Oil Leak 250 S Mercedes

[aluminum]

Hello I have a 108 6 cylinder that i have fixed all the Oil leaks except 1
This Leak seems to be coming from behind the distributor onto a Small flat Area where the Distributor inserts Into the Block.
Suspect is the (1) Head Gasket and (2) the Distributor itself
( The Valve Cover Gasket is sealed to the Cylinder Head and Not leaking ! )
The car does not seem to burn Oil or smoke and has perfect Evan Compression.
However I Have heard their is a Oil Passage toward the front through the Head Gasket but not sure of this ? . Is their a Oil Passage under oil Pressure ? that might leak out behind the Distributor from a Failed Head Gasket ?

About the Distributor I see a Recess Grove where the Distributor inserts /mounts into the block . Should there be a Gasket or seal their ? to prevent Oil from Leaking out around the base of the Distributor ? Are their any Gaskets or seals related to the Distributor Mounting to the Engine Block at all that might leak Oil ?
Thanks As I am Hesitant To remove the Cylinder Head as No One sees to sell a Head Gasket for the 250 S Motor any more ? That's another question ?
where can You Get a Head Gasket ? not from Pelican they don't have .

Thanks in advance for any Tip's Leads

[rumb]

There is no gasket/oring for where the dist tube goes in the block. It seems odd that oil would come up that far to leak there. Are you sure the oil isnt just migrating from the front of the engine to that area? You could apply a small amount of RTV sealant at the top of tube if you are sure that is where it is coming from.

Make sure the @1/2" thick washer is installed under the tube for the hold down bolt.

The recess area in the block where the tube goes it looks like in the picture that there is metal scraped off on the left side of the hole.

I have also seen that head gaskets are rare these day.

I had a 250s block that had a pin hole flaw thru the casting that leaked oil.

A thorough engine de greasing and then look for leaks should help you find where the oil is coming from.

[aluminum]

I was you hoping you Might see my Post:thanks
So ? I was afraid of that: " No O Ring or Gasket " around the Main Tube of the Distributor.
As to the Distributor Hold Down Tube ( one bolt go's through it )
Their is 1 Flat Washer that was on top of the Hold down Tube under the hold down Allen Key Bolt .

Perhaps I don't understand ? is no Way you could place a 1/2 " thick washer "underneath" the hold down Tube ? the Distributor would never reach the Drive cog and not turn so car would not run .
( The Distributor Hold down Bolt was Very Wet and Oily I noted so I put a small amount of permatex under the Tube and the hold down washer . As well I added a flat washer Under the hold down tube also with dab of permatex

This Car was a basket Case I got going . Had lots of Oil Leaks and I fixed them all but this one so far .Is no Oil leak in front of the engine . The Front Crankshaft seal was leaking , replaced that . The timing tensioner Cap was loose and Oil just poured out from that on the Intake Man side toward the front , simply turned it in leak stopped.

This Leak is hard to see because its behind the distributor . Comes Out upon the flat Area of the Block next to the Hold down tube .
I Pressure wash each time I look for it . To make it leak you must drive the Car about 10 Miles . Driving longer Oil is slung back 1.5 feet along the block
from the Fan and wind and downward to the Oil Pan.

Its coming from One of 2 places (1) out the head Gasket or (2) out the distributor ? ( The valve Cover gasket to make sure I glued it down to the head something I would normally not do.)

Added Photos that show the Hold Down Bolt & washer and as well a shot of the Distributor installed before removal and the Flat Area where I Think the Oil is coming from.
Strange thing is that when I rev the motor after cleaning it all off I don't see the leak yet ? Perhaps I must rev it longer and wait longer humm

Question: ? Is their a Oil Pressure Port in the Head Gasket in that area of the head Gasket ?
I have read something about the Ball studs Leaking oil ? not sure about what's that's about
Also I see the " Scraped off metal " you mentioned on one side of the main distributor port into the metal
Not sure what's that's about well investigate it when I pull the Dist. out again .

