'92-300CE - M104 Head Gasket - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

73Elsinore · #31 11-24-2009, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hispassion

Quick question...

The crank bolt seems almost impossible to get off without an impact gun. (...)

One thing I wanted to make sure of was that the bolt is in fact "right-hand" thread.
Thanks!

The bolt is indeed right-hand thread. I bought a 3/4" breaker bar, a 3/4" drive 27mm socket, and used a 3' cheater - that did it. Me, I would not use a 3' cheater on a 1/2" drive breaker bar.

I don't get how you locked the crank. What did you brace the two longer bolts against that you put through the damper?

hispassion · #32 11-24-2009, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dhjenkins

When you did the head job, did you check flatness of the block with a straight edge & feeler gauges? It won't matter a hill of beans how good the head is if your block is warped.

Since the job is far from done, I will be sure to check the block deck and make sure it is true. Thanks!

hispassion · #33 11-25-2009, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 73Elsinore

I don't get how you locked the crank. What did you brace the two longer bolts against that you put through the damper?

Well, I went to the Nut and Bolt shop and picked up two hard 8mm course thread bolts to screw in. Then I placed a pry bar on them and rested the pry bar on the right frame rail. The thing I need to get now is a 3/4" breaker bar and a piece of pipe. I had my hands on a 3/4" breaker bar last night, but got a longer 1/2" instead. I'm glad I saved my receipt.

Not sure if this picture is any help as the lighting at night isn't that good without a flash and didn't want to bust out the SLR camera.

I also borrowed a homemade bar from a tech at work with two holes in it, but it wasn't long enough to rest on anything, so I didn't use it. I suppose if I was ambitious enough, I would make one that would fit, since I have 3 cars with the M104 engine.
Here's what that bar looks like, using Google Sketchup (1st try).

hispassion · #34 11-26-2009, 12:26 AM

Okay, the Damper is off and I got the bolt loose with a 1/2" drive breaker bar with a 3' cheater pipe. The chain cover came off with a couple of taps with a rubber mallet. The timing chain guides look slightly worn, including the oil pump guide/tensioner. Now just need to get all my parts ordered and wait for the head work to be done. I figured, too, while I'm in there, that after properly sealing certain holes and cavities, I'll pressure wash all the dirt and grime (being careful of the wires) and start clean.

hispassion · #35 12-12-2009, 06:18 PM

Wanted to say quickly that I got the head back this week. It has new intake valves, new springs, seals, standard machine work and some welding to repair the obvious leak. More later as I progress with the job. I hope to have it complete before Christmas.

workerunit · #36 12-13-2009, 12:03 AM

One tip: Be sure that you use compressed air to remove any liquids from the Cyl.Head bolt holes in the block, not doing so risks hydraulically locking a head bolt during reassembly and cracking the block, also fluids in the bolt holes can turn to steam and expand when heated and crack the block. You will not be able to get the bolt holes completely dry, but try to get as much liquid out of them as you can before assembly. I would also use new head bolts.

73Elsinore · #37 12-14-2009, 10:39 AM

Good point on cleaning the bolt holes. Best practice is to chase the threads in the block with a bottoming tap. The thread is an M12. Don't use a standard taper tap becuase it won't reach all the way to the bottom of the holes.

You can reuse your old head bolts if they meet the length spec in the manual.

Make sure you replace all the rubber vacuum bits now while you have the head and intake off. There is a section in the EPC that shows all the vacuum parts and their sizes. Some of them are nearly impossible to reach when the intake is back on. This includes the two rubber hoses that connect to the bottom of the intake. They are cheap and those things cause all kinds of weird driveability problems when they leak.

hispassion · #38 12-21-2009, 10:31 AM

It's been a slow process, but I'm getting ready to put it back together. The head is ready (with the exception of the intake) and the block is nearly ready, too.

Since this picture was taken, I reinstalled the timing cover, taped every possible hole including the block deck and pressure washed the engine compartment and block. It was rather dirty from the long standing (1qt/2000mi) oil leak.

Even though I cleaned the bolt holes brake-clean and air, I still need to run a bottom tap in them for good measure.

Another question...

What is the best way to put the master link in the timing chain? (other than buying the special mercedes crimping tool)

Thanks!

73Elsinore · #39 12-21-2009, 12:05 PM

Looks great. Looks like you still have some crosshatching present in the bores. I too had crosshatching still present in mine after 140k miles.

Now is the time to replace your motor mounts if you suspect they are knackered. There is no easier time to do it than now, especially on the driver's side.

The timing chain master link can be crimped by renting the tool from one of the forum members. Look in the tool rental link here on the site. Another way to do it is to use a hammer and punch to peen over the end of the pins. You will need someone to hold a backup on the opposite side of the link while you do the hammering. Or you can use two hammers - one to do the peening and one as a backup. Either way it doesn't take much.

hispassion · #40 12-28-2009, 02:09 AM

Well gents, it's done.

