though. And I did talk to a guy about a white and blue one. Just couldn't get interested in that thing at all. And one last one I was thinking about looking at sounded and looked good in pictures but had had its "motor replaced" according to the owner. And it had a "front seal leak" also according to her mechanic who would fix it for $400 and she just couldn't afford to put any more money in it. She wanted $2800 for it. But the whole story sort of turned me off. Didn't make sense and was going to have to go see for myself. Might still go though. Could be something simple. I can't get much out of her as she doesn't seem to understand the technical questions. It could be that it had a new head gasket not a motor as she said he charged her $2000 for the job. The front seal could be the Timing cover gasket.

This one here, however, is the neatest tidiest of them all. Except for that head gasket it would already be in my driveway... but it still might be the one.

<<Yea sorry about the newby Leather reference. I do prefer the MB Tex too.>>

Ever go to a junk yard and look at the seats in an old 70's Benz that has sat in the junkyard with open windows and sun exposure for 10 years???? ya see these new looking seats and wonder why this car is in the junkyard..

Stuff is amazing, to say the least...thats why it is in the wagons..
..and if you do your vin, I think you will find the color of them to be Parchment, not Mushroom.

<It could be that it had a new head gasket not a motor as she said he charged her $2000 for the job.>

That would be about right $$$ wise b/c many head gasket jobs require the new Harness at the same time b/c once they are disturbed , they fail horribly...and any Tech who has done a few knows that , so they check that right up front before even quoting .....

I tried several times to get her to look or call and check her terminology but had no luck. Will just have to go up and see for myself I guess if I get interested in that one. Could be a plus. I know there would be no way a Motor would just be $2000. Even a junkyard pull would cost more than that to get ready and put in.

I have Tex in my old 83 and its seen better days. But surprisingly the passengers and rear seats are still pretty nice. I know it can last.

Not sure you can discern the slight two tone from this picture or not...

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r.../MBGold4-1.jpg

I think the Tex is some Warehouse stored Armor Vest material they must have came accross after the War...." Hey Hanz, what do you think we can use this stuff for...? "

They should make roofs out of the darn stuff! :D


Dang it Arthur! Good thing you mentioned it as I have forgotten completely to run this one through the Russian site!!! How could I have forgotten that source! Off to do that! What would I do without you?

Here is the original Tex in the old 83. Sure its pinked a bit and the horsehair is somewhat degraded but... still... 25 years in the southern Sun...

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r.../CocoMats4.jpg

Yep.
My '71 250/8 still look new..

I think I am on to something with the left-over warehouse Armour Vest material thing....
That could be why the Old Timers always refer to to the stuff as "Bullet- Proof "..

"Yeah...it's all coming together in my mind now, Doc ...."

Ok not showing color at Russian site

VIN is WDBEA92E3RF272163

Showing something indicating California car model though. Whats that all about?

Was first in Florida, I know that for sure. Then up here. Never like the sound of the term "California" on these sorts of things.

Couple other things not jiving on it there either but not too much out of sorts.

All 124.092 w/CE lamp and N/59 module are Cal Version.
If not , it is simply Fed version.
Just mandate...could be from Kalamazoo..makes no difference .
Very few Fed OBD1 US versioned 124s in 94/95 b/c they were all going to Cal Version emmissions for OBD2 Mandates... the earlier .93 had many Fed,
That is why they are the last of Flash code... Most Fed after '93 are Candian cars. They had different rules ...light daytime running lights mandate.

Ah.. gotcha.

I think I can confirm the main exterior color, from matching some others in the year, as called Smoke Silver Metallic

Not had any luck seeing a example with the undertone nor one of the interior. Will have to get the codes again I guess.

But Babymog's thought of Mushroom is probably spot on too.

The code you want is TRIM CODE...that will have material type and color for said vehicle. Rugs, headliner , seats , etc...

Yea. And I did write them down. Off the tag on the radiator support. Just lost it in the shuffle somewhere.

Trim Code is not on that plate ...it is with the vehicle Data Card.

<But Babymog's thought of Mushroom is probably spot on too.
>

Possible...