Humm the mystery Leak lol Thanks for reply

[rumb]

Without the thick washer you could be distorting the tube. The washer is avail here:
https://expedition-imports.com/1211580051
Look at the picture to see where it goes. #314.
If that washer has been gone for a long time it may have damaged the tube/hole just enough to leak. As mentioned you could put a small bit of sealer at the top of tube.

There should be an oring on the actual dist shaft that then goes into the tube. You can just find one at the hardware store that fits.

Of course it is always possible to have a small leak from the head gasket. not worth replacing just for that. Sometimes we have to put up with our old cars leaking a bit. Im getting old and leak a bit sometimes.. again you could clean off the head gasket area with brake cleaner and then apply a small bead of RTV sealer there.

PS the ball studs leaking you would see above each spark plug area in the casting. You would have to look upside down to see it and it would be obvious. Very rare.

[aluminum]

Hello
I see the Spacer washer and expedition imports is close to me somewhat I can stop by on my next Medical trip to San Francisco for the wife .
Great News Rumb to see this information ! . So there is a Rubber O Ring at least on some Distributors . As you can see on My Photos is no Machined Groove for a Oil Seal to sit in however I expect I could just place a Seal tight fitting upon the Dist Main Tube . It Most likely well swell up and become loose from Heat and Oil humm
.On the other hand Perhaps the seal is made to Go in the " Recess Groove " where the Dist, stops going downward.
Partial Update : )
Upon reassembly I placed a Thick right size Rubber Band about the main Dist Tube right where the Dist. hits the Engine Block.
Upon a Brief somewhat aggressive rev wise Road test about 3 Miles I see a Vastly reduced amount of Oil Leakage .
I shall drive the Car tomorrow some 25 / 30 Miles and see if this is indeed a Change or not but I am quite sure I see a change and a significant change but the leak has been plaguing me and I want to make sure .
You right about Leaks I know about that and wish I had more dreams about the Bloom of Youth lol .
Upon retesting I shall pull the Dist and get a Photo of the Number plate on it.
I now upon seeing this spacer washer that I most likely have a problem .
I see how deep the "Notch's " are where the Dist engages the Drive when inserted . I noted that the Drive tits that engage the Drive upon looking inside the main Dist tube Look Buggered Up or damaged perhaps as if they were inserted to far ? . I may need a New Drive or Dist to resolve humm . I did not see any metal Grindings most likely washed down.
now why did I not get a spare Dist on that last salvage Yard where I found a 108 I think was a 66 or 68 .I did grab the Carbs tho and all the Good trim and more I have discovered I can talk most Pick n Pull or the like into charging me for (1) 4 Barrel Carb ( $50 )rather then (2) 2 Barrel Carbs($45 each so $90 ) Sometimes I just start walking away and they call me back but you have to make sure their is not a line behind you lol .
RUMB I have just figured out the Oil Leak I think . The Scrape Mark on the first Photo tells a story now with your great help. When you double click enlarging first photo showing the Block & Distributor hole as you noticed shows the Scrape Mark and I think that's where the Oil Leak is. As well a Rubber O Ring Seal should stop the leak.
However Now the distributor may not work with the Spacer washer installed due to possible Damage

[aluminum]

Received today from my Email to ElringKlinger
As I understand it they " Are / Where / the supplier for the head Gaskets used on my 1967 Mercedes 250 S . I believe this is the one Pelican sells or did sell?
*****
I offer this Email related to my Quest to find the Leakage problem on my car
was thinking May need a Head Gasket so wrote to them as Pelican is out of stock .
RECEIVED TODAY :

Obradovic, Branimir
6:52 AM (1 hour ago)
to me

Hello again,

We do not produce this gasket in our normal production.
Maybe some dealers in the world have old stock from this gasket.

I offer to you an handmade gasket from our prototyping department not a normal production gasket.

You will see, after the dealers sell the last gasket, nobody can buy this gasket for this price. You will find then only our handmade gasket from our prototyping department.

