190e manual drive shaft in a 260e
 

Hey everyone, I found a guy selling a 5 speed set up out of a 190e(4 cylinder) I was hoping of swapping out the auto in my w124 and putting this in.
I have read that the 4 cylinder transmission will work the the 6, but my question is drive shaft, are they the same length?
And I read that the shift linkage is shorter on the w201, but when I found the part number in a swap guide, they are 201 part numbers, are they the same?

Thanks

The drive shaft is a different length. The center spline is smaller on the W201 and the shift rods are different.

I was seeing some guys where using half one drive shaft and half the other, but if I understand what your saying the splines by the CSB are different so that isn’t possible?

Thanks for the reply

Another OM603 5 speed swap

Found this, it shows that on the w124 the 260e has a smaller spline then the 300e, my car being a 260e, would it still be the incorrect splines

The only way you'll know for sure is to test fit with the manual shaft. Its a crap shoot, whoever was designing and installing driveshafts in the Benz factory had one hell of a sense of humor...

Also you'll need to find an M103 flywheel with the 3 timing "windows", if memory serves me right, the 2.6 uses a 228mm and the 3.0 uses a 240mm.

The 4 cylinder flywheel will either have no windows, if its from an early car, or 2 windows if its from a later car. Neither will work in your car.

Ok thank you for that info, I hadn’t read that yet, I’ll start looking for flywheels

LOL that's my car. Let me know what info you need. I'll try to help out.

Hey! I tried sending a dm but I don’t know it it went though, and either way talking about it on this thread could help the next guy.

So I read though your write up a good 10 times to make sure I was understanding everything before I shell out the money today for this transmission set up, but here are my questions

-you said in the write up that the 300e drive shaft spikes where larger then the 190e, but a 260e where the same, so you used a front half of the 190e and rear of a 260e is that correct ?

-in the shift linkage you mentioned the shift linkage being 1.5 inches to short, do the threaded sections make up for this or will it have to be cut and lengthened

-what flywheel and clutch set up did you end up using

Thank you so much for your time


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes this is correct.
Yes you will have to lengthen the shift rods. Either by cutting and reweldibg an extra section in the middle or threading on more rod. You could also buy new shift rods from the dealer but make sure they are for your specific shift pattern.
I used the m103/m104 dual mass flywheel that came with my 190e 2.6 transmission. The diesel doesn't require the timing windows that the gasser needs. In your situation you will need a flywheel specific to the 6cyl. Alternatively you could weld on 3 timing windows onto the 4cyl flywheel. Also keep in mind that the transmission is specific to single mass OR dual mass flywheel. The input shaft is different for each one. Run a search on that super turbo diesel forum about flywheels and swaps. There's a lot of good info there.

Right on thank you so much for the info,
As for the rods, adding 1.5 inches is required?

190e manual drive shaft in a 260e
 

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...d72d75c1ba.jpg
Here is the flywheel I got, looks like a single mass to me(please correct me if I’m wrong)

Here is the trans
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...6780283319.jpg


Here is more pictures

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...48ee988c29.jpg
Everything seems to be pretty clean, bushings all look good, I think it was a fair deal for $800 and he had pulled it all
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...feb8167d46.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...a13b6f47d7.jpg

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk has

I think I found a 6 cylinder 190e single mass flywheel, my question next is looking for a clutch kit on rock auto, I found based off the earliest year (1987) the w124 with a M103 clutch kit is a LUK 11035 but The 190e with the M103 is LUK 11005. As well as the 4 cylinder in the same year of 190e is also LUK 11005

So my next question what would be the difference between the w201 and the w124 if it’s the same year and same engine. Did the w124 not some with a single mass?

Ok so I did some digging and found this
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...a28ef0501.jpeg
Looks like the 190e had a 26 tooth count, but the w124 is listed as a 24 tooth count, with the OD of both disc being the same. So I checked the teeth count on mine and I’m sitting at 26 so looks like the 190e.
The w124 they list must be dual mass?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Also https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...dae3bedf92.jpg
Are these the “timing windows”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes those are the timing windows. Sorry I don't know how to ID the correct clutch kit. Its been a 7 years since I did the swap. I know early cars had single mass and later switched to dual mass but I don't know the exact years. Best bet is to talk to the people on superturbodiesel forum. Theres a few guys on there that know this stuff really well.

I think I have an idea to make the flywheel I got work, it’s odd that all the used flywheels I find (almost all w201) don’t have any timing Windows.
My plan is to pick up a w124 flex plate, line up all the crank bolt holes and bolt them together, mark the flywheel, measure the distance between the teeth of the flex plate and the top of the windows, and cut the windows off the donorflex plate and weld them on to the flywheel since is doesn’t have any windows on it currently.
On BMWs if this era they had similar spots on the flywheel, they were just smaller, I had one come off on a gray market e21, I was able to find where it went, drill and tap the hole and with red locktite put a bolt in its place all while the whole car was still together and it ran perfect after.

190e manual drive shaft in a 260e
 

Just wanted to update this

So I had great success with the swap, I can confirm that the front 190E driveshaft slid in to the rear 260e shaft and was the perfect length.