Thank you for you help, suggestions, directions and other such nomenclature.

With this image I'm reminded of checking every bolt and nut twice, however, this morning, just as I was waking up, I had the scary thought that I hadn't tightened the cam bearing caps. I know I did. But why can't I remember doing it and why such a prominent thought first thing right out of the gate? Lesson here is to trust your hunches, because when I removed the VC to check, they were all tight, except one. One bearing cap was loose!. Gotta love those first thoughts of the morning.

And here she is waiting for me to turn the key. When I started it, I heard something that sounded like a helicopter. The funny thing was, it wasn't an engine noise, but actually a helicopter flyby. Had me guessing for a minute. Actually, the engine started rather quickly and smoothly, as if to say, "I've been waiting". She's running smooth and has been around the block a time or two already. Monday, she gets the "commute to work" test.

While running it with the air cleaner assembly removed, I notice something peculiar and was wondering if anyone else has seen this before. Now, I have seen blow-by and I understand how it happens, however, I'm wondering if maybe I have an inordinate amount of it. If you can view this file, feel free to comment.

http://files.me.com/benzman35/eulwtq.mov 16.4mb (uncompressed)
http://files.me.com/benzman35/576ods.mov 1.6 mb (compressed)
Engine running at no-load, various rpms with air cleaner assembly removed.

Thanks again for all the help. It has been much appreciated.

Michael B.

hispassion · #41 12-28-2009, 02:00 PM

Everything was fine last night. However, this morning was a different story. I backed it out of the driveway, went to the stop sign, then to the light and she began to miss. Then she started smoking, profusely. So, I turned around and went back home, opened the hood to find liquids everywhere. Want to know where I live? Follow the trail of oil and water to my driveway.

Bummer Dude. Insert sad face here. If I were a drinker, right about now would be a good time to start drinking heavily.

Kidding aside. I think I may have damaged the head gasket upon installation, but there's no way to know for sure until I get it back apart.

I called Mike at Metric Motors and he offered a few things that could have happened. First being possible damage to the gasket itself. Second, maybe a wrong gasket. Or third, possibly some unevenness to the block deck from corrosion.

When I get it apart, again. I'll post my findings.

300EE320 · #42 12-28-2009, 03:15 PM

Ouch! Sorry to hear that. If it is still running, I'd pressure wash it, and then start it briefly so you can at least tell where the big leak is. I wouldn't pull the head again until you know it isn't something silly like a loose clamp or other gasket.

long-gone · #43 12-28-2009, 04:14 PM

When I first laid my head back on the new gasket it went on perfectly, then, I forget why but the rear lifting bracket was in my way of doing something so I lifted it off and took the bracket off. I laid the head down again and then put the bracket on after, but I forgot to put a few head bolts in it to keep it from shifting. Sure enough when I went to crank down on the bracket bolts the leverage lifted the whole head up and jarred it back down again. In doing so, it scraped off a small spot of the rubber bead on the head gasket on the outer edge of the last oil return hole. I called up Victor-Reinz and spoke to a gasket designer about being able to repair the gasket in this non critical area. He thought it would be okay by my description and told how to proceed.
Back to the car again, I laid the head down again, only this time I had to slide it around a bit to find the alignment dowels. As I was starting to tighten the bolts down it sunk in that I may have damaged the soft aluminum head surface on the steel dowels. Off it came again and sure enough there was a small scrape by the front dowel location. Fortunately it fell in a completely safe area. On the last attempt, I used long wooden dowels in two of the head bolt holes and it went straight down into position. I should have done this the first time.
No problems now after a few months, but it's easy to see how some seemingly innocuous things have the potential to cause trouble. Some jobs require very clean, meticulous procedure and if anything doesn't go just right it needs to be backed up and re-inspected/considered before continuing.
Good Luck! Hope it's something easy and not as bad as you fear.

latief · #44 12-28-2009, 08:07 PM

Ouch, when i did my headgasket, i damaged a brand new gasket while installing the head...see pictures of the damage in my thread.

Man, i feel your pain, this is so disappointing....keep us posted, hopefully it is nothing serious ....

hispassion · #45 12-29-2009, 09:08 PM

Well, I found the problem.

9 of the 14 head bolts are loose/stripped. Now before anyone asks "did you clean the threads?" or "did you torque it correctly?", the answer is yes and yes. I cleaned the threads with brake clean and air, an M12 tap, and when I torqued the NEW head bolts I did it by the book (oiled the threads and washers, then 55nm + 90° + 90°).

When I cleaned the threads with the tap, I noticed some corrosion and some unevenness with the threads and I was mildly concerned, but not concerned enough to take a macro picture or to make a phone call. I guess my concern should have been a bit deeper.

So, now the questions begin.... Can the threads be repaired? Can the threads be repaired with the block in the car? Should I begin looking for a short block?

Any technical help or suggestions are appreciated. Thanks!