Best regards
Branimir Obradovic

ElringKlinger AG
Sales Manager Special Applications
IAM Western Europe & Germany
Fon +49 7123 724 621
Fax +49 7123 724 85 621
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----

Gesendet: Mittwoch, 28. Oktober 2020 16:27
An: Obradovic, Branimir
Betreff: Re: Do you no longer make this head gasket ?

[rumb]

Wow that is bad news. At least they are willing to take your money to make one....

[aluminum]

Originally Posted by rumb

Wow that is bad news. At least they are willing to take your money to make one....

Hi Rumb : RE HEAD GASKETS 108 250S Mercedes
Yes and they want me to order a Min of 3 lol at a huge price 186,25€ in dollars = $219.82 EACH not for all 3
So I guess the Idea of going to a new way to make the gasket is to charge more money lol Is life about Money then ? $$$
kind of Like Old money out New Money in Yes ?
Heck it's got perfect Compression But no doubt could use a rebuild at some point so I would Like to Re Ring /New Bearing / Valve seals for the motor at some point
seems simple if the Pan come off not sure on that (without pulling the motor)
Sounds like a daunting task to most But to me is a simple job been their done that so many times . To Jack up the motor to pull the pan is a pain however.
************** 1967 250S **********
So beyond that it turns out the Tit's on the bottom of the 67" Distributor " have some wear and tear on them so that they don't go all the way into the gear drive Slot . And "that's why I expect it had no washer Spacer that sits between the Distributor " tube and the Motor
That Spacer washer its about 1/8 " in height BTW (The missing spacer was removed so the " Distributor " would drop down and still work sort of a Half assed way " it seems I think "on the now removed 67 Cast Iron Distributor.
I discovered all this when it failed finally just the other day and I had to tow it
As such I took a 1970 250 all aluminum body " Distributor " that has a Much better Tube set up all 1 piece rather then 2 and converted it to a 67 type Distributor "inside". I installed the 67 point plate ( early 67 type with pole to hold the points ) This way I could use the 67 Vacuum advance rather then the
Advance< >Retard 1970 type on the 1970 Dist " As well I swapped in the 67 Advance Weights of course as they have more weight on them being set up Different then a Adv Ret Type Dist rather then a straight advance only type Dist.
This Area I living at is at Sea Level and the Car now runs perfect @ 12 % Adv at Slow Idle. Setting it a bit retarded it stumbles during moderate acceleration . I might try 10% degrees perhaps but has zero Spark Knock now and smooth running through the RPM Range . Timing Chain seems Tight and looks good
But whether the Cam timing is correct I don't know

I bought the 1970 Dist at Pick and Pull for $28 and made sure to get the Spacer Washer for the Tube to become elevated so as not to ruin the Dist and perhaps the Gear in the motor .
Car was complete upon my arrival but the Ebay Scavengers arrived mid morning so good thing I got their early . They Pull all the hi Dollar stuff and sell it on Ebay ( if you want a Lot of stuff from the Car some hot words may exchange believe me .) I watched as the Cluster / Consul / radio /Rear Bumper / Tail lights /headlight rims all that sort of stuff vanish heading to Ebay Interesting enough was the fact no one pulled the Dual Carbs (they look great I grabbed those Rubber Gaskets the fit between the Carbs and the Air Cleaner as well as a Bunch of inside trim Parts I know are always needed In case I buy another one .
was a 1970 114 Benz
At your suggestion I applied a Thin Bead of Gray RTV along the Edge of the Head gasket just behind the Area of the Dist between the Head and Block.
The Oil leak is Very little now so far . I may apply a bit more after a better evaluation . Thank You for your Help rumb
As well anyone who want to contact Branimir his info is below


Obradovic, Branimir
Attachments
Wed, Oct 28, 7:50 AM
to me.

Hello,

Thanks for your mail.

