Possible engine swaps for my 1971 280SE

[Shadesh]

Originally Posted by bwostosh

Shades, I will go take a thickness measurement, and some photos of the one head I have not on a motor. (I do have three good ones
on running cars).

I am surprised at the lack of good used heads,
To those following this thread, how about the M127 (220SE) motors, I would like to sell three of those

Brian - Thanks.

[Shadesh]

This is going to be a silly question but is an M110 a Mercedes 280E ? I am new to the Mercedes experience and get confused with these numbers.. I think mine is a M130 for a 1971 280SE. I may start pricing a M110 for parts but not sure what I am searching for? Is it a mercedes 280E from the 80s with a straight six??

Brian - did you get a chance to check the cylinder head you mentioned? Do let me know what you find, please. Thanks.

[JeffreyNMemphis]

The M110 is a double overhead cam 2.8 liter straight six cylinder hemi engine that was used in the 1973 to 1981? 280 cars. 280 E would have the M110 that is fuel injected, which may be more complicated an engine swap than the M110 with a carburetor.

Of course, the ideal and easiest engine swap would be the M130 which would not require any fabrication or modification to make it work.

If you can't find an M130, pick the motor with the least modification or fabrication necessary. What other motors are available that were native to the W108 Chassis? Perhaps you might even want to do the M117 which is the 4.5 liter V8 in the 1972-73?

[mercmad6.3]

The M110 will bolt in anywhere an early six will go. The basic engine from 1951 to 1985 in it's various options use the same basic cylinder block design. it may look different at a quick glance but when it is realised that the mounts are all the same palce (except on the 1951-1958 version which have front mounts) it will be realized that the engine can be lift with it's trans from a late W123 280 /280E, W126 280S 280SE/SEL ..W107 280SL/SLC and dropped straight into a W108 and bolted up using the existing wiring and fuel connections ,plus the radiator hoses line up.
If you have a W108 with oil cooler mounted on the radiator that can be used if the M110 has come with the same .
M110's came with several different exhaust manifolds so a custom front pipe set will often be needed but that is never a problem.

To illustrate how simple this swap is ,to install a M110 into a 1955 Ponton(W180) you can modify the oil pump pick up on the M110 and BOLT on the alloy sump of the original M180 engine to give sump clearance .Bolt the pontons front mounts to the block and fit the pontons flywheel to the M110 crank so the original trans and clutch etc can be used.
I have seen at least two of these and one more is in the works.

I always recommend using the injected motor because [i] the system is very simple,[ii] the injected motors are more powerful [iii] the carburetor engines are low power units with poor carburetors which are very unreliable [iv] the injected engines only require a pump by the tank utilizing the existing fuel lines and the ignition system is of the pointless type giving great reliability.[v] the injected engines are generally in better condition because the fuel wash down in carburetor engines leads to rapid engine wear .
The best option is to always get the engine and trans as a complete unit,that way you get a matched set up which bolts in. if you have a later W108 the trans inhibitor switch plugs together.
Some flex discs on thew trans are smaller but generally they are the same size.

Finally the early 280SE engine suffers when the head gets corroded. Heads haven't been available for years and second hand ones are very few and far between.

[peet230e]

Well a twin turbo M100 6.9 with 600bhp will fit and i happen to have one sitting in my garage.

[mercmad6.3]

Well isn't that interesting?. Do you happen to live in Sydney NSW ?
Because that is where Franz took that photo of the W100 (600Grosse) that he installed that engine into.
here is a real one ...


This Phil O'brians Single Turbo 6.9..

The 6.9 world is very small ,those that have honestly worked them over tend to talk to each other..

[peet230e]

Never said the engine in the pic is mine, pic was to illustrate that the engine would fit in a w108

[tonkovich]

Originally Posted by peet230e

Never said the engine in the pic is mine, pic was to illustrate that the engine would fit in a w108

methinks car go very fast then ... but not handle so good

but i like the idea anyway.

[Stumps]

Hi Mercmad, How does that beast go for cooling?

[mercmad6.3]

Franz's twin turbo engine is in a a 600 not a W108 if you look closer.
Plenty of room in a car that was designed to house the M100 engine originally
And to make a finer point,the 600 is car that was designed to be big and fast and anyone who has driven one will tell you that they drive just like a sports car . More power means it will go harder and still handle like a car 1/4 of it's size.

here is a W111 (same floor pan as W108) with a 6.9 to show that "yes" they do fit.
http://bringatrailer.com/2008/04/13/405-lb-ft-69l-transplant-1968-mercedes-coupe/

The single turbo engine runs just like a factory built car. It was built in 1978 at a cost of $50,000. And that didn't include the brand new 6.9 either!. it's been owned by some well known mercedes enthusiasts but it took Phil to get it restored and running again after it had been parked away for many years unused.

[Shadesh]

Thanks for all the input. I think I will also start looking for an 80's 280e and just swap out the whole system (engine/tranny etc) if I am not able to locate a replacement cylinder head.

[zabenz350se]

Hi, my 72 108 280SE has a rather tired engine with bottom end blow-by, I was thinking of chucking it out and replacing it with a perfect 3.5 V8 and auto transmission that I have sitting in an early 350SE W116. What must all be replaced in the 108? E.G engine mountings,radiator, diff etc ?
Thanks

[bwostosh]

Guys with 280SE's M130 motors,
I have three M130 motors, reman, rebuilt, and spare.
These are in good complete cars, available. (not cheap though)
The rebuild cost was $$$, right down to the new injectors.
Think about the cost of redoing your motors, vs a whole car.
Shades, I can't even price the head I have.

[mercmad6.3]

Originally Posted by zabenz350se

Hi, my 72 108 280SE has a rather tired engine with bottom end blow-by, I was thinking of chucking it out and replacing it with a perfect 3.5 V8 and auto transmission that I have sitting in an early 350SE W116. What must all be replaced in the 108? E.G engine mountings,radiator, diff etc ?
Thanks

It's simple to drop your 3.5 and trans straight in using W108 3.5 engine mount arms and new rubber mounts. Your 3.5 has Djet injection so you need to install the complete injection wiring loom and pump from the W116 .Ignition and alternator circuit can be reused. W108 radiator is fine and diff may be a bit low so look around for W108 4.5 diff.
All bolt in .you will then have a 280SE 3.5

[Shadesh]

Can I drop the double cam engine from a 1977 280SE (straight six) into mine without modifying engine mounts? Will other mods be necessary? I just saw a car for sale and thought this may be an option too.

A 1977 280SE is considered a W116?