119 motor power steering reservior HELP!!!
 

So I F**Ked up!!!! I got the old return hose off and now realized I can't get the new one on without removing the power steering reservior on my 400E, and then I realize that I don't know how to remove this damn thing! Found some wonderful reverse type torx head bolts inside the reservior?? Car is now out of commission until I replace the damn hose! Why Mercedes has to make it a NASA project to remove the power steering reservior I don't know??? Also why I was DUMB enough to start to tackle this on 3pm on a Sunday is just as stupid!!!!! PLEASE HELP:eek::eek::eek:

Yes, the reverse torx come out, you might need to remove that center bolt that the lid cap screws on to as well. You can often get a regular 6 or 12 point socket to get those external torque-headed bolts off, in a pinch (like now!). That's JUST to get the reservoir off, you don't want to remove that short connector hose off as well do you?
Gilly

I allready took it off !!!!!!!! So know I screwed until I figure out how to get that reservior off!!!!!

You said you took it off, but screwed until you figure out how to get it off??? Not understanding. The reservoir is the "cup" that holds the fluid. WHAT are you trying to take off??

Some of the pumps (I can't remember if it was the Vickers or ZF) have the reservoir welded to the bracket, so you have to take the whole bracket off. This is not fun, but the links below will give you some help taking the pump and bracket off. I know the return line hooks up behind the reservoir (first picture in first link). I don't even know how you managed to get the line off.

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showpost.php?p=1979072&postcount=4

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=164607&highlight=400e+power+steering+pump

I hope you have a Vickers/LUK pump and not a ZF pump. Check out step 3 at the bottom of the attachment.

Gilly I got the hose off not the reservior,now I need to take the reservior off to add the new hose

AHHHHHHHHHHHH form what I just read I need to take the pump off and bracket to replace a three inch hose AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH Ishould have just let it leak!!!!!!

Just adding to the confusion.

If the 3 inch hose is the one connecting the reservoir to the pump, you take off the reservoir (the 3 external torx bolts), then loosen the clamps on the 3 inch hose, then the bottom of the reservoir bracket, there is a nipple that screws in to that plate, you unscrew the nipple, then the hose can pull off the pump.

88260E:

If you have the ZF pump where the reservoir is cast onto the bracket and you cannot remove the reservoir, you may still be able to get away with not removing the bracket itself.

In the second link in post #5 above, GSXR pointed out that it was easier to remove the two hex bolts in the back of the pump that hold the pump to the bracket, rather than trying to get to the two 13 mm bolts that mount the bracket to the engine (I am pointing to the two bolt holes in one of the pictures in the first link in post #5 that mount the bracket to the engine).

I can attest that taking the bracket off is not fun. You will have to remove the exhaust manifold elbow on the front left of the engine just to get to the 13 mm bolts. Your fingers will beg for mercy by the time you are done. In the second link in post #5, GSXR stated that it is easier to just take out the two smaller hex head bolts that hold the pump on from behind. Once the pump is out, you can slip the 3" hose on and reinstall the pump.

Seems like a much easier way to go. Good luck.

No, no! The 3" long hose that connects the reservoir to the pump?
The part that the hose clamps to under the reservoir unscrews from the bracket. You take off the reservoir, then the nipple that the hose clamps to unscrews from the bracket (being sure to loosen the top clamp first). Then remove the lower clamp and the hose comes off. Install the new hose, with both clamps slipped on to the hose loosely. Tighten the lower clamp. The nipple then is inserted into the bracket and in to the hose, tighten the nipple, then tighten the upper clamp and reinstall the reservoir.

Gilly

Tricky German Bastards!!! Check out my attachment, pulled a service bulletin at work part numbers and all!!!

Gilly is right. If you can, please post some pictures of the job.

THANKS for finding that!
Step 10 is the SOB to do, also getting the return line back on.

My dealer wants $35 for the reservoir gasket (2g) and $60 for a meter of hose. I think I will stick with just taking the pump off to replace the hose, rather than removing the reservoir.