I ended up buying a new flywheel from Mercedes, but I ordered the 9.5” accidentally, I would recommend anyone else doing this swap to get the 9” or 8.5”, as LUK Sachs and others make clutch kits for them, I was stuck since one made a clutch kit for the 9.5 anymore so I had to get it from the dealer as well($550)

For the shift rods I cut them on the flattest spot, threaded the rods, and got threaded sleeves and lock nuts, then I was able to get them to the correct length and take them to a buddy to have them welded, with the bushing side still adjustable for fine tuning
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...ebc79ab470.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...afb5591288.jpg


Getting the exhaust out was a pain, I had to remove the manifolds from the down pipe, the down pipe section from the rear mufflers, and remove the large 22mm bolt that goes to the steering right under the manifolds

Mercedes and BMW use the same size exhaust studs, so I was able to get nice copper nuts with a shoulder from my local import parts store(VW uses the same size, but don’t have the shoulder so it’s a good upgrade for them so it’s was a common part in stock)

I was able to get new flywheels bolts from the dealer next day for decently cheap, finding the torque spec on anything was kinda a pain, but I was able to find this

The final drive ratio from my auto to the early 190E manual transmission was surprisingly really nice together, the last manual swap I did in a BMW e34 was not such. High way driving is very pleasant and from a stop it moves a lot faster then the auto

Wiring the neutral safety switch was easy, finding the plug that would fit in the reverse light switch on the shifter wasn’t, I ended up just using just the pins from another female connector(the seat adjustment pigtail) and removed the housing but after that very little wire had to be added


Plumbing the clutch was really easy, all the 190E bent lines fit in the groves under the carpet nicely

Early 190E pedals(and possibly all) had a different brake light switch that takes a different connector and it was so bad on the donor parts that it had to be replaced but w124 wouldn’t fit, I ended up using a BMW e28 as it’s a simple 2 spade connector and same diameter as the holding hole.

For a shift boot I hoped the w201 would fit but it didn’t, unable time find a w124 boot I searched the junk yard with the center section of a wrecked w124, I found a boot off a roughly 2002 Subaru Outback, it was pretty damn near the correct size, I stretched it over the auto shifter trim ring, added some rivets and it worked great, and new ones are plentiful
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...d62ad1a0d5.jpg

The transmission crossmember is cheap and I got it here off pelican parts, I wouldn’t waste your time trying to build one when a Mercedes one can be had for $35.
This part bolts up a lot closer to the front of the car then the auto one, two bolt holes line but, the other two are there, but have been filled with plastic plugs, remove these and you’ll see a threaded holes under and the crossmemeber bolts up perfectly

The flex discs from a 190e to a w124 are different, so when I ordered 2 new ones for the w124 I couldn’t use one, so I am running a 190e disc transmission side and a w124 diff side

The w124 Speedo cable reaches just fine and works perfect with the manual

If you are unable to find a curtain 2 gears, your linkage is either to short or too long, there is a grove in the bottom of the shifter assembly as well as holes in the arms coming down, you can push an Allen though all these and the shifter is in neutral, put the trans in neutral and the rods, if correct length, will slip on both sides, if not, adjust accordingly. I was surprised to find that neutral doesn’t have any side to side play like most cars, but with the rods adjusted right, the shifter feels great and tight

Pressure plate bolts I was unable to find new so I got them from a hardware store and those with combination some lock washers to keep them tight it worked great

You will need a pilot bearing, the autos don’t use them, and the kits didn’t come with them, funny enough that was east to get because it’s the same part number for a VW so a FAG bearing was cheap and easy to find

There is a nipple off the brake master cylinder that is just capped off on auto cars, cut this and get the cloth braided rubber line to run it to the clutch master, also it is the same size for BMW and other German cars so finding this hose by the foot was easy and cheap so don’t cut pennies here

Apparently Sachs owns FTE, so when I bought a nice Sachs master, I was a little taken back when the part in the unopened box was a FTE, so if you see both options, go for the cheaper as the seem to be the same, your just paying for a box

Ordering parts from Mercedes with out a vin can be done online from places like MBpartslive and others, the emailed me after the order asking for a vin, I told them that it was for a swap and didn’t have a proper vin, they where fine with that answer

I have list of all the part numbers for everything I used Incase anyone needs them or if you have any questions about this swap I would be more then happy to help.

Sorry for any spelling errors in all this, I’m half asleep and just thought I would share things I found


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Nice work.

Congrats!!!


Two things:

The correct harness plug for the reverse light switch can be found on the air temp sensor in the domelight. Grab one from the JY when you get a chance if you're so inclined.

The Sachs kit for the 9.5" clutch can be found for about $300 if you're persistent, but none in US, will have to be sourced from Europe.

Thanks I’ll be heading to the yard here soon!

And damn I wish I would have known, I found the Sachs number but couldn’t source it online


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

nicely done!

I’m looking for the 9.5 clutch kit do you have any links ?

I got my 9.5" clutch kit here: https://onlinecarparts.co.uk/

Lots of back and forth to confirm correct kit.

How much did you pay ? And thanks for the link