Look, no offense, but you do realize that If you had taken it to an indy and paid for an hour of diagnostic time when you first posted, your car would have been running for at least a week by now, right?

They have the tools to properly test the engine; you do not.

Without those tools, all you can really do is throw parts at it until it starts...

dh
 

Well-I am interested in figuring this out for myself to a great extent to learn. Moreover, I have read numerous posts here with people taking it to the shop and even the techs not fixing the problem or people being given the wrong solutions and still having the same problem. Unless I am hugely mistaken, many people on these forums have solved their own no-starts as SLR red attests to by temporarily fixing the damaged hoses to ICV in a parking lot. Having said that, I see your point. I am actually paying a tech over the net-he stated a good spark at the coil means the CPS is fine by the way which just about forces me to throw in the proverbial towel.

If you want to learn, buy a proper service manual and read about how your engine actually works. Unless you understand that, all the tools and advice in the world won't help you.

Every problem is different - anecdotes can only get you so far. You've obviously got a problem that is not the "quick fix" type, so it's time to spend some money.

And FYI - there are help lines for techs, too, and the guys on the other end of the line aren't that reliable.

dhjenkins
 

it doesnt take a rocket scientist to understand the basics to get a motor to run which i have read extensively on this site-"engine will not fire for beginners" by one of the moderators and have spent many hours going over other threads and it has helped. I have to disagree with you that the fix is possibly not a "quick fix"-perhaps not to me obviously but I m ok with that. Your attitude comes across quite condensending and really i do find it somewhat offensive. Obviously from your credentials , you are the expert but is the purpose of your replies to help or to show how much smarter you are than everyone else?? No one is forcing you to reply to a post and my questions ONLY to you seem unworthy of this web site. If this site was ONLY for people with credentials and qualified mechanics, and the rules of the forum stated such, then I could understand your attitude. Moreover, on this post, there are two conflicting views with regard to the CPS and coil spark test so I feel it has added some value. Thanks.

Wow, nice way to treat the guy who's offered more help than anyone in your 3 or 4 threads. I see absolutely nothing wrong or offensive with anything he's posted to you. You actually think he uses his free time helping people here for vanity? Are you serious?
Where do you see a problem with someone suggesting that after 2 weeks and 3 or 4 threads that you might be better off taking your car to a shop?? I don't see anything wrong or offensive with that at all, period.
And he is ABSOLUTELY right, virtually every shop, even with master techs, has a computer these days that they use to go on line to research and get advise on procedures and diagnosis. Read the sig lines of some of the posters here, many are experienced certified techs and even they come to get advice and often disagree with each other! (and are usually quite civil about it)

Let me ask you some questions, if someone says to you (which apparently they have), Yes, spilling antifreeze on a CPS might cause it to malfunction, will you replace it? Will you trust that person has any basis to even make the statement? Will you need a few people to agree before you act? What if three people without credentials say yes and one with credentials says no, it's not likely, will you replace it then? They're all just OPINIONS, what will you need to hear (again) before you act on an opinion?

I'll go out on a limb. I've been working on cars all my life, I've worked at a dealership and was certified, and I'll say NO, unless it's already damaged spilling antifreeze on it will NOT cause a malfunction. They're designed and built as SEALED units. How will you know if the seal is good? You'll need to take it out to examine it. Will you do that? If it is damaged it needs replacing anyway. Is it damaged, weak or worn internally? You'll NEED to test it as already suggested several times, to find out. You don't even need to take it out to do that. But even if all appears good I'll say your problem still could be the CPS. Does that help at all?? NO.
If you think it might be it, then just replace the damn thing, no one here can possibly tell you yes, I'm sure that's it! If it's too expensive get one at a junk yard, but unless something else SOLVES the problem it's going to be a likely suspect that nobody on a forum can eliminate [or guarantee] as the cause of your problem.

Have you performed the ohm test on it that DHJenkins suggested (and several posters supported) 2 threads and a week ago? Have you even unplugged it at the EZL to verify a clean solid connection?

Like DHJenkins says [and you're offended by] the only way to PROPERLY proceed in a case like this is to get the testing equipment and methodically eliminate possibilities, otherwise you just throw parts at it on a likelihood basis. Sporadic success like you've had can actually just confuse things even more, leaving you groping at possibilities you thought you already eliminated. Even then, if everything checks out you still might end up throwing a few likely parts at it, but at least you'll have a better grasp of what's "likely".