I called MB for the parts today and they had trouble finding the washer with that part # then I told them what it was and they found it!!! I will try to put up some pics

Removing the res is MUCH easier the pulling the pump, the gasket I got online for $3.75 same gasket as the dealer! The hose I still need to find the hose I allready bought was to small!

Thanks. I found the gasket for $2.34 on line.

I measured the reservoir line intake nipple diameter on an old ZF pump from a 400E and it is 15 mm or .59 inches in diameter.

MB sells a special hose for that, I wouldn't mess around with different hoses, get the right hose! Best bet is to try to find a dealer that has it (MB of course sells it by the meter) and buy the length you need. You might need to ask the parts guys if they can ask in the shop if they have it laying around, the place I worked just left it in a cabinet, instead of asking the parts dept for a few inches of it every time they needed to do this job.

Yeah, I think someone may have mentioned that removing the reservoir was the way to do this job.:rolleyes:
Gilly

Good idea. Asking the tech for 3" of hose would definitely save me $59 as this is what the dealer wants for a meter of it and they wont sell any less than a meter.

I apologize for skipping over your prior posts where you were trying to tell us that it was easier to remove the reservoir than to take the pump or bracket off. You are right. Thanks.

I don't have anything useful to add but this is why I am not touching my leaky pump with a ten foot pole. Sounds like a HUGE PITA. I will just keep pouring atf in there every week. I am sacrificing my 400e for the interior next spring anyway.

PS.. I thought I was going to drive it in the winter... but driving it in the rain has proved the non ASR 400E is down right dangerous in wet conditions.

Goodluck with the leak.

ashedd, I guess you realize you should only be using Type F ATF in your power steering pump, otherwise power steering fluid.

Yes I am aware of that.. I bet type F is getting in there at least half the time :)
It's an old car I bought for the interior. No worries here.

I finally changed the hose on the bottom of my reservoir today. The directions in the post above are pretty straight forward. The hardest part was getting the old hose off. It was hard and brittle and I ended up having to take it off in two pieces. The replacement hose was 15 mm ID.

You will have a lot more room to work with if you take off the plastic cover for the left distributor, the left air intake hose and the poly v-belt (to get to the hose and clamps below). I thought I had run into trouble when I got to the big hex plug/connecting pipe at the bottom of the reservoir because I didn't have an Allen that big. It turns out that a T-60 torx worked perfectly. The v-belt required an E-10 torx socket for the tensioner. The four bolts at the bottom of the reservoir require an E-8 torx socket. I unscrewed the long stud in the center of the reservoir so I had room to get a ratchet and torque wrench on the plug.

Getting the connecting pipe back into the hose was initially difficult until I realized that I could use the handle end of a 1/4 ratchet to line the hose up with the hole from the inside of the reservoir. I coated the connecting pipe and the hose with a light coat of Vaseline and it slipped right on.

The gasket at the bottom of the reservoir was in good shape and I think I could have reused it if I had to. Also, the aluminum washer under the connecting hose plug could probably have been reused as well, but since I had the new parts I went with them.

Thanks to Gilly and 88260E, it turned out to be a fairly easy job. All of it can be done in a driveway without jacking up the car. It took me about 2 hours, but almost an hour of that was wrestling with the old hose trying to get it off.

(Pictures)

More pictures.

The trick to getting the hose off for me was removing the clamps getting an old kitchen knife, and a hammer, and go at it!! You need to take care not to cut into the hose nipples underneath, it came off real easy then pulled it off with long needle nose. Over a week now no leak!!!! Today is caps and rotors day, and new plug for passanger side head light!!!!

I used a sharp screwdriver and a hammer from the hole inside the reservoir to split the hose down the center.

Mine isn't leaking yet either, but the silver bead of sealant that appears around the circumference of the original gasket in the picture below caused me to wonder if I should have done the same with the new gasket.

