WVO boost pump? What should I use??? - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Jmana · #16 08-22-2006, 10:57 PM

One other thing, you must be using really bad veggie if you get an emulsion when you mix it with dieselkleen. I use that stuff in the winter, and it works great to keep the oil liquid. I have never seen any indication of an emulsion

jshadows · #17 08-22-2006, 11:34 PM

just straight french fry oil (peanut oil). Not an emulsion per se, but certainly immiscible liquids last time I tried.

Blevinsax · #18 08-23-2006, 02:56 PM

First off - this icon is a 'thumbs up' sign, right???? If not, that's what I thought it was when I chose it!

Alright - I just took the 350SD out for another spin to see if the WVO switch would work. Well, it sure did work - I just had to hit the throttle a little as I made the switch. When the WVO started flowing, the car ran very smooth with very little smoke (if any at all) and seemed to be generally very happy.

My only concern is - will it work like this all the time??? I know GreaseCar sells an auxilliary lift pump to help the stock lift pump, but it costs $100+s/h so I would like to avoid it if possible. The folks at GreaseCar said they think it may still be another problem with the installation, so I will make sure everything else is set up properly before I jump into the aux pump thing.

As far as the quality of GreaseCar products - I have been very happy with the system in my VW, but the fuel gauge that was included with the kit for my Mercedes was defective. I sent an email to GreaseCar and they responded that another gauge would arrive in 3 days, so I think that's pretty good service. They have also been very helpful with my fuel flow problem, so I don't really have any complaints. I understand that this system is still somewhat expermental and I know that every car is slightly different, especially when we're talking about installing these things on 15-year-old cars with 200k miles and more. In other words, I haven't lost my patience yet! The payoff is still driving past every gas station thumbing my nose at the poor saps pouring their hard-earned dollars into their tanks at the rate of $3.27/gallon!

GVB · #19 08-23-2006, 05:09 PM

I have not been posting on this for a while, but here is my two cents.
Our shop does WVO conversions and if you don't have a fuel pump to pump the VO, you will end up having to replace the vacuum pump on the injection pump. We recommend using a carburetor 5-9 psi 12 V pump. Hook it to a 20 Amp stock Benz relay. I would not recommend looping the return line, you will have a problem with air, and at some point will end up having to purge the lines manually, it's not hard, but it is a pain in the butt. Use separate feed and return lines for your veggie tank.
If anyone is really serious about having any diesel converted, you should contact me. I have developed a user friendly system, it does not require you to install anything in the "cockpit", meaning cut your dash or install bells and whistles when to manually switch to and purge the veggie oil. My system is 100% automatic, it even purges the lines for you and purge time can adjusted for warmer or cooler temps. You even use your existing fuel gauge. If anyone is interested, you can email me at GregBeanAuto@aol.com. I usually return email within a few days.

bgkast · #20 08-23-2006, 05:45 PM

I have heard that people have had good luck using a low pressure facet fuel pump near the tank to help push the oil along to the Lift pump. I have one that I did not end up using if you are interested.

Jmana · #21 08-23-2006, 06:55 PM

The problem with the Facet pumps, is that they burn out after a while, especially if your oil isn't the cleanest. I don't know why you think the stock lift pump will die without a boost pump, I never had a boost pump and never had problems with the stock pump. I think the best solution is to keep both supply and return lines, but to tee into both, then connect the two together with an additional hose. Even if you do get air in the line, all you'd have to do to get it out is to clamp off this additional line temporarily.

Blevinsax · #22 08-23-2006, 09:30 PM

I got another email from the folks at GreaseCar today and they have been very helpful in getting my system going. I need to make sure that my system is installed with the stock lift pump pulling BOTH diesel and WVO - not just diesel. If it is installed that way, it would mean that the IP pump is the only pump pulling the WVO, and it is not strong enough to do that, AND it could ultimately damage the pump if that is in fact how it is set up. I'll confirm that with my mechanic this week - in the meantime, I did have a successful run with the car today! I started it up on diesel and after a little bit of driving to warm up the WVO, I hit that switch over to WVO. At the same time I hit the throttle and after a brief blip the motor took off and ran beautifully on 100% WVO!! Hurray!!!

Now I just have to confirm that my GreaseCar system is in fact installed properly - then get my EGR disabled/removed (Thanks Brian!!) and intake manifold cleaned out - then get this overheating issue resolved - then get the rough idle issue resolved - then get my new kick-a$$ stereo installed - and I'll be happy as a clam!!!