On a forum like this NO ONE can give you the definitive answer you want to your satisfaction. They can only offer HELP, which is what DHJenkins was giving you, even if it was something you didn't want to hear.

artony12,

This is just my opinion and I'm sure that most forum members want to help, especially since we don't like throwing parts at a problem.

Sounds like you are methodical and have desire to learn about the operation of your 190E. I think if you stick to 1 thread and weed through the suggestions, you'll be able to isolate your no start/hard start problems. Keep testing and reporting back on the original thread, that way it's easier for members to follow. And, most importantly, in the end, post what fixed your problem so others can gain from it.

I've been through all of the components on my 190 and I know that I have the knowledge to make one not start, hard to start, idle low, idle high, etc. This can be done in a matter of seconds.

If you really think that the 'spilled coolant' has caused your problem, then maybe your CPS is defective. If it's even suspect, I would probably replace it as a maintenance item.

Car problems can happen suddenly, like my MB indy friend tells me what he hears from his customers; "the part was working good yesterday". I helped a guy a few years ago that was driving his 190 home from work. He got off the interstate and his engine died and wouldn't restart. He wanted to start checking sensors, CIS Module, relays, etc. I told him to give it a good visual inspection first to try and eliminate anything basic. When he got to the distributor cap and rotor, guess what he found?

Oh, and the part was working just fine the day before.:rolleyes:

Good luck finding your problem,

Dave

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...rokenrotor.jpg

long gone
 

I have always been very graceful and appreciative of any and all advice and offered which clear to any of the posts and responses to people including dhjenkins who have offered advice for free-this is evident in each case if you read my replies. The point has absolutely nothing to do with dhjenkins is wrong or not i simply dont like being told I know nothing about how an engine works and chastized for posting more than one thread or told to take the car to an indy or in my opinion comes across as condenscending and i am not just refering to this one post-i know I have the option of taking the car to a qaulified mechanic. Moreover, because of the help here I have had the car fire up and run once so its not a total loss. I simply feel a bit more diplomacy is order-if you disagree thats OK. I had very kindly stated to DH to keep in mind i am not an expert once already so I stick by my guns. Again, if this forum is for experts only then I can see how i would be in the wrong. Thanks.

Long gone-FYI i did take out the CPS and check those Ohms, etc.

thanks long-gone
 

I wanted to thank you for you time and input regarding the spill on the CPS-I overlooked to do so in my response.

The guys on this forum are here to learn and to spend a few enjoyable, rewarding hours talking cars with each other. That all works much better for everyone concerned if judgmental comments and indignant tone are left out of postings. If someone is slower to catch on than you think he should be, it's easy enough to just pass on making further comments, rather than taking it personal. For your consideration.

slr red, cal learner, long-gone, dhjenkins,quiad
 

Thanks guys for the info and advice esp SLr red, cal learner for your patience and understanding. I think i have a vacuum leak as the spark plugs were dry at first no -start, the plugs were wet with damaged spark plugs(dont ask!) so no fire but with the new plugs it fired, now back to dry after cranking. I have a terrible fuel leak at the fuel distributor but since I have unplugged the fuel relay and just use ether, one would have thought the fuel distributor is out of the picture but I was told something about an 0-ring in there and to replace that. I will spend more time checking the 2 boots as well at the ICV.

Is the leak coming from the EHA area? Those O rings are known to leak.
Also, check the ICV hoses before going any further, if it's not connected to the air intake boot it will not start.

Sorry you got offended, but I'm only stating fact. These engines are far more complex than you seem to realize.



Oh, and starting more than one thread on a single problem clutters up the forum. The ideal thread has a problem, suggestions and a solution - it doesn't just dead end like your previous posts.

Good luck with your problem.

slr red
 

SLR red-The (significant) leak is coming from the top down actually down on to the EHA and flowing down on to the back of the fuel distributor. The O ring would not be an issue with the fuel relay unplugged could it and the use of ether spray to start the engine? I mean with regard to ummetered air? I apologize for my ignorance. Thanks again. :)

Will check those hoses first as you suggest.

Sounds more like a loose injector line. Was there a fuel leak problem before your coolant spill?

slkred
 

SLK-The problem was there before when I had the pententiometer unplugged for a moment but now the the leak is always there. The leak comes from a seam ,if you will, at the distributor(appears to be in two halfs) and not just at one small area. It seems to have gotten worse for certain. Would it play any role if I have the fuel relay unplugged and use ether which was successful in getting the engine to fire a few days ago? I have a vague understanding of the design-im thinking in term of air getting in somehow. Thanks again for your input and time.