Mt Data links for trim codes do not show anything in that color except Parchment.

But that is Leather Trim, so that is a possible
I will check my library for MB Tex trim on that year/chassis...possibly my Factory Trim Data Charts are incorrect.

I seem to recall one source showing three possibilities of Tan's. But no pictures of them. Just codes. Something like Cream etc. Where did I see that.

maybe then the two codes I remember taking off there were the Lower and upper exterior codes? Don't know as they didn't survive all the way home for me to discover that.

One source with color display shows a two tone used in 1994 of

Smoke Silver Metallic Clearcoat 702/9702
Gray Metallic Clearcoat (matt) DB-7176

Seen on this page: http://www.paintscratch.com/cgi-bin/makepaint2.cgi

I think the interior is a shade darker in person than in pictures. So I don't think its a Cream. However just saw a picture of a car that was described as Parchment and that was close too. Could be it.

Data Card...ask if he has it..they come with the cars Documentation and all codes/option/color for that car will be stamped on it's Data Card.

I am not an expert on trims and spend little time on the matter, so I leave it there.

Ouch, that pinkamino.

Hard to fault the colors, mushroom or parchment, looks great either way. The codes are on the radiator support on the stamped plate also.

What's with the no wipers on the headlamps? Did they become optional on the wagons or in '95? They were always standard on the E-class 'till then (exc. 260E).

The interior color code should be 175, mushroom MB Tex, which should be listed on the data plate. I believe the sales brochures of the day called it Creme Beige, which is essentially the same thing as Parchment - as it was called on the S-class.

?? My '91 SDL had mushroom. Perhaps it's the difference between what the European markets called the color, and MBUSA. My Palomino (US) interior shows up as Saffron (Euro) for example when running the VIN. It definately said Palomino on the window sticker.

Well, its not really that pink in real life. I have seen them much worse. It shows that pink when Flash from the camera hits it. Its fairly much Palomino still. But it is fade some... to be expected after 25 years I guess.

This 94 is certainly not as dark as Palomino from the 80's.

I really don't know why no wipers on the headlamps. Almost all the others I have seen had them. You got me why some don't and some do in those years.

Pretty sure he does not have it. Missing is the owners guide too. In fact we had to call MB to get the Radio code while I was there. It was asking for its code as they had put a new battery in it.

I had both of my palomino 'tex '87s at the same time, the 300D was faded and pink, the 190Dt was a rich original palomino. I had bought them both used, both the same interior color originally, both the same model year. I would assume that the 300D being from Michigan, would've seen less sun than the 190Dt being from FL, but apparently not so. I had considered re-dying the pinkamino in my 300D, but looking closely at the un-faded 190Dt it was not originally a flat color, but more of a pebble-grain coloration, really an attractive color. It could still be re-dyed to richen the color, and would really turn back the clock on that interior. Vinyl is much easier to re-dye than leaher.

Well I did not get it. The DIL went into labor so I had to put off going back down Monday. Then she went back out and they sent her home but they scheduled to induce her today. So again I had to put it off and told him I would be down there Wednesday assuming all went well.

Well, this morning he emailed me and told me it had Sold Monday. So.... somethings are not meant to be. I'll keep looking.

I got a Grandson instead. No leaky head gasket on this one I don't think!

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...anCarroll1.jpg

Ethan Carroll... 7 pounds 9 ounces. Healthy baby is seems. Momma is fine.

I have a feeling that one will leak a lot of fluids. Don't worry, it's normal.

The car would've been cheaper BTW, ...

True indeed.... :o

But... I am now free to pursue other leads. I think one passed by while I was diddling around with this guys. The other might even be better. The other is Polar White over Cream with mushroom interior. A 95 with 149K on it. Supposedly does not leak nor burn fluids of any kind and everything works perfectly... and all records are with this one he claims. Could this be a already done head gasket and wiring harness car? Let us see.... if its still there when I get up to see it that is...

It was disappointing on that other one... I had pretty much told him I was taking the car if the wiring harness checked out (as he said it was) and I was bringing the cash with me. But... I suspect he found a unknowing buyer that paid him closer to his asking before I got back down there. Oh well...