Wish me luck!!!!

jshadows · #23 08-23-2006, 10:36 PM

Let me know what you find out. Mine is plumbed such that oil is off of IP pull only and not on fuel pump. Has run fine for the last 2000 miles but seems a bit quirky lately. Runs fine on diesel

Blevinsax · #24 08-24-2006, 12:31 AM

Hi Bob-

I'll let you know what I find out - the folks at GreaseCar said it is important that the WVO be pulled by the lift pump AND THEN the IP pump, otherwise you risk damage to the IP pump in the long run. Mine also runs fine on diesel, too - just not a ssmooth as it does when it is running on WVO! Amazing stuff, huh?!?!?

jshadows · #25 08-24-2006, 01:35 AM

Veggie makes a world of difference though I've got mine tuned such that it runs almost as smooth on diesel as it does on WVO.

My TD will not get a conversion. I'm going strictly bioD on it because the tank in the main compartment is too tricky to set up. Would need to be insulated (or use external heating before going up to engin), and I already have a working reactor..etc. Just easier for me with this particular ride, no statement on running WVO. Still will swear by it.

IndianaJo · #26 08-24-2006, 01:58 AM

Okay, nobody has done booster pump wars like me except the pro converters. Here's what I know.
There are 12v reciprocating pumps that suck on a rubber hose and push to a rubber hose. I have seen a AC EP 12S run motor oil abrasive flurry for a couple of years, but they don't make those anymore. AC pumps were designed to suck air.
The NAPA pump I bought was made by carter div. of Federal Mogul, It was designed to be cooled by the gasoline, I surmise, because I went through 3 of them in a month, the coil would burn out when the line was dry. I use them to prime gas out of the tank to the engine pump, and sucking air, the carter ones burn up. NAPA finally bought me an AirTex from another warehouse to get me out of the store. I don't have the Airtex number, but cross to an AC EP12S. I allegedly bought an Airtex from CarQuest jobber, number 8012S, but I have never installed that one and it doesn't say airtex on the box, so I don't know if it is the same. This is a 5PSI pump.
There is a rotary vane intank 12 VDC pump at 7 PSI made for the 76? Pinto or Thunderbird with turbocharged 4 cyl. I found it at NAPA by thumbing through the book. Normal in tank pumps run to 45 PSI and would not probably be good slamming fuel into a diesel injector pump. I had good luck with the carter rotary from NAPA, but that tank finally rotted out and I abandoned it. If your fuel is not squeaky clean, prefilter with a GoldenRod 495 filter sold at the TSC farm store for tractor fuel. They are 1 QT and should separate out a lot of trash before clogging up. Mine would trap 2" of tank rust before I drained it, no problem.

Blevinsax · #27 08-25-2006, 02:02 AM

Well, I got the 350SD running on WVO yesterday by hitting the throttle when I switched over to WVO from diesel! It blipped a little, then continued to run beautifully. I took it out for a highway run - speeds up to about 95mph - for about 20-25 miles, and brought it back home. Tonight I started it up to drive to a gig (didn't run the A/C because of a separate cooling issue - will be resolved soon) and although I didn't attempt to run on WVO because I couldn't afford to futz with it and be late to the gig, it ran significantly better than usual on B20! Very smooth, lots of power, and virtually no shake at idle! I was so happy!!

I just hope it stays that way!! Once I confirm that the GreaseCar system is plumbed properly and determine if I do in fact need a boost pump for the WVO, then I should be able to run on WVO regularly!

So, wish me luck! I'll update when the issues are resolved!

pdrayton · #28 10-11-2006, 09:05 AM

BlevinSax - did you find out anything about the lift pump?

I have a 240D that has started stuttering at high throttle and I'm thinking it is lack of fuel supply. I want to put a pump on the line, but am not sure which one to get. Any ideas?

diametricalbenz · #29 12-04-2006, 02:21 AM

Has anyone tried these Purolator/Facet pumps? Good or bad experiences?
I am considering using this between the hard metal fuel line in the engine bay and the clear filter to help assist the flow of the oil and flush the air out when filter changes are done.

How much pressure would be necessary to help assist the WVO thinned with 10-20% RUG? Would 7-9 PSI be too much?

http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product?storeId=10101&Pr=p_Product.CATENTRY_ID%3A2005671&productId=2005671&catalogId=10101

pdrayton · #30 12-04-2006, 07:39 AM

I've read that those pumps fail after a short time. I might be confusing them with another brand, but I don't think so. Have a search in the forum, or have alook at the SVO/WVO links thread in the forum.

If you do find something that works well, please let me know. I gave up on finding something becuae my problems went away.

Why so much RUG? I heard it's not good to put so much in. I put 15% kerosene and 5%RUG in cold weather. My problem is I get a fine white powder that clogs my feul filter after a few 1000 miles. I filter to 1 um so I am confounded.

Anyway, now back to the studio....