Possibly just had that "silver lining" on one side?
And a comment I have, is that I don't remember the hose being hard to remove, of course when I did it the cars weren't so old either :rolleyes:. What I recall was the hard part being getting that top "nipple" in to the new hose and the thread started. I tried different tricks as well.

Gilly

I remember getting the old nipple removed, then grabbing the hose from underneath with a pliers and twisting it off, again the rubber might have been more pliable then.

Gilly that's what gave me them most trouble to, getting that top nipple in the hose, took some twisting, pulling, a couple F-bombs then it was in! new caps and rotors last night!!!! Its runniing smoooth for 18yrs old is a great car

The silver bead was on both sides of the gasket, but it doesn't look like the outer circumference of the gasket ever saw any hydraulic fluid anyway.

I didn't have any Mercedes power steering fluid, so I used Ford Type F transmission fluid to refill the reservoir. Will this hurt the system? I noticed that the steering feels heavier now, but when I did the reservoir hose I also replaced the steering damper/strut which was totally shot. I don't know if the increased heaviness is the result of the new damper or the Type F fluid I used until I can make it to the dealer for the correct fluid.

Ahhh, the old standby the F-bomb, so that's why it was so hard, I never resorted to that!

I never tried different fluids since I was in a dealer setting, we had the right stuff. My impression by reading the fluid lists was that if you went out and bought the stuff they sell as actual power steering fluid that this would work. SOME older models they said ATF was OK, I got the impression that Dexron/Mercon was recommended, but the later models they wanted power steering fluid in it.

Thanks. I'm going to the dealer today to get a quart of the good stuff.

NEW LEAK AHHHHHHHHHHH, so my power steering is leaking again now from an unkown area ???? can't see where it is coming from!!!!!!!!

I hate when that happens. Did you reseal the radial shaft already?

Great photos as always, Emery... good links in post #5 as well. A few comments:

1) The OE/dealer gasket costs a fortune, p/n 129-466-01-80, current MSRP is $32.50, which is ridiculous. The only difference is that the OE/dealer gasket has a thin silicone bead silk-screened on both sides of the gasket, while the aftermarket gasket does not. But for literally 1/10 the cost, the $3 aftermarket gasket works fine - I've used them a few times with no problems.

2) The short hose is 15mm ID, p/n 006-997-09-82, current MSRP is $59 per meter, also ridiculous. It's available via aftermarket sources for ~$20 per meter. I shelled out the twenty bucks and now have a lifetime supply.

3) I don't know where the idea started that Type F ATF is correct for the p/s system, it's Dexron that is an alternative fluid. I only use the OE fluid though, p/n Q-146-0001, shown below... it's less than $8 per quart MSRP at the dealer.

4) Remove the p/s pump pulley and check the area at the bottom of the pump front shaft seal, if it's dry on top but wet with fluid at the bottom, the seal is leaking. If the whole thing is wet from the hose leaking, clean the entire pump bone dry so you can tell later on if the pump is leaking or not.

5) The other leak sources (besides the reservoir bowl gasket, short hose, and pump) are the two low-pressure rubber hoses and the gear box itself. The curved hose is easier to replace. The straight hose is a RPITA to replace. The steering gearbox tends to leak from the output (pitman arm) shaft seal; this is easy to see, and the seals can be replaced with the box still in the car, but it's messy. Do all of the above and you'll have a dry PS system with no leaks for years to come. BT, DT on both my 500's.

6) While the p/s reservoir/bowl is removed, also check the cam advance solenoids... these often leak, and you have to remove the p/s reservoir to R&R the solenoid. Might as well only do the job once instead of twice. If there is ANY liquid oil at the base of the solenoid, it's leaking. Photos are at this link.


http://www.w124performance.com/image..._fluid_OE1.jpg

:chinese2:

Good information. When I replaced the front cam seals on my 400E, I used that orange MB sealant and I remember it was $55 per tube at the time. I will look for the Locktite equivalent just to have some around. I also used it on the head bolts of a 454 and never had a problem with leaks.