If you want this gasket, we can produce it.
Delivery time after order: 8 - 10 weeks
Price: 186,25€/each
Minimum quantity: 3 pcs.

If you have questions, please contact me.

Best regards
Branimir Obradovic

ElringKlinger AG
Sales Manager Special Applications
IAM Western Europe & Germany

Fon +49 7123 724 621
Fax +49 7123 724 85 621

[aluminum]

Originally Posted by rumb

Wow that is bad news. At least they are willing to take your money to make one....

Hi Rumb : RE HEAD GASKETS 108 250S Mercedes
Yes and they want me to order a Min of 3 lol at a huge price 186,25€ in dollars = $219.82 EACH not for all 3
So I guess the Idea of going to a new way to make the gasket is to charge more money lol Is life about Money then ? $$$
kind of Like Old money out New Money in Yes ?
Heck it's got perfect Compression But no doubt could use a rebuild at some point so I would Like to Re Ring /New Bearing / Valve seals for the motor at some point
seems simple if the Pan come off not sure on that (without pulling the motor)
Sounds like a daunting task to most But to me is a simple job been their done that so many times . To Jack up the motor to pull the pan is a pain however.
************** 1967 250S **********
So beyond that it turns out the Tit's on the bottom of the 67" Distributor " have some wear and tear on them so that they don't go all the way into the gear drive Slot . And "that's why I expect it had no washer Spacer that sits between the Distributor " tube and the Motor
That Spacer washer its about 1/8 " in height BTW (The missing spacer was removed so the " Distributor " would drop down and still work sort of a Half assed way " it seems I think "on the now removed 67 Cast Iron Distributor.
I discovered all this when it failed finally just the other day and I had to tow it
As such I took a 1970 250 all aluminum body " Distributor " that has a Much better Tube set up all 1 piece rather then 2 and converted it to a 67 type Distributor "inside". I installed the 67 point plate ( early 67 type with pole to hold the points ) This way I could use the 67 Vacuum advance rather then the
Advance< >Retard 1970 type on the 1970 Dist " As well I swapped in the 67 Advance Weights of course as they have more weight on them being set up Different then a Adv Ret Type Dist rather then a straight advance only type Dist.
This Area I living at is at Sea Level and the Car now runs perfect @ 12 % Adv at Slow Idle. Setting it a bit retarded it stumbles during acceleration . I might try 10% degrees perhaps but has zero Spark Knock now and smooth running through the RPM Range . Timing Chain seems Tight and looks good
But whether the Cam timing is correct I don't know

I bought the 1970 Dist at Pick and Pull for $28 and made sure to get the Spacer Washer for the Tube to become elevated so as not to ruin the Dist and perhaps the Gear in the motor .
Car was complete upon my arrival but the Ebay Scavengers arrived mid morning so good thing I got their early . They Pull all the hi Dollar stuff and sell it on Ebay ( if you want a Lot of stuff from the Car some hot words may exchange believe me .) I watched the Cluster / Consul / radio /Rear Bumper / Tail lights /headlight rims all that sort of stuff vanish heading to Ebay
was a 1970 114 Benz
At your suggestion I applied a Thin Bead of Gray RTV along the Edge of the Head gasket just behind the Area of the Dist between the Head and Block.
The Oil leak is Very little now so far . I may apply a bit more after a better evaluation . Thank You for your Help rumb
As well anyone who want to contact Branimir his info is below




Obradovic, Branimir branimir.obradovic@elringklinger.com
Attachments
Wed, Oct 28, 7:50 AM
to me.

Hello,

Thanks for your mail.

If you want this gasket, we can produce it.
Delivery time after order: 8 - 10 weeks
Price: 186,25€/each
Minimum quantity: 3 pcs.

If you have questions, please contact me.

Best regards
Branimir Obradovic

ElringKlinger AG
Sales Manager Special Applications
IAM Western Europe & Germany

Fon +49 7123 724 621
Fax +49 7123 724 85 621

[cth350]

Nice work